TTY: Full List of Dates Played To Promote 'World Peace is None of Your Business'; Lady Penelope art

Note: May / June 2014 US dates were not included for some reason.

Full List of Dates Played To Promote 'World Peace is None of Your Business' - true-to-you.net
4 January 2016

6 October 2014, Coliseum, Lisbon, Portugal
...
2 January 2016, The Joint, Las Vegas, NV, USA
(Click link for full list)

Lady Penelope artwork by Sam Esty Rayner

 

[Anonymous]

If he had only made more of that opportunity he would have surely raised his level of success in the states

But sometimes it's easier said than done. I mean, by all accounts, 1995 wasn't the best time for Moz privately, so that got in the way of his career somewhat. I don't think that you can expect that much during tough times. Must have been hard times over the years for people close to him, too. But luckily he seems to have a very strong support system in private which allows him to keep going and he holds on to it very strongly (despite what he says).

 

[Thewlis]

From a record company standpoint I don't know if there was anything much more that could have been done. Probably a bit more horse trading to get his singles played on the radio, but y'know I'm happy that he didn't get much bigger as far as audience size goes. Howie Klein at Sire commented around the time that it was like he was the world's largest cult and I think that is a pretty appropriate space for Morrissey to occupy.

Well, it is interesting you should mention Howie Klein. I spoke to him a couple of years later and he spoke about the 1992/1994 period quite openly. Morrissey WAS on the brink of superstardom in 1992 as you quite rightly point out and he WAS always complaining to Sire about why they couldn't get him a single in the Billboard charts. But they'd tell him that the singles he was releasing at the time (My Love Life, Fatty, We Hate It, Certain People) just weren't suited for the US market. They would say: If you give us a single we can work with, we'll get you a hit record. Two years on Moz did deliver them such a song, The More You Ignore Me, and Sire was over the moon. They got it on heavy rotation on radio stations and MTV alike and the single entered the charts. So Sire pleaded with Moz: Now is your time, please come over and promote your hit single and it will go top 10.
But Moz refused to and blew his final chance of mainstream US success.
Not that it makes much difference now.

 

[evennow]

But sometimes it's easier said than done. I mean, by all accounts, 1995 wasn't the best time for Moz privately, so that got in the way of his career somewhat. I don't think that you can expect that much during tough times. Must have been hard times over the years for people close to him, too. But luckily he seems to have a very strong support system in private which allows him to keep going and he holds on to it very strongly (despite what he says).

True. I have to admit that I have never really followed Moz' private life so I have no idea what he was going through during this period. I must be one of the few who didn't really care who he was dating, where he spent his free time, etc. I believe you may be describing his mental health at the time, and again the most I knew of this was an article I read in SPIN magazine where he said that if he could take a pill that would painlessly end his life he would. I wrote it off as being a part of his "usual shtick", but I understand now that he did suffer and may still suffer with mental health issues.

Still...I believe had he been able to continue to promote himself and his music at that specific time his career trajectory would have continued to climb. It is very difficult for pop stars to disappear and then come back bigger than ever.

 

[evennow]

Well, it is interesting you should mention Howie Klein. I spoke to him a couple of years later and he spoke about the 1992/1994 period quite openly. Morrissey WAS on the brink of superstardom in 1992 as you quite rightly point out and he WAS always complaining to Sire about why they couldn't get him a single in the Billboard charts. But they'd tell him that the singles he was releasing at the time (My Love Life, Fatty, We Hate It, Certain People) just weren't suited for the US market. They would say: If you give us a single we can work with, we'll get you a hit record. Two years on Moz did deliver them such a song, The More You Ignore Me, and Sire was over the moon. They got it on heavy rotation on radio stations and MTV alike and the single entered the charts. So Sire pleaded with Moz: Now is your time, please come over and promote your hit single and it will go top 10.
But Moz refused to and blew his final chance of mainstream US success.
Not that it makes much difference now.

Thewlis, you seem to know quite a lot here. This is how it appeared from an outsiders perspective such as myself. It was like the video came out and he basically was nowhere to be found. I am interested in your choice of words "refused to". Others have suggested he was "unable to" continue due to some issue or another. Can you speak to what you mean by "refused to"?

