The Guardian: Johnny Marr - "You ask the questions" (February 6, 2022)

J'en ai marre?

Johnny Marr: ‘When I play Smiths songs I experience this huge wave of elation’

Johnny Marr: ‘When I play Smiths songs I experience this huge wave of elation’

On the eve of his new double album, the acclaimed songwriter takes questions from musicians, politicians and readers

www.theguardian.com

Particularly liked Bernard Butler's question...

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Excerpt:
Did the Smiths ever fall out over football or politics?
Andy Burnham, mayor of Greater Manchester

We never discussed football so that’s that. And we never fell out over politics, but we probably would now.

Morrissey’s recent political views have cast a shadow over the Smiths for me – reaching back into the past and tainting something that was very important to me. I’m so disappointed in him. Has it impacted how you feel about the Smiths or are you able to separate the past from the present, the band from the man? I find it very difficult to do so.
Johnny Spence, Northern Ireland

It hasn’t impacted how I feel about the Smiths. That’s all I can say about that. I’m certainly able to separate the past from the present. I don’t know whether you can separate the band from the man, but I can separate myself from the man and what I did, so when I do see how disappointed people are, it really does make me sad. But it’s completely out of my control. And I can only really do what is in my control. So I play Smiths songs for reasons that I think are real. And over the years I’ve tried to take care of the catalogue and the releases as much as I was able to. As I would have done anyway. So, you know, I see it the way everybody else sees it. I don’t have any answers. And I don’t want to have any answers.

...

We have both had many casual musical flings but one very strong personal bond in our lives. How has your relationship with the wonderful Angie influenced your creativity, and does she have a favourite guitar?
Bernard Butler, musician

I’ll answer the easy bit first: Angie’s always loved Les Pauls. That’s to do with when we first met – she was 14 and I was 15. We were into Johnny Thunders and the Heartbreakers, so she became bit of a Gibson fan. I’ve had a Gold Top guitar for 20-odd years and I think if I’ve ever got rid of that one, she’d leave me. The important thing I can say about my relationship with Angie is that she made me brave at 15, 16. Not only did Angie know me before everybody else knew me, but she knew me before I knew myself. She was there before the Smiths started: it was me and Angie. And then when that whole thing got together, it was me and Angie and Joe Moss [the late manager of the Smiths]. Not only was I with my soulmate, but I was with somebody who was very smart and very talented.
...

Johnny, out of 10 what would you give me for my turn as Mozzer on Celebrity Stars in Their Eyes? [Hill sang This Charming Man.] PS: if you and the fellas ever decide to regroup and his nibs won’t play ball, I still have the wig – and more importantly, the hearing aid.
Harry Hill, comedian

I sort of remember that. I’m going to have to give Harry a solid two out of 10 for that, and he can make of that what he will. As for the offer, I don’t even know what to make of that…!

 

[Whammy bar]

Funny how some of you are so mad JM does not mention Moz when he was asked specifically to not mention him. Moz has erased himself from the Smiths on purpose.

 

[Anonymous]

Marr is talking about the entire creation, the music that people listened to and fell in love with on Vinyl and on the radio.
You're focused on what is a song, unless i'm getting the wrong end of the stick(which is very possible, lol)

He's not. You're just assuming that's what he's talking about, but he isn't. He's talking about the songs - and not even in the context of studio recordings for that matter, he's talking about live performances of the songs. I'm focused on 'what is a song' because Marr states, in the interview, when discussing the songs of The Smiths, that "I wrote them". Which, clearly, is not true.

 

[Anonymous]

For the same reason I wouldn't get upset with my mother for calling me "daughter" without mentioning I have a Dad, too. It's just obvious and everyone knows it, it doesn't need to be said. Morrissey has previously said "Those songs are more mine than anyone else's", which is far more contentious to my ears. Johnny's comment isn't offensive unless you are seeking to be offended.

Nope, that's a bogus argument. All Marr had to do was say "They're our songs, we wrote them" - not "I wrote them". And the proper analogy would be your mother claiming that she created you on her own, with no assistance from your dad.

