Updated Top 100 Smiths rarities in Record Collector (Feb. 2014)

An anonymous person writes:

Just a heads up to all Smiths record collectors...A new top 100 out in next months record collector mag...about time too!!



Uncleskinny posted the scan of the cover:

 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

That should be interesting. Maykings, cowboy kid 7, rank mispress, girlfriend 7 green *2-track* to the very top, then?
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

It is definitely a new Top 100, is it? I saw in this month's issue that there was a Smiths' cover next issue (out 30th January). I had assumed that it might be an article marking 30 years since the debut album.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

It is definitely a new Top 100, is it? I saw in this month's issue that there was a Smiths' cover next issue (out 30th January). I had assumed that it might be an article marking 30 years since the debut album.
There have been some interesting test pressings on ebay lately...bigmouth strikes again 7" mayking caught my eye in particular and finally seeing a copy or two of the 1983 Hand in glove test pressing. I wonder if these will appear in the new list, and at the other end of the spectrum it will be nice to see the back of such gems as those triple LP's at 99 and 100, discogs is full of them.Do any of you fancy a guess at the new top 10? Mine would be something like this....

1. Hand in glove 1983 test pressing 7"
2. Hand in glove negative sleeve 7"
3. Meat is murder unreleased 12"
4. Meat is murder test pressing 7"
5. Meat is murder MAYKING test 7"
6. Rank LP mispressed "blank" sleeve
7. Bigmouth strikes again MAYKING test 7"
8. Reel around the fountain 7" test
9. You just haven't heard it yet baby 12" test
10. Smiths s/t German promo multi colour.

Feel free to shoot the list down in flames with your own ideas of a new top 10.
 
Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

The HIG 83 Pressing is only valued at £1800 in the new Price Guide 2014 !
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

The HIG 83 Pressing is only valued at £1800 in the new Price Guide 2014 !
Those values in price guides are always way off. Good luck finding the HIG 83 for that price, hardly any exist. The test pressing of the first single The Smiths ever released should be number 1. It is just too important to place anything higher.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

The HIG 83 Pressing is only valued at £1800 in the new Price Guide 2014 !
Only £1800...shows how far these things have come along, 1 of only 5 apparently, that's got to be no.1 surely? A close 2nd at least.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

Importance and rarity are not mutually inclusive. The HIG '83 is one of the most important, but it is not the rarest. How many Bigmouth Maykings are out there? 1? How many of the other Maykings are out there? I've not seen one Mayking "That Joke" nor one Mayking QID. And I've only seen 1 Mayking Hand in Glove, which was a recent discovery. And 1 "I started Something" Mayking. The Maykings are just insanely rare, along with the blank rank and the cowboy kid, all of which should be at the top of the list. As far as the '83 HIG T/P's go, the word is we at least *assume* 4 of them are out there, the 5th, Morrissey's, being unaccounted for. 2 (presumably legitimate) have been seen for sale on the market, while the other two, Joe Moss' and Rourke's copy, have been said to be in the possession of private collections.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

As rare as the Mayking test pressings are (typically between 3 & 10 of most releases, I believe), that doesn't automatically make them the most valuable items. Most collectors would consider one of the white (or green or yellow!) label tests/promos of the cancelled realeases more desirable to own than a Making test of something that was released. For this reason, I don't expect there to be too much movement of positions right at the very top of the Top 100 collectibles. The negative sleeve 'Hand in glove' is still likely to be the No.1 and I still expect 'Reel Around The Fountain' test pressing to be No.2. The 'Meat Is Murder' 7", 12" & Mayking will also still be up there, as will 'You Just Haven't......' 12" test.
It could be from Nos. 10 to 30 or 40 where the greatest changes take place.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

As rare as the Mayking test pressings are (typically between 3 & 10 of most releases, I believe), that doesn't automatically make them the most valuable items. Most collectors would consider one of the white (or green or yellow!) label tests/promos of the cancelled realeases more desirable to own than a Making test of something that was released. For this reason, I don't expect there to be too much movement of positions right at the very top of the Top 100 collectibles. The negative sleeve 'Hand in glove' is still likely to be the No.1 and I still expect 'Reel Around The Fountain' test pressing to be No.2. The 'Meat Is Murder' 7", 12" & Mayking will also still be up there, as will 'You Just Haven't......' 12" test.
It could be from Nos. 10 to 30 or 40 where the greatest changes take place.

