The Guardian: "A Light That Never Goes Out: Why The Smiths Are Eternally Influential" by Shaad D'Souza (June 1, 2023)

The Guardian has another Smiths article today.

Full text below.

In a second feature marking 40 years of the Smiths, fans including Andy Burnham and Connie Constance consider how and why the band have endured.

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John Peel once described the Smiths as “just another band that arrived from nowhere with a very clear and strong identity”. Unlike other bands, he said, the Smiths weren’t trying to be T Rex or the Doors; they were simply the Smiths, a group whose aesthetic lineage was curiously hard to trace.

What they left in their wake, of course, is far easier to map out: there are few indie bands since who don’t, at least in some way, take their cues from Morrissey, Johnny Marr, Mike Joyce and the recently departed Andy Rourke. As far back as their 1983 debut, the Smiths were inadvertently shaping ideas about how indie should interact with fandom, masculinity and the mainstream music industry, and writing music that would be referenced and reinterpreted by generations to come; over the past 40 years, you can see their aesthetic and spiritual influence in everyone from the Stone Roses to Oasis and the 1975.

The Smiths’ influence is so widespread that it can be hard to pinpoint what, exactly, their specific legacy has been: even decades later, nobody really plays guitar like Marr and nobody really writes lyrics or sings like Morrissey. Instead, there’s some kind of ineffable vibe, a sensibility that can be felt. John Reed, director of catalogue at Cherry Red Records and the compiler of Scared to Get Happy, an exhaustive compilation of 80s British indie music, says that the band “became a template – something either sounds like the Smiths or it doesn’t. There’s maybe only a dozen other British bands who you could say that about.” Instead, it’s easier to speak to what they offered when they first debuted, and what made them go from, as Reed says, “zeros to heroes overnight”.

Tony Fletcher, author of A Light That Never Goes Out: The Enduring Saga of the Smiths remembers that the band offered “a sense of positivity at a time when Britain felt really f***ed. They were offering this sort of exuberant, joyous positivity; they were working-class lads who didn’t mind smiling.”

Although Morrissey’s lyrics, now, are seen as uniquely pessimistic, Fletcher says that at the time there was a “liberating” feeling listening to the Smiths, given the way they brought a comic, pop-focused lens to the grimness of life as a young person in the midst of Thatcher-era Britain. “Their politics were very clear, but they weren’t coming out and apologising for being working class, and they weren’t coming out with the kind of militant statements that some other bands did,” he says. “Morrissey’s line ‘I’ve never had a job / Because I’ve never wanted one’ [on You’ve Got Everything Now] – that was a seminal line early on at a time of great [sic] employment.”

The interplay of gloom and light, of Morrissey’s biting lyrics and Marr’s bright guitars, are what has made the band so enduring for successive generations of British indie musicians, says Connie Constance. The 28-year-old Watford musician counts the Smiths as one of her biggest reference points when it comes to guitar sounds, along with the Clash. “The sound has all the negativity that I think Brits just naturally have,” she says. “It has this gritty, I’m not bothered, moany thing, while having this beautiful layer on top that makes everything feel like it’s gonna be all right.”

Although Constance first engaged with the Smiths as a child, she didn’t realise until later the impact they had on all the other bands she had grown up listening to. “I was listening to their back catalogue and being like, ‘Oh my gosh, this sound is so laced into all of British indie rock,’ from that moment onwards.”

Greater Manchester mayor Andy Burnham, a longtime Smiths fan, remembers that the band “came along at a time when the north-west of England was probably at its lowest ever ebb in recent history. It seemed to me to be a recurrent theme in Morrissey’s lyrics that you can kind of aspire to be more than this. You don’t have to be dragged down by your situation or circumstances.” In Burnham’s eyes, the band gave the region a rare sense of cachet. “When I got to university, people would ask, ‘You’ve seen the Smiths?’ and it was like, OK, I’ve got something that you want – that was important, in terms of building a sense of confidence and ambition.”

Richard King, author of the book How Soon Is Now: The Mavericks and Madmen Who Made Independent Music 1975-2005, says the Smiths created a give and take with their fans that felt fresh. “Morrissey wasn’t an adolescent, but he did seem to know how to articulate the extremes of adolescence, and there were very few people who did,” he says. “There was a sense of generosity and value in every release – the picture sleeves, the tone they used, the B-sides: everything they did had this value that you couldn’t find anywhere else – and it felt like it was coming directly from the band. It meant that the emotional investment that you put in as an adolescent, into the songs and their meaning, you felt like that investment was returned by the band in their quality control and their look.”

Although it had been common to pledge sartorial fealty to a genre or subculture – such as punk or goth – Smiths fans, even before they had released an album, dressed like the Smiths. Although other artists had developed a similar aesthetic sensibility previously, most of them, such as Orange Juice’s Edwyn Collins, took their cues from 1950s Americana, with leather jackets, sunglasses and immaculate quiffs. Morrissey combined the 50s hair with what Reed calls a “studenty” look – raincoats bought from charity shops and vintage stores. That look, now, has calcified into what might be termed the classic indie boy aesthetic: T-shirts and shirts tucked into 501 jeans, thick-rimmed glasses, mismatched or ill-fitting outerwear.

Fletcher saw the band in late 1983, and remembers seeing that “fans were already dressed like them – in London, people were carrying flowers in their back pockets. From 1984, Morrissey had the big overcoat thing, and suddenly you just started seeing people like that. It was like some of them were just coming out of their shell – they were very bookish people who suddenly realised that bookish was fashionable, and they didn’t have to apologise for their NHS specs and being a bit dishevelled and literate and into pop music.”

Burnham remembers Manchester’s Affleck’s Palace as being a centre of the Morrissey aesthetic. “Morrissey created it, but people would go there to replicate it,” he says. “It was vintage 501 jeans before they were as ubiquitous as they became, cardigans, stuff that was deliberately old-school looking. It was kind of an outsider look – it became anti-cool fashion before that existed in our heads.”

He recalls the Smiths acting as a kind of codex for broader culture. When the band performed on the South Bank Show, for example: “I remember everyone videotaping it, and it really laid out a hinterland of references. People started reading Oscar Wilde – it kind of did broaden your horizons, liking the Smiths.” The band’s iconography and music was so strong that despite’s Morrissey’s aesthetic and political shifts after he went solo – on 1988’s Bengali in Platforms he suggested south Asian migrants didn’t belong in the UK, and by 1992 he was draping himself in the union jack – many fans can easily separate the Smiths off in their minds.

The freedom that the band seemed to offer their audience – to remove themselves from staid ideas of how to look, dress or think – was revolutionary at the time. King remembers the way Marr and Morrissey interacted on stage, and the amount of fun they seemed to be having, feeling radically new. “The two of them dancing together as men, but both being very feminine and, in Johnny’s case, quite androgynous, was incredibly powerful,