It's not a question of whether it needs to be said, it's a question of saying something that's simply not true, of claiming a degree of credit that's not due.

I agree that Morrissey stating "Those songs are more mine than anyone else's" is contentious, but not even more contentious, let alone far more contentious, than Marr denying Morrissey any credit. And, as it happens, I agree with Morrissey. The lyrics and the vocal melody are the song, and they're Morrissey's lyrics and Morrissey's vocal melodies, so they're his songs. That is very obviously the case - the songs of The Smiths exude Morrissey's identity. Listening to Marr singing 'Bigmouth Strikes Again' is just listening to someone doing a cover version. Listening to Morrissey singing 'Bigmouth Strikes Again' even with a different backing band that might not be a patch on The Smiths, it still feels like he's singing his own song.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Morrissey had opportunities to clarify his views long before that 'alignment' started to kill his career, and he didn't. Why? Was he just being stubborn? Did he expect everyone to agree with him?

Well, why then? I shared my reasons why he hasn’t or refuses to, but have you? no.

The fact that he hasn't retracted his comments or at least tried to explain them is an unmitigated disaster,

rush to disaster ? naturally.

leaving the door wipe open for fans to draw their own conclusions

Yes, unfortunately he trusted them, and left it for them to do so.

and vote with their feet.

they should have voted with their hearts and head instead.

 

[CrazyFaceGenes]

Funny how some of you are so mad JM does not mention Moz when he was asked specifically to not mention him. Moz has erased himself from the Smiths on purpose.

I think this was done before the proclamation was issued, Marr seems to be on 24/7 interview duty so there's a backlog.
He genuinely seems to avoid bringing Moz up so hopefully he sticks to that, even though it's tempting to have fun sometimes.

 

[Anonymous]

Funny how some of you are so mad JM does not mention Moz when he was asked specifically to not mention him. Moz has erased himself from the Smiths on purpose.

Bizarre statement. Firstly, JM does mention Morrissey in this interview, and secondly not being mentioned in Marr interviews does not equate to being erased from the history of The Smiths - unless you regard Johnny Marr as now being the band's official historian.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Funny how some of you are so mad JM does not mention Moz when he was asked specifically to not mention him.

Moz has erased himself from the Smiths on purpose.

No. He erased himself from clickbait.

Or at least is trying to. It’s one of the reasons for the request to Johnny in the open letter.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

I think this was done before the proclamation was issued, Marr seems to be on 24/7 interview duty so there's a backlog.

Yes it’s possible that we might not see any post-open letter Marr interviews for a little while.

 

[Surface]

I've no objection to Marr breathing and existing. Or playing guitar and composing music. It's his singing and his songwriting I object to.

If you think it's intrinsically wrong to get into who created the songs of The Smiths, then why do you not object to Marr claiming that he wrote those songs? The credits say 'Morrissey/Marr', not 'Marr'.

I agree the notion that Marr is giving us "permission to love these songs again" us utter crap as far as I'm concerned - although true no doubt in the mind of the twat who wrote it, who probably literally needed Marr's permission to love those songs again rather than, oh I don't know, forming his own opinion on the subject.

Well the solution is easy, don't listen to any of his music.

 

[CrazyFaceGenes]

He's not. You're just assuming that's what he's talking about, but he isn't. He's talking about the songs - and not even in the context of studio recordings for that matter, he's talking about live performances of the songs. I'm focused on 'what is a song' because Marr states, in the interview, when discussing the songs of The Smiths, that "I wrote them". Which, clearly, is not true.

Fair enough, we will just have to disagree then, i think most of the people he's talking to in that piece will understand what he means and who was responsible for what in the Smiths(again, Rourke and Joyce are the only ones who don't really get their dues for their contribution)

 

[Amy]

Well, why then? I shared my reasons why he hasn’t or refuses to, but have you? no.
rush to disaster ? naturally.


Yes, unfortunately he trusted them, and left it for them to do so.
they should have voted with their hearts and head instead.

