The Meaning of "That's How People Grow Up"

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's phoned-in... "Christian Dior," it slots into a part of his aesthetic, whatever its other flaws. (He has phoned it in before, but at least the rage and sorrow of "People Grow Up" disqualifies it firmly from that category.)

Are you absolutely insane? "Christian Dior" is a work of art.

"Loudly and proudly all forcible entry and never non-violent" seals the deal!

Anyway, "That's How People Grow Up" is a simple observation. I mean, "Life's a bitch, and then you die." How many times can that be rephrased?

"Christian Dior"... that is heresy to say he phoned it in. Go look at a photo of the artiste in question, and get back to me.
 
I was unclear. I didn't list any I felt he phoned in. I meant that "Dior" and "That's How People" and "Dagenham Dave" are all sort of great/sort of not. Misfit songs that fit into Morrissey's canon, aren't phone-ins, have a lot to recommend them but are far from perfect.

Something about "Dior" just doesn't reach me; I respect the choice of subject and it's a good lyric but I find it oddly distant. I do think it's a work of art, though, so apparently I'm not absolutely insane. :)
 
Last edited:
Again, and without reservation, "Christian Dior" is the pinnacle of anyone's career, let alone Morrissey's canon. Bono would die if he even thought such a beautiful thought on the toilet in his luxury jet. The world would be a much better place, too (with Bono dead, that is).

That said, meh, whatever... other bands have certainly produced more "twee" songs than that one, and "Christian Dior", at the very least, appeals to most people. They know the brand name... or somesuch. Yes, that's it. The vino hasn't totally influenced my judgment. Piss off.

XXOO,

ADAM

P.S. Santa Claus is a sham unless I receive presents this year, and I know I won't because I've been a horrible boy. Ha! Tell that fat b@st@rd to go piss up a rope. I hope he rots in a chimney.

P.P.S. I'd really like presents, but nobody loves us. So we tend to...
 
Aww, I thought I took out the word "twee" before anyone would see it.

No one has ever not regretted the word "twee."
 
Aww, I thought I took out the word "twee" before anyone would see it.

No one has ever not regretted the word "twee."

Struth! I remember Damon Blurboy using it in a poem about MORRISSEY in the 1990's to decry "nationalism", and he lived to regret it. You will suffer the curse of a thousand Blurs, which probably means you'll have a hemmorhoid that won't go away when you reach 40. Oh well, I hope Damon Blur does, too.

P.S. I still want presents, Santa, you fat b@st@ard.
 
"Disappointment" could be a name for a certain part of his lover's anatomy (the "booted" is especially telling),
I was focusing on the nonviolent aspects of the lyrics but I can see where you're coming from.

and the "growing up," well, you figure it out. Just an alternate reading, since you seem desperate for one, and that's the one that suddenly sprang to mind.
Of course it did. :rolleyes:

But Morrissey specifitically states he praying for love that never comes.

Let me live
Before I die
No not me
Not I
Fatalism is a mind f***.
I was driving my car
I crashed and broke my spine
So yes there are things worse in life than
Never being someone's sweetie


I sense some resentment for the invertebrate kingdom. Feminist have penis envy, Fat Chicks have Spinal Tap? It's like you can circumcise a dildo, and you can't move mountains until you loose the global Remote Control. That how people get up.

But the Spinal Tap connection is epic "The Morrissey". Morrissey can write songs for the masses (chronically obese America) and still convey a universal message.
 
"Disappointment" could be a name for a certain part of his lover's anatomy (the "booted" is especially telling), and the "growing up," well, you figure it out. Just an alternate reading, since you seem desperate for one, and that's the one that suddenly sprang to mind.

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

I love the idea that Morrissey was making a euphemistic song, and having a little bit of a chuckle, and everyone reads deep poetry into the lyrics! :D

Personally I tend not to deeply analyse his lyrics, although thats not through choice, I just really can't see how "Some girls are bigger than others" is a song about anything other than some girls having weight issues?! I think I need to go back to English literature classes....
 
