List of the Lost - discussion thread (spoilers)

[Anonymous]

What links does Tina have with the RAF? Why are we discussing HER again?

I'm not discussing anything really.

Any writer must know that they can't control what images the readers will see when they read them. The brain uses whatever info it's been previously supplied with.
We've been told Tina is a very patient lady. I don't know many women who would have the patience to put up with such nonsensical attempted sex. Do you?
It's like watching Justin dry-humping David Cameron in "Bad Teacher". Except there's not even a pig around to make things interesting. It's just...ridiculous. Books shouldn't be ridiculous. I think.

Morrissey must have had some reason to write his List of the Lust. If he wants to tell the world he wants to pound his mother, or someone less than his mother, fine, if he wants to share his views about how females work, fine, I'm sure there will be people to follow his literary circumvolutions and find them riveting. Sadly it would require a patience I no longer have. Literature with Morrissey, sex with Morrissey, it all looks to me like a complete waste of time.
I'm sure there will be plenty of men to disagree, and that's fine, really he already knows that's the way it should be. They're the target audience of his javelin (or whatever he calls it).

As far as demons are concerned, well, I don't spit on satanic rituals now and then...I'm not adverse to babies occasionally boiling in big cauldrons, and doormats made of woven fans' hair, I do have curiosities as anybody else. But if he wanted our interest he shouldn't have shown us his Demon, because now I just can't take him seriously. Can you picture a coven in Switzerland? Nope. Boz Boorer as a bruja de Zagarramurdi?
Almost, but that's not the point.

If only his art imitated life, or even created it, I wouldn't be so bored. But it's just constantly nagging behind like a blubbering child. It pretends to know things it doesn't, and which can only be found outside books. That book isn't going to teach me.
The Guardian warned us not be sullied by this. Well, I'm of the opinion that as a mature reader you can choose to be sullied... but only by someone who acts like he's old enough to wipe his own bottom, and knows what he is doing, and wants what he's doing, even if what he's doing is wrong.

Definitely not Morrissey, then. So yes it's lost.

 

[Detritus]

I kind of like the way nearly every character in this book has Tourette Syndrome.

 

[Anonymous]

I kind of like the way nearly every character in this book has Tourette Syndrome.

Might I seize this magnificent opportunity that someone out there is not a man, as long as as he's something much better: a slave-owner? I might...I might...I might

(" -You're getting really annoying now, Diego Riviera.")

 

[Uncleskinny]

I'm not discussing anything really.

Any writer must know that they can't control what images the readers will see when they read them. The brain uses whatever info it's been previously supplied with.
We've been told Tina is a very patient lady. I don't know many women who would have the patience to put up with such nonsensical attempted sex. Do you?
It's like watching Justin dry-humping David Cameron in "Bad Teacher". Except there's not even a pig around to make things interesting. It's just...ridiculous. Books shouldn't be ridiculous. I think.

Morrissey must have had some reason to write his List of the Lust. If he wants to tell the world he wants to pound his mother, or someone less than his mother, fine, if he wants to share his views about how females work, fine, I'm sure there will be people to follow his literary circumvolutions and find them riveting. Sadly it would require a patience I no longer have. Literature with Morrissey, sex with Morrissey, it all looks to me like a complete waste of time.
I'm sure there will be plenty of men to disagree, and that's fine, really he already knows that's the way it should be. They're the target audience of his javelin (or whatever he calls it).

As far as demons are concerned, well, I don't spit on satanic rituals now and then...I'm not adverse to babies occasionally boiling in big cauldrons, and doormats made of woven fans' hair, I do have curiosities as anybody else. But if he wanted our interest he shouldn't have shown us his Demon, because now I just can't take him seriously. Can you picture a coven in Switzerland? Nope. Boz Boorer as a bruja de Zagarramurdi?
Almost, but that's not the point.

If only his art imitated life, or even created it, I wouldn't be so bored. But it's just constantly nagging behind like a blubbering child. It pretends to know things it doesn't, and which can only be found outside books. That book isn't going to teach me.
The Guardian warned us not be sullied by this. Well, I'm of the opinion that as a mature reader you can choose to be sullied... but only by someone who acts like he's old enough to wipe his own bottom, and knows what he is doing, and wants what he's doing, even if what he's doing is wrong.

Definitely not Morrissey, then. So yes it's lost.

Finally. After all this time. Welcome, Moz.

 

[Anonymous]

Finally. After all this time. Welcome, Moz.

lol> I'm waiting for that FINAL moment you/ 'll see the words that I can't say.
Still. Croatia is lovely, this time of the year, etc South of Croatia anyway.
SO Fetch, Uncle. So Fetch.

You took your time!

 

[Uncleskinny]

lol> I'm waiting for that FINAL moment you/ 'll see the words that I can't say.
Still. Croatia is lovely, this time of the year, etc South of Croatia anyway.
SO Fetch, Uncle. So Fetch.

You took your time!

It's all a game, my riviera chum.

 

[Anonymous]

It's all a game, my riviera chum.

Indeed it is, my Northern comrade.

You did call me "Genius" once. This time won't be forgotten; and who knows, God willing, it might come again. It all depends on my novel doppel.

I gather you got rich recently. Then again, you always have been. Spend thy fortune well.

 

[Deleted member 1074]

 

[inourbritches]

Of course sex with Morrissey's is a waste of time. An egomaniac writing about something he's never understood with pompous authority. And why would he understand sex? It involves caring about someone else.

 

[Anonymous]

And why would he understand sex? It involves caring about someone else.

Hang on. That would almost imply that the animals we use to carry our bags in airports... might have... feelings and needs. Surely you're not saying they're as intelligent and sensitive as lab rats?!!?