Trusted fans to do what, though - read his mind? Just ignore his interviews and hope for the best?
I don't know why he has refused to explain himself, no-one does.

But while he has created that 'silence' - you can't expect fans to just ignore the fact that he praised pond life like Anne Marie Waters.
It's not something that can be wriggled out of by saying, "He doesn't mean this stuff really, it can't possibly be true, he might just be confused..." - that stuff doesn't wash anymore. And it won't until Morrissey clarifies his views, himself.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Well the solution is easy, don't listen to any of his music.

Yes, and that also goes for people that criticize Morrissey’s songs and those that co-wrote those songs with him.

 

[vegan cro spirit .777]

and maybe the half dozen Pep lover should go out and finally open up a LePepePew forum
never happen they are all fixated on Moz

>

 

[Amy]

Nope, that's a bogus argument. All Marr had to do was say "They're our songs, we wrote them" - not "I wrote them". And the proper analogy would be your mother claiming that she created you on her own, with no assistance from your dad.

It's not a question of whether it needs to be said, it's a question of saying something that's simply not true, of claiming a degree of credit that's not due.

I agree that Morrissey stating "Those songs are more mine than anyone else's" is contentious, but not even more contentious, let alone far more contentious, than Marr denying Morrissey any credit. And, as it happens, I agree with Morrissey. The lyrics and the vocal melody are the song, and they're Morrissey's lyrics and Morrissey's vocal melodies, so they're his songs. That is very obviously the case - the songs of The Smiths exude Morrissey's identity. Listening to Marr singing 'Bigmouth Strikes Again' is just listening to someone doing a cover version. Listening to Morrissey singing 'Bigmouth Strikes Again' even with a different backing band that might not be a patch on The Smiths, it still feels like he's singing his own song.

With respect, we're going round in circles - I've already said that I don't truck with this "pissing contest" approach to who was the most valuable Smith etc etc, and this idea that Johnny was 'claiming undue credit' is just as bogus to me - you're looking for offence where no offence was meant.

 

[Anonymous]

With respect, we're going round in circles - I've already said that I don't truck with this "pissing contest" approach to who was the most valuable Smith etc etc, and this idea that Johnny was 'claiming undue credit' is just as bogus to me - you're looking for offence where no offence was meant.

Again, it's not a question of looking for offence, or whether you hold with 'pissing contests' or not. Johnny's claiming of undue credit in this interview is not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact. It's there in print. He states, in regards to the songs, "I wrote them". That is claiming undue credit, because it's simply not a true statement. It would be like McCartney talking about the songs of The Beatles and saying "They're my songs. I wrote them".

 

[Dirk Blaggard]

Morrissey needs to categorically and on-record distance himself from right-wing politics once and for all.
He needs to make a very clear statement with words to the effect of 'in my life I've expressed admiration for a number of people from the full range of political spectrums both left and right, but I have these days become exclusively associated with the far-right. I would like to make it abundantly clear that I do not have far-right politics etc.' and ideally include a formal retraction of his support for Anne Waters and For Britain.
Until he does this he will forever be considered, however wrongly, as an intolerant far right w***er with horrible political views. The ball is in his court.

I don't know, I mean .. All he has to do is say THE ONLY reason he suggested people vote for For Britain, and he DID suggest that .
He needs to say the only reason was for animal rights, women rights and maybe tighter immigration

H needs to say , the press keep saying he gets hard for Tommy Robson, but that's not true, he just thought the way Tommy was being treated by the press was out of hand, then say he also thought the same about the presses treatment for Jeremy Corbyn

He needs to say he is sick of the way he is classed as anti-Chinese when he was on about a practice within their culture that made him angry the night before and then say even the interviewer said they didn't think he wasn't being racist (but was happy to let The G knife M to death )
Then state he has toured in Japan a few times and that its a lovely country ( he does like Japan)

Also , draw attention to the fact he isn't a little Englander, like lots of indie bands who only have white indie people in their band and who only go on about merry England
Yet he has written songs on USA, Italy, Scandinavia, and Mexico. He also has a mixed-race band.