I feel the most important record out there has to be the 1983 hand in glove test press.Until recently I didn't think any would surface.We have seen Johnny and Mike's copies come to the surface at eye watering prices and as the above quotes we know of 2 others.If there are only 4/5/6 copies in existance, well that is one thing, but more importantly is the significance, the first pressed vinyl's of this great band, way more important than the current no.1 in my eyes and just as rare in number,if not rarer.As for the Reel test, well it seems to me that this record is offered for sale quite often for its position...2/3 times a year the chance comes along to buy it, but others never come along, as mentioned above the Rank mispress is a total mystery to me, never laid eyes on one anywhere.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

Please excuse the amateurish question, but what is the difference between a Mayking T/P and a non-Mayking T/P? Why are only some T/Ps out there made by Maykings?
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

I feel the most important record out there has to be the 1983 hand in glove test press.Until recently I didn't think any would surface.We have seen Johnny and Mike's copies come to the surface at eye watering prices and as the above quotes we know of 2 others.If there are only 4/5/6 copies in existance, well that is one thing, but more importantly is the significance, the first pressed vinyl's of this great band, way more important than the current no.1 in my eyes and just as rare in number,if not rarer.As for the Reel test, well it seems to me that this record is offered for sale quite often for its position...2/3 times a year the chance comes along to buy it, but others never come along, as mentioned above the Rank mispress is a total mystery to me, never laid eyes on one anywhere.
Well said. The HIG 83 TP is just as rare as the HIG neg. The question then becomes which one would be considered the more important piece to Smiths collectors. Me personally, the HIG 83 TP is leaps and bounds more important than the HIG neg.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

Please excuse the amateurish question, but what is the difference between a Mayking T/P and a non-Mayking T/P? Why are only some T/Ps out there made by Maykings?
It's not an amateurish question at all.

The Mayking Test pressings were generally the very first pressings done at the pressing plant. Pressed from the metal master plates, these were pressed in small numbers (typically 3 - 10), had their own Mayking Records labels and would then be examined and played at the pressing plant to ensure their quality. They would then be passed on to the record company to make sure that they met with their approval. Once the record company were happy with them, full pressing production could commence. Even then, further test pressings could be run for various reasons but these would normally be the plain white (or green, yellow, pink, red, purple or whatever was available!) labels. It is worth noting that Rough Trade, (like most independent record labels) wanting to get their money's worth, often used their approved test pressings as promo copies, sent out to radio stations, music publications and reviewers. These were generally pressed in greater numbers than the Mayking tests.

I've probably made the whole process sound a bit simplistic. Stephane (if he is around) would probably be able to explain it better.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

It's not an amateurish question at all.

The Mayking Test pressings were generally the very first pressings done at the pressing plant. Pressed from the metal master plates, these were pressed in small numbers (typically 3 - 10), had their own Mayking Records labels and would then be examined and played at the pressing plant to ensure their quality. They would then be passed on to the record company to make sure that they met with their approval. Once the record company were happy with them, full pressing production could commence. Even then, further test pressings could be run for various reasons but these would normally be the plain white (or green, yellow, pink, red, purple or whatever was available!) labels. It is worth noting that Rough Trade, (like most independent record labels) wanting to get their money's worth, often used their approved test pressings as promo copies, sent out to radio stations, music publications and reviewers. These were generally pressed in greater numbers than the Mayking tests.