What can one do? The lyric and the sentiment are themselves quite banal.

Of course its real problem is that it's not banal, but inane; the quality of art is not measured by how many times it's been done. I may still change my mind again about "That's How People..." (my friend's line on it is that it's deliberately "anti-romantic," which I have, at various points, sort of bought) but mostly I find it's not anti-romantic so much as anti-poetry - and once you're coining the phrase "anti-poetry" then where are you? What's the difference between anti-poetry and bad poetry?

(Actually, I know this one: it's "Dear God Please Help Me" vs. "That's How People Grow Up.")

I like your comparison with "by Friday, life has killed me" because it's a fine example of Morrissey actually nailing this aspect of midlife disappointment. Then again, Iperhaps that wasn't what he was going for with "People Grow Up;" perhaps this one was meant to be about epiphany rather than years of wearing-down.

And most of Morrissey's epiphanies can seem banal because, like many artists, his self-reflective inner world is incredibly well-defined but he doesn't seem to get the particulars of "normal" life that well. Thus a quite simple realization like "oh my - so you're telling me people become mature by realizing that their own suffering is only a part of the world's suffering?" comes rather late and sketchily (in the sense that it's an actual sketch). It's valid, but it comes from an unusual system of values and thoughts which understands music and old television much more easily.

(That's the problem with most mainstream Moz criticism - it assumes he's a normal man with an interest in loneliness, old television, music journalism, dead movie stars and the New York Dolls. This isn't true. Morrissey is loneliness, old television, music journalism, dead movie stars and the New York Dolls - a reductive statement, but you know what I mean. His brain's natural channels of thought are extinct popular culture and its own pain and amusement. To say anything about anything larger or more current is a struggle, even if it's one which we've seen him win a number of times, and indeed which he's made one of the major points of his artistic life. All this is a guess, but I think there's at least some truth in what I say.)

The other thing about a realization like "that's how people grow up" is that it's really easy to grasp intellectually but really hard to fully understand, especially if you're a self-reflective thinker, as above. I think the song is an effort to understand. Also, Morrissey is, I think, facing an uphill battle these past few years - "I fear I'll be lonely all my life" is simply easier to express artistically than the impression I've had from his last 20 or 30 lyrics - i.e. "I HAVE been lonely all my life; relationships have failed and I've found that simply growing older is not even a guaranteed route to wisdom." How do you cram that into a metaphor about being seasick?




Ultimately, my opinion of the song still comes down to "fabulous singing, killer hook, obviously painfully heartfelt, not that good goddamn lyric." It's simple, but it isn't "good simple" in the manner of "You Have Killed Me" or "Life is a Pigsty." I firmly believe that a non-fan would find it rather self-indulgent and both obvious and incomprehensable; you have to love Morrissey a bit to see anything in it - of course people said that of Ringleader too, and Ringleader was my first Moz album and made me understand what he was talking about immediately. Perhaps I should just say you ought to be the sort of person who's predisposed to love Morrissey a bit.

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's phoned-in - like "Dagenham Dave" and "Christian Dior," it slots into a part of his aesthetic, whatever its other flaws. (He has phoned it in before, but at least the rage and sorrow of "People Grow Up" disqualifies it firmly from that category.)

excellent. You've defined your terms and it all holds together. Whether someone agrees with your opinions or not this is a great abstract view of Morrissey and his lyrics, as well as this particular song.

I know what you mean about "anti-poetry" and "anti-romantic". I think that the lyrics are artfully written in a imitation-throwaway manner, and were meant to be seen that way. He's purposely writing to appear to have the attitude that the lyrics just aren't that important and he can't be bothered. The "crashed and broke my spine" seems to be an irritating part of the song for most people, but I think it's hilarious.
 
"I know what you mean about "anti-poetry" and "anti-romantic". I think that the lyrics are artfully written in a imitation-throwaway manner, and were meant to be seen that way. He's purposely writing to appear to have the attitude that the lyrics just aren't that important and he can't be bothered. The "crashed and broke my spine" seems to be an irritating part of the song for most people, but I think it's hilarious."