 

[Thewlis]

Thewlis, you seem to know quite a lot here. This is how it appeared from an outsiders perspective such as myself. It was like the video came out and he basically was nowhere to be found. I am interested in your choice of words "refused to". Others have suggested he was "unable to" continue due to some issue or another. Can you speak to what you mean by "refused to"?

Well, those were Howie's words. Sire begged him to please come and promote this fantastic album and single (his words), but he just wanted to do some instores but no televison or touring. Opportunity wasted and the beginning of the end of the Sire/Moz relationship, which as I pointed out began to sour in 1992. Of course only Morrissey knows the real reason why he refused to promote his very best album and his most popular (in the US at least) single. The Jake-factor will definitiely have something to do with it, but I think the main reason is his refusal to play by record company's rules, which has plagued his entire career. Hello Harvest, hello Sanctuary, hello EMI. Geoff, are you there?

 

[Jamie]

The first concert I saw him play was in Chicago during the Kill Uncle tour. The name of the theater escapes me (old age), but it was an outdoor venue with a very large seating capacity. We had pretty much the worst seats way in the back, but it was plain then that his draw had diminished. We were able to easily walk down several rows and I would estimate the place was half full.

Sounds like you went to this show: http://www.passionsjustlikemine.com/live/moz-g910625.htm The venue has changed names frequently: New World Music Theatre, Tweeter Center, First Midwest Bank Amphitheatre, now Hollywood Casino Amphitheatre. It's also where he would have performed in 2004 if Lollapalooza had not been canceled. Fine for festival shows as there is a large lawn behind the seated area, but ill-suited for Morrissey. He's always excelled in smaller, indoor venues in Chicago.

 

[Anonymous]

that huma type of music was never going to conquer the usa so moz was never going to be superstar. it was never going to be on mainstream radio
that type of moz/smiths music has limited appeal.

 

[evennow]

Sounds like you went to this show: http://www.passionsjustlikemine.com/live/moz-g910625.htm The venue has changed names frequently: New World Music Theatre, Tweeter Center, First Midwest Bank Amphitheatre, now Hollywood Casino Amphitheatre. It's also where he would have performed in 2004 if Lollapalooza had not been canceled. Fine for festival shows as there is a large lawn behind the seated area, but ill-suited for Morrissey. He's always excelled in smaller, indoor venues in Chicago.

Thanks for the link Jamie...memories dredged up and spilling all over the place. Who I went with, how young and thin I was, high to the bejesus...and the set list! Only Suedehead and Everyday survived the culling. So many great songs from the catalog and sadly most remain underutilized to say the least.

 

[Detritus]

Well, it is interesting you should mention Howie Klein. I spoke to him a couple of years later and he spoke about the 1992/1994 period quite openly. Morrissey WAS on the brink of superstardom in 1992 as you quite rightly point out and he WAS always complaining to Sire about why they couldn't get him a single in the Billboard charts. But they'd tell him that the singles he was releasing at the time (My Love Life, Fatty, We Hate It, Certain People) just weren't suited for the US market. They would say: If you give us a single we can work with, we'll get you a hit record. Two years on Moz did deliver them such a song, The More You Ignore Me, and Sire was over the moon. They got it on heavy rotation on radio stations and MTV alike and the single entered the charts. So Sire pleaded with Moz: Now is your time, please come over and promote your hit single and it will go top 10.
But Moz refused to and blew his final chance of mainstream US success.
Not that it makes much difference now.

Thanks for this insight. Very interesting, though not altogether surprising. I agree that his decision not to tour behind Vauxhall was probably informed by several factors, mainly contentment in his personal life and not wanting to disrupt that, and his tendency to be contrarian and disregard record label directives.

Maybe this is grasping, but many queer artists with cult followings in the states seem to have much greater success in Europe. This could be an additional factor in why he never "broke" in the States.