Suede or Sleaford Mods etc are favourites of The G. Yet Brett is in his 50s, lives in the country, yet is still happy to have his picture taken near London motorways as if it's the 90s - so fake .
I love Suede, but at this point, its old. The only thing Brett goes on about that's new is that he's a dad. Something loads of people are and lots of people have decided they do not want to be. Yet he based his whole last LP around it. So boring.

Lots of idiots bang out kids, who cares,




Even if he just did this, it would be enough to win some of the old fans back
He won't though. he sends Fiona Pathetic bullet points to write about, a person only the die-hard fans read- which is pointless, as they aren't the ones he needs to win over

I said a couple of years ago, he should have got Russ Brand to sort out an interview with Joe Rogan, that would have placed him in a better position.
The media have tried to take Joe out for over a year now and its not working, because Joe explains what he means, he doesn't let the media get away with creating their own story.
People then see what joes saying and end up supporting him

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Trusted fans to do what, though - read his mind? Just ignore him and hope for the best?

No. I think he trusted that they would have a larger picture and a type of understanding of him after following him or listening to his songs all these years, that they would come to a different conclusion rather than being taken in and swallowing whole the spin and repeated image, that the media had a major role in creating and perpetuating.

I say ‘major role’ because we all, including Morrissey, play some part
large or small, in this creation.

I don't know why he has refused to explain himself, no-one does.

I know, but we speculate here on solo. We give our views and opinions, which are not facts.

But while he has created that 'silence' - you can't expect fans to just ignore the fact that he praised pond life like Anne Marie Waters.

vent or ignore, it’s your choice.

But why did he? Shouldn’t we know why in order to help us come to a fair and balanced conclusion? I think so.

We may never know why. But there has been varying opinions about why he would, even if that doesn’t bring us any closer to the truth, regardless of what you, I or others believe is the truth.

It's not something that can be wriggled out of by saying, "He doesn't mean this stuff really, it can't possibly be true, he might just be confused..." - that stuff doesn't wash anymore.

Nothing washes. These are all opinions, even if you agree with someones opinion on this matter.

And it won't until Morrissey clarifies his views, himself.

Sure. But if he does, it’s gonna be a long wait. And I don’t care, either way.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

With respect, we're going round in circles - I've already said that I don't truck with this "pissing contest" approach to who was the most valuable Smith etc etc, and this idea that Johnny was 'claiming undue credit' is just as bogus to me - you're looking for offence where no offence was meant.

Again, it's not a question of looking for offence, or whether you hold with 'pissing contests' or not. Johnny's claiming of undue credit in this interview is not a matter of opinion, it's a matter of fact. It's there in print. He states, in regards to the songs, "I wrote them". That is claiming undue credit, because it's simply not a true statement. It would be like McCartney talking about the songs of The Beatles and saying "They're my songs. I wrote them".

I think Marr is speaking to Smiths fans that will know what he means. It’s a ‘goes without saying’ comment, that he knows that his fans know that he co-wrote those with Morrissey.

 

[Morrissey's left nut]

Morrissey needs to categorically and on-record distance himself from right-wing politics once and for all.
He needs to make a very clear statement with words to the effect of 'in my life I've expressed admiration for a number of people from the full range of political spectrums both left and right, but I have these days become exclusively associated with the far-right. I would like to make it abundantly clear that I do not have far-right politics etc.' and ideally include a formal retraction of his support for Anne Waters and For Britain.
Until he does this he will forever be considered, however wrongly, as an intolerant far right w***er with horrible political views. The ball is in his court.

Do you ever stop to think that he could- but he doesn't want to because he firmly believes in his stances? I mean, if it waddles & quacks, feathery arse- it's reasonable to call it a duck.

 

[Amy]

Do you ever stop to think that he could- but he doesn't want to because he firmly believes in his stances? I mean, if it waddles & quacks, feathery arse- it's reasonable to call it a duck.

It's too awful to contemplate. I'd rather believe that M was having a complete mental breakdown, than that he's firmly and willingly siding with these horrors.