I'm having a hard time with that. He works his whole career to build up a reputation for writing lyrically witty songs and demonstrates absolute disdain for pop stars who are, "...afraid to show intelligence, it might wreck their lovely careers." But now, in the twilight of his career (and I write that hoping it isn't true), he opts to totally redefine how he goes about writing songs?

Maybe. But I think the more likely answer is it's just not a good song lyrically. Which is fine, they can't all be tens. I think when Morrissey is trying to be funny, you know he is being funny. To quote Dagenham Dave, "He'd love to touch, he's afraid he might self combust, I could say more but you get the general idea." Clearly written to illicit a laugh, there is no ambiguity.

Just an opinion... Vaux:)
 
Last edited:
Some people think too much.

I mean, "That's HOW People GROW UP" people. Just see it, seize it, use it, and throw it away. Or keep it in a plastic baggie to preserve its smell. Either way, quit kvetching over the slightest of words.

Note: That was my 150th post. It should've been special, but... (That's How People Grow Up).
 
I think he's written lyrics in the mock-throwaway mode before (most of Ringleader, I think, appears thrown away but it runs right if you throw up the hood and take a look, and I'm fairly sure there was more explicit mythologizing around the supposed relative spontaneity of Your Arsenal and Viva Hate) - but I also think "That's How People Grow Up" is an actual throwaway.

But I'm ok with reading it as a mock-throwaway. I could even be convinced that it's an unsuccessful mock-throwaway (that is, he only thinks he's successfully thought out the kind of song he'd write if he weren't thinking). You never know.

...eerie music...


JOURNEY THROUGH MORRISSEY'S MIND
 
Some people think too much.

I mean, "That's HOW People GROW UP" people. Just see it, seize it, use it, and throw it away. Or keep it in a plastic baggie to preserve its smell. Either way, quit kvetching over the slightest of words.

Note: That was my 150th post. It should've been special, but... (That's How People Grow Up).

Does it help that we're not talking about the explicit meaning of "That's How People Grow Up" (yes, we get it, it's about how people grow up...)?

Or if not, how about I have my fun and you have yours?
 
Some people think too much.

I mean, "That's HOW People GROW UP" people. Just see it, seize it, use it, and throw it away. Or keep it in a plastic baggie to preserve its smell. Either way, quit kvetching over the slightest of words.

Note: That was my 150th post. It should've been special, but... (That's How People Grow Up).

I never understood people complaining about discussion or debate in the Forum. It's what the forum is for! If you don't want to read about then you can just stick to the front page. I, and many others, derive a great deal of satisfaction debating and delving into the songs.:confused:
 
I think he's written lyrics in the mock-throwaway mode before (most of Ringleader, I think, appears thrown away but it runs right if you throw up the hood and take a look, and I'm fairly sure there was more explicit mythologizing around the supposed relative spontaneity of Your Arsenal and Viva Hate) - but I also think "That's How People Grow Up" is an actual throwaway.

But I'm ok with reading it as a mock-throwaway. I could even be convinced that it's an unsuccessful mock-throwaway (that is, he only thinks he's successfully thought out the kind of song he'd write if he weren't thinking). You never know.

I'm okay with a lot of ROTT. I think if you want an example of the lyrically writing you're describing than I would suggest "To Me You Are a Work of Art's: I see the world it makes me puke." Or YATQ's "How Could Anybody Possibly Know How I Feel's: I've had my face dragged through 15 miles of shit." Both of these suggest a departure in how Morrissey approaches lyric writing. He is seeming foregoing the romanticism, and eloquence of the past for more of a visceral approach. So, in that light I could see a premeditated lyrical change.

However, like you stated, we can never really know because we can't get into his head. Still and all, it might be a question worth asking on the True-to-You question submission page.

Love the debate!

Vaux
 
Back
Top Bottom