Morrissey never overtly presented himself as a "gay artist" or anything along those terms, and in fact actively worked to ensure he wouldn't be pigeonholed as such, but nevertheless there was plenty about him to make him too subversive for safe, mass consumption in puritanical, uptight America. Even if he had toured the US in support of Vauxhall, I'm not sure he would have found massive success. The entertainment industry in this country just doesn't know how to market male entertainers who do not fit a very specific mold; this is perhaps less true now than it was in the early 90s, but it is still more or less the case. Morrissey has himself spoken to this issue. Even if he didn't have a whiff of "the love that dare not speak its name" about him, Morrissey was still never going to fit the requirements of marketability in the US. He is very classically handsome, but his role as the eternal outsider, speaking to and for the marginalized, and serving as a beacon of alternative masculinity means that he would always be at odds with conventional success in America and truly at home artistically in the margins, and that is honestly where I think he belongs. Not because he was never good enough as a performer to achieve megastardom, but because that kind of mass appeal is in many ways antithetical to what Morrissey represents and what his key virtues are as an artist.

 

[evennow]

that huma type of music was never going to conquer the usa so moz was never going to be superstar. it was never going to be on mainstream radio
that type of moz/smiths music has limited appeal.

I thought about this comment and what comes to mind is REM. They were a strictly college radio station band when they first came out and were probably farther from the mainstream than Moz was. You could have said the same thing about their music, but they built a fan base (so did Moz), and became more visible to the pop music generation of the time. This is where I think Moz missed the mark. I think his music would have caught on similarly if he had only had better videos, and more exposure. He withdrew whilst REM expanded and to me that is what made the difference.

 

[Thewlis]

I thought about this comment and what comes to mind is REM. They were a strictly college radio station band when they first came out and were probably farther from the mainstream than Moz was. You could have said the same thing about their music, but they built a fan base (so did Moz), and became more visible to the pop music generation of the time. This is where I think Moz missed the mark. I think his music would have caught on similarly if he had only had better videos, and more exposure. He withdrew whilst REM expanded and to me that is what made the difference.

Yes, the REM-example always pops up in any Moz or Smiths-book. Had The Smiths stayed together they would almost certainly have been as big as REM in the early 90s. And even without Johnny, with EMI and Sire behind him the odds were certainly in Morrissey's favour to 'make it'. 1991 was a perfect year for alternative music to break through. Nirvana, REM, RHCP all became mainstream. Even Siouxsie and the Banshees had u hit record in the US.
But Morrissey just didn't have the songs at the time. Should he have had a song like The More You Ignore Me - or First of the Gang or Irish Blood - he would have been huge in 1991 I'm pretty sure.

 

[Anonymous]

that huma type of music was never going to conquer the usa so moz was never going to be superstar. it was never going to be on mainstream radio
that type of moz/smiths music has limited appeal.

But those who listen to his music, he means the world to them. I have NEVER seen so many people climbing over each other to touch him, it got kind of ugly in LV.

 

[evennow]

Yes, the REM-example always pops up in any Moz or Smiths-book. Had The Smiths stayed together they would almost certainly have been as big as REM in the early 90s. And even without Johnny, with EMI and Sire behind him the odds were certainly in Morrissey's favour to 'make it'. 1991 was a perfect year for alternative music to break through. Nirvana, REM, RHCP all became mainstream. Even Siouxsie and the Banshees had u hit record in the US.
But Morrissey just didn't have the songs at the time. Should he have had a song like The More You Ignore Me - or First of the Gang or Irish Blood - he would have been huge in 1991 I'm pretty sure.

Ah yes, who could forget their 1991 hit:

I do agree with bhops about his non-mainstream sexuality playing a role at the time in limiting his success, but America was willing to accept and make this popular:

So I think the youth of that generation deserve a little credit for looking past the superficial and even celebrating it. Cue:

 

[NealCassidy]

Do people on M-S ever make predictions for the the year?

I'd be interested to hear whether people think he will tour again in 2016, or a new album (as previously mentioned?) or another book (as previously mentioned?) or retirement (as previously mentioned?)..

- - - Updated - - -

Do people on M-S ever make predictions for the the year?