Damn. I wish people would give some kind of warning before posting revolutionary stuff like that.
Do you want Morrissey to question his own classification of species!?! It took him years!!! YEARS!!!

People used to respect researchers.

And, about sex, are you forgetting who put the M in Kamasutra?

(Well,yes, he didn't actually put it IN, but... Yes! Well!)

 

[Anonymous]

I have a strange feeling Morrissey never cared or had a healthy sexlife with women and men. He seems to have trouble to express real sensitivity to both. I can see him having little to no sex in relationships. No naturality

 

[Anonymous]

My personal theory is now that Morrissey wrote a book to discourage foreigners from learning English and invading the UK. Especially Syrian refugees. #Assadisshitofthelost

That, or it's badly translated I-Lam na-Ngoldathon.
Makes you wonder when Morrissey last chewed the fat with a gnome. (Of a gnome.) (With... Yeah.)

I believe the original sentence was "the barrel rolled in".
A simple way to indicate that Boz Boorer casually entered the room (but didn't interrupt anything, as nothing was going on...)

 

[Anonymous]

"sex involves caring about someone else". thats just weird. sex is many things for many people and is not any one thing for any one reason or motivation

 

[Anonymous]

We laugh, we laugh, but how do we know that Kristeen Young is not an ex Romanian gymnast?

 

[Anonymous]

...I've just had a nice absurd convo with Eliza about sex and books. Try it, it's just like real life!

http://psych.fullerton.edu/mbirnbaum/psych101/Eliza.htm

careful, she's very inquisitive.

 

[Irregular Regular]

I like the book. Having read some of the reviews I prepared myself for a horror show, a car crash as they say, well this could be no further from the truth.
I may well be in the minority, and I really don't care.
The phrasing/narrative/editing may not be perfect at times, and still, I really don't care.
I will admit that I found the first 20 pages or so tough going, a tad too slow and at times overindulgent.
However that all changed the moment the 'wretch' makes his appearance, from that point onward I found the book to be a bit of a page turner to be quite honest.
Morrissey delves into areas most people quite simply dare not even discuss at a superficial level, life and death, loneliness and the apparent pointlessness of it all.
I don't expect many to like it, it is a tough read, stark, depressing even.
I believe the book is brave and quite a feat for someone who suffered so badly at the hands of a primitive and antiquated education system.
Well done Moz.

 

[Anonymous]

Morrissey delves into areas most people quite simply dare not even discuss at a superficial level, life and death, loneliness and the apparent pointlessness of it all.
I don't expect many to like it, it is a tough read, stark, depressing even.

Mmm. So, to sum things up, the only moment in life when characters giggle like lunatics, is when they try to have sex. Sex= hilarity. You will never forget a night with Bozo the clown.
Other than that, life's all gloom and doom, and then you die.

Gotcha. Well it wasn't as complicated as it looked.

 

[Detritus]

I like the book. Having read some of the reviews I prepared myself for a horror show, a car crash as they say, well this could be no further from the truth.
I may well be in the minority, and I really don't care.
The phrasing/narrative/editing may not be perfect at times, and still, I really don't care.
I will admit that I found the first 20 pages or so tough going, a tad too slow and at times overindulgent.
However that all changed the moment the 'wretch' makes his appearance, from that point onward I found the book to be a bit of a page turner to be quite honest.
Morrissey delves into areas most people quite simply dare not even discuss at a superficial level, life and death, loneliness and the apparent pointlessness of it all.
I don't expect many to like it, it is a tough read, stark, depressing even.
I believe the book is brave and quite a feat for someone who suffered so badly at the hands of a primitive and antiquated education system.
Well done Moz.

Thanks for your thoughts, IR. It's nice to have someone else who has read the book contribute to this discussion.

The part of your post in bold raises an interesting point. I think for many fans, just having access to Morrissey's unfiltered thoughts and creative vision is more than enough to find the book enjoyable. They may not care about its structure or execution. This is fine, to each their own, and better still if they find something of value to take away from it.

I agree that there are some salient points made in the book about the human condition, and in particular the negative repercussions of homophobia and sexual repression within law and society. It's also utterly fascinating as a roman a clef. Having said that, I think the book falters considerably in the execution of its narrative for reasons I have already outlined in this thread, which prevented me from really enjoying it.

I was harsh after my first read-through, but having read it again, these problems (self-indulgence and excessive exposition, lack of direction and character development, author grandstanding) are all common to first time novel writing attempts, and perhaps Morrissey should be cut some slack for this reason. Of course, had he allowed editorial oversight, many of these problems would have been alleviated considerably.

 

[Anonymous]

Oh dear. The initial review in The Guardian is pretty accurate. Did they have microwaves in the 70s and what does hair pulled out of one look like? I am halfway through and having trouble working out what is happening.

Microwaves certainly existed and were available for home use by 1975, but in 1971 only 1% of US households had one, rising to 25% by 1986. So in 1975 not many people would have had one.

However, the narrator is not a character in the story, so could be talking from now, looking back.

 

[Anonymous]

I like the novel. I think it's a continuation of Autobiography. He delves into relationships and the importance of love. It all ends tragically but I think that's how he feels they all do. I think many of us have felt this way.
"Yet, if I feel it, so must you, for it is you who made me feel so. Otherwise what is it that is ‘there’ for either of us to catch? Electrons from me need electrons from you in order to become electrons. Yet, there they are, and still you say nothing whilst always knowing. Look at the blue of the sky and tell me why you held back. Did you think there would one day be a bluer sky and a better hour? What did you think before you were aware?"