I've probably made the whole process sound a bit simplistic. Stephane (if he is around) would probably be able to explain it better.
On average 25 "maykings" were pressed when they did a test run, just thought I'd mention that...the fact that some have never been seen, well not all releases had a Mayking test done.Back in the time these were done they weren't of any value, maybe one made it out of a box and after a listen, the rest got binned/lost whatever..that's why there is only one here and there, but 25 ish were always pressed...still very rare though.
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

Well said. The HIG 83 TP is just as rare as the HIG neg. The question then becomes which one would be considered the more important piece to Smiths collectors. Me personally, the HIG 83 TP is leaps and bounds more important than the HIG neg.
Fine. That's your opinion. I agree, the 'Hand In Glove' 1983 test pressing is of more historical importance that the 'negative sleeve'. It is also rarer. However, that alone doesn't dictate the collectors market value of it. That's all that I am saying. Pretty much every Mayking test pressing (3 -10) is rarer than the 'Reel Around The Fountain' test pressing (25) but I very much doubt that they will hold the same value.
 

surewhynot

Member
Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

This debate can go on and on, but the fact of the matter is that there was, is and always will be 2 separate parties when it comes to obtaining collectors items: collector group A who base their bidding on a Record Collector publication and collector group B, who take part in the Smiths collectors market every day, sometimes on an obsessive hourly basis, perusing forums, auctions, record stores and documentation very routinely, and who know better when an item is worth more than some fabricated bar from some crazy article considered to be the market bellwether. Just look at the evidence: blank ranks, any Maykings, the William red labels, the full length album test pressings, TCM white labels, etc. etc. Any of the big ticket items we've mentioned here -- HIG neg, Maykings, HIG 83 TPs -- what they will be worth at market will not be identified by any magazine, but how bad someone wants it and how recently they just got paid. ;)
 

darby1974

Member
Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

I feel the most important record out there has to be the 1983 hand in glove test press.Until recently I didn't think any would surface.We have seen Johnny and Mike's copies come to the surface at eye watering prices and as the above quotes we know of 2 others.If there are only 4/5/6 copies in existance, well that is one thing, but more importantly is the significance, the first pressed vinyl's of this great band, way more important than the current no.1 in my eyes and just as rare in number,if not rarer.As for the Reel test, well it seems to me that this record is offered for sale quite often for its position...2/3 times a year the chance comes along to buy it, but others never come along, as mentioned above the Rank mispress is a total mystery to me, never laid eyes on one anywhere.
Here is the Rank blank..
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

It's not an amateurish question at all.

The Mayking Test pressings were generally the very first pressings done at the pressing plant. Pressed from the metal master plates, these were pressed in small numbers (typically 3 - 10), had their own Mayking Records labels and would then be examined and played at the pressing plant to ensure their quality. They would then be passed on to the record company to make sure that they met with their approval. Once the record company were happy with them, full pressing production could commence. Even then, further test pressings could be run for various reasons but these would normally be the plain white (or green, yellow, pink, red, purple or whatever was available!) labels. It is worth noting that Rough Trade, (like most independent record labels) wanting to get their money's worth, often used their approved test pressings as promo copies, sent out to radio stations, music publications and reviewers. These were generally pressed in greater numbers than the Mayking tests.

I've probably made the whole process sound a bit simplistic. Stephane (if he is around) would probably be able to explain it better.


This was perfect, your explanation was exactly what I was hoping for. Many thanks!
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

On average 25 "maykings" were pressed when they did a test run, just thought I'd mention that...the fact that some have never been seen, well not all releases had a Mayking test done.Back in the time these were done they weren't of any value, maybe one made it out of a box and after a listen, the rest got binned/lost whatever..that's why there is only one here and there, but 25 ish were always pressed...still very rare though.
Oh... OK, thank you. I'm happy to stand corrected!
I'm wondering where the 3 - 10 figure comes from. I know I didn't conjure it out of thin air!
Maybe it is the number of records that got examined and played to ensure the quality control?
 
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Anonymous

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Re: Smiths Top 100 Record Collector March 2014

Quote 16 by surewhynot is right on the money, any item is worth what someone will pay for it...a magazine top 100 every 8/10/12 years whatever won't tell you what is happening month by month, neither will a yearly guide book. Any serious Smiths collector want's the HIG 1983 test press, of course they do, it is THE most significant Smiths record, it has to be, but that doesn't mean its worth more than something else.The HIG neg sleeve has always captured the imagine but how a printing cock up on the sleeve makes this so valuable compared to others I have never understood, any of the unreleased tests are worth more in my opinion and there's the point....it's all about opinion's.

Nice picture of the Rank mispress by the way..is that yours or a picture of one you have dug up from the net?
 

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