Years of Refusal is utterly brilliant

Discussion in 'General Discussion archive 2009 (read-only)' started by Maurice E, Jan 15, 2009.

  1. Maurice E

    Maurice E Junior Member

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    Ok, so I've yet to actually hear it but I'm just trying to counter the bad vibes!
     
  2. Stanley Ogden

    Stanley Ogden Member

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    This, we do need a thread for!!!! Come on Lads!
     
  3. 9 x Fined

    9 x Fined Chip-Ite

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    Why pretend
     
  4. Stanley Ogden

    Stanley Ogden Member

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    because we must
     
  5. mozmic_dancer

    mozmic_dancer One of the Good Guys

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    This album is getting more buzz than a hive of bees.

    My mozmic powers sense an early spring. The crocuses will bloom early just to hear this album. Bunnies will hop a little higher. Robins will tweet like mexican trumpets in celebration. Young men's thoughts will turn to fancy and Morrissey has provided the soundtrack.
     
  6. jm26

    jm26 Member

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    If you look at the main poll on the "How do you rank YOR thread", most people actually think it's an above average, very good album.

    Those who aren't happy with it, and are obviously entitled to there opinion, are simply more vocal.

    I think it's very good personally.
     
  7. Maurice E

    Maurice E Junior Member

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    Quite right JM. The early signs are very positive. The consensus seems to be that we have an (at least) above-average solo album.
    Having said that, I remember the first proper review of ROTT. It was in Observer Music Monthly and described it as the Morrissey Masterpiece - so I have learnt (the hard way) not to get swept along by the initial hype!
     
  8. Anaesthesine

    Anaesthesine Angel of Distemper

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    Oh good, an anticipation thread.

    I haven't heard the album either, and I've been avoiding most of the reviews, but I'm sensing a raw, aggressive sound with forceful drumming, distorted guitars, and a seething/intense/operatic "performance" from The Vocalist expressing dismay, anger and just a touch of dark whimsy.

    Just the right soundtrack for this moment in time.
     
  9. Ugly Devil

    Ugly Devil Well-Known Member

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    Don't fret, it's a very good album - I'd say his third or forth best. I'm a good judge of albums.
     
  10. Je Suis Julie

    Je Suis Julie allyouneedismorrissey.com

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    Excellent summation (says someone who has heard it - and has it pre-ordered :p).

    I really think it is his best album, although some others don't agree with me. To each their own.

    I guess its just hitting me at the right time, in the right place.
     
  11. Jammy Poet

    Jammy Poet New Member

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    I've yet to hear the new album myself (holding out for the official release) but i'll throw in my tuppence worth to promote the 'positive vibe' that it'll be as the thread says ;)
     
  12. David

    David Member

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    I think it's his best album -- most cohesive, most focused, most artful -- since Vauxhall and I. The songwriting is excellent; it definitely benefits from a minimum of Jesse Tobias compositions. His lyrics have a good mix of typical Morrisseyan tales of woe about presumably himself ("One Day Goodbye Will Be Farewell," "I'm OK By Myself," "All You Need Is Me"), and pretty little succint and empathetic portraits of other characters ("You Were Good In Your Time," "When Last I Spoke to Carol," "Mama Lay Softly on the Riverbed"). This latter category is what makes the album especially great, I think. And the band really, really rocks out -- impressively so. But it can be subtler too, like on "Good in Your Time" or the epic "It's Not Your Birthday Anymore" which shows Moz and his band can really shift gears on a dime these days. Unlike Ringleader, Quarry, Maladjusted, and even Southpaw, Years of Refusal doesn't have a song that I skip every time I listen to it, except maybe for "That's How People Grow Up" and that's because I've heard it a million times. All in all, the negative reviews here have really dismayed me. And I don't mean posters who have some substantive criticisms of the album because I don't think it or its creator are perfect; but those (and they know who they are) who exist on this website to sneer at everything Morrissey does, and when he creates an album like Years which is daring and almost adventurous, of course they won't like it. But I think if a listener gives it a chance, they will be more than satisfied.
     
  13. Vauxhall95

    Vauxhall95 I Know It's Over...

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    I wanted to love this album! I certainly "gave it a chance." You really believe that Morrissey's writing on this album surpasses his usual brilliance? How? Where?

    I also don't find anything "daring" about a song ending like "You Were Good in Your Time." In ruining what could have have been a classic with two minutes of sound effects to impress upon us that the subject of the song has just died is heavy handed, pretentious, and a bastardization of what was a very good song.

    Songs like "Black Cloud" seem musically heavily constrained. Morrissey brings in Jeff Beck but reduces his guitar work to the ending 5 seconds of the song. It's as if nothing is allowed to compete with Morrissey's vocals. "Sorry Doesn't Help" is equally anemic.

    I will agree that recording with the band, instead of separately, gives the songs more raw power. They seem to rock a little harder.

    Let's start there!:):):)
     
  14. Velvis

    Velvis Not a beginner

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    a touch of dark whimsy? Oooh yes please... I like it!

    I haven't heard the album yet but I'm really looking forward to it.

    I don't know how people can judge YOR after just a few listens - you should know Morrissey albums take a while to reveal their true beauty. To be honest I'm sick of reading how disappointing YOR is on this forum... keep YOR bad vibes to YORselves :p
     
  15. Anaesthesine

    Anaesthesine Angel of Distemper

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    Yay, give me heavy rhythms and distortion, or give me death! You're right, it's all about capturing this moment, and this moment is rough...

    I know I already love "Skull" and "Mamma," but waiting for "Carol" and "Birthday" is like having an itch you can't scratch...
     
  16. Comtesse

    Comtesse Starved Of Mirth

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    Daring and adventurous? How on earth is this album daring and adventurous? Ringleader was far more daring and adventurous than Refusal is. This is a very, very safe record - easily his least adventurous since Maladjusted. The only thing I would even call remotely "adventurous" is the flamenco sound of "Carol" - but that sounds silly. Even the ending of "You Were Good In Your Time" just hearkens back to the middle section of "Black-Eyed Susan". I'm not saying it's a bad album - it's okay in its low-key way - but suggesting that those of us who aren't big fans of it don't like it because we can't handle daring and adventurous Morrissey is ridiculous.

    And before you suggest that I'm one of those people who sneers at everything modern Morrissey does, let me state for the record that I liked much of Ringleader and think that "My Dearest Love" is beautiful.
     
  17. David

    David Member

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    Comtesse,

    Defensive aren't you? On the contrary, I do not think you sneer at everything Morrissey does. Obviously not, for anyone who has read your posts. In fact, I think you are somebody who had fair criticisms of Years of Refusal and almost named you in my post as such, but if you'd like to blow up instead, that's fine. Onto my claim about the album being daring (and notice I said "almost adventurous"). I think for one thing, yes, the Latin stylings on "Carol" are daring and when juxtaposed with Morrissey's voice and typical style, experimental by his standards. And the strange swirl of sounds and dialogue on "In Your Time," while a harkening back to old Moz songs like "Spring-heeled Jim" and "Black-eyed Susan," is still rather atypical and, I think, interesting. The vocal leaps on "Something is Squeezing My Skull" and "It's Not Your Birthday Anymore" took some guts and I think came out fabulously. The instrumentation is more interesting -- the drums especially come out in a way unseen on any solo record I can think of, the Jeff Beck guitar parts on "Black Cloud," the shift in "Birthday," the delicate almost harp-like guitar line in "I'm Throwing My Arms Around Paris," these are all subtleties that make up the best backdrop for Morrissey's voice in years. You don't like these flourishes. Good for you. But that's different from the album actually lacking flourishes. So get your argument straight please. If you think Ringleader was daring, you must be joking. That album was for the most part, vintage Moz-by-numbers (see the Allmusic review of the record).
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2009
  18. Vauxhall95

    Vauxhall95 I Know It's Over...

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    Allmusic is garbage. They have never given any Morrissey album a five.

    ROTT had "Life is a Pigsty," "Far Off Places," and "At Last I Am Born." All songs whose lyrics were as bold and daring as the music that accompanied it.

    If castrating Jeff Beck's guitar work is a "flourish," I would politely suggest you listen to some real guitar rock.:)
     
  19. David

    David Member

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    Vauxhall95,

    Allmusic is far from garbage. I think they've for the most part given Moz's records very fair reviews; I would have given Ringleader a little higher than three stars but I agreed with his points. "At Last I Am Born" does have interesting instrumentation, but it's a shitty, shitty song. "Far-off Places" and "Pigsty" are undeniably brilliant and I love them. And nice little jab there, but I don't see how that negates the fact that Beck's part on "Black Cloud" is an interesting and compelling little piece of music.
     
  20. Vauxhall95

    Vauxhall95 I Know It's Over...

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    Sorry for the dig - honestly. I try not to be a prick, but it just comes so naturally...

    Allmusic is far from garbage? They have given two Eminem albums 5 stars, but have never given Morrissey a five star review, ever.

    In "At Last I Am Born" Morrissey outs himself. After all the years of speculating on his sexuality, he bears his soul for the listener. Is it a single? Hell no! But it is an over-the-top theatrical song to match the overly dramatic delivery of the lyrics.

    Yes, Beck's part on "Black Cloud" is an interesting and compelling little piece of music. Why not include a guitar solo on a Morrissey album? That would have been daring, almost adventurous. Instead, we're left wondering what could have been.:guitar:
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2009
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