I'd be interested to hear whether people think he will tour again in 2016, or a new album (as previously mentioned?) or another book (as previously mentioned?) or retirement (as previously mentioned?)..

Is there a 'poll' function?...

 

[Kewpie]

Do people on M-S ever make predictions for the the year?

Is there a 'poll' function?...

Yes, if you create a new thread, you can select "post a poll".

However, you have to be careful with spelling and poll options which cannot be corrected.

 

[NealCassidy]

Yes, if you create a new thread, you can select "post a poll".

However, you have to be careful with spelling and poll options which cannot be corrected.

Thanks!

http://www.morrissey-solo.com/threads/136782-The-BIG-2016-Poll-What-is-most-likely-in-2016

 

[Anonymous]

Benny to evennow come in evennow, over !

First of all thankyou Sir ! Thanks for your kind comments on previous posts, also belated thanks to Gernie X for kind comments I stumbled across on the forum fan pages ( never go there normally).
Happy new year everyone, ok you as well Ketchup-Bum ( oh that hurt ).
This is not a good time of year for me so I have been busy going to bed early with hot drinks and books but nothing works, sleeping is a waste of time.
I'm always here reading but at the moment I'm in a very grey boring mundane place as far as music is concerned. Lemmy's passing has been tragic BUT ! Also an arse kicker ! I'm so 4kin bored with music these days ! I need stimulating FFS !
I have to admit that I have done a " Silly Steven " and turned to utube to seek my needs/hopes.
If anyone has anything for me to view/recommend please pass on but not any old shit please, music with passion, adventure, commitment, direction, hope, anarchy and true 4kin feedback volume.
Think Cramps, Motörhead, Smiths, Jesus and Mary Chain, James, The Mission, Camera obscure, Primitives, Joy Division, The Darts, Ronettes, Shirelles etc etc.

Happy new year (for now)
Down ! Out ! And pissed off !

Apart from that have a great wknd people and send me lots of good music to stimulate me.

Benny-the-British-Butcher

 

[Anonymous]

rem is nothing like moz music. it had a strong background in american 60s rock, at the time of their first few albums, they were considered a throwback to groups like the byrds. they had their up, and then when it became the michael stipe band, they had their down. but its nothing like moz with the cavorting cabaret huma vibe. no way was the smiths or moz music going to escape their limited appeal.

 

[marred]

True. I have to admit that I have never really followed Moz' private life so I have no idea what he was going through during this period. I must be one of the few who didn't really care who he was dating, where he spent his free time, etc. I believe you may be describing his mental health at the time, and again the most I knew of this was an article I read in SPIN magazine where he said that if he could take a pill that would painlessly end his life he would. I wrote it off as being a part of his "usual shtick", but I understand now that he did suffer and may still suffer with mental health issues.

Still...I believe had he been able to continue to promote himself and his music at that specific time his career trajectory would have continued to climb. It is very difficult for pop stars to disappear and then come back bigger than ever.

No you're not the only one.

 

[marred]

Well, those were Howie's words. Sire begged him to please come and promote this fantastic album and single (his words), but he just wanted to do some instores but no televison or touring. Opportunity wasted and the beginning of the end of the Sire/Moz relationship, which as I pointed out began to sour in 1992. Of course only Morrissey knows the real reason why he refused to promote his very best album and his most popular (in the US at least) single. The Jake-factor will definitiely have something to do with it, but I think the main reason is his refusal to play by record company's rules, which has plagued his entire career. Hello Harvest, hello Sanctuary, hello EMI. Geoff, are you there?

I don't see it as a plague at all. However Morrissey chooses to operate has given us the music we have today. America is not the world

There's a quote in The South Bank Show where Morrissey talks about those old Hollywood stars who knew how things should go but they were seen as "box office poison" because they were deemed hard to work with. Morrissey was clearly talking about himself even if he wasn't manning to.

Morrissey will never be easy to work with and those who bitch about his behaviour while not knowing the full story are wasting their time which they seem to be very adept at. I am not including you in that group at all. I think we know who I am talking about.

Oh and btw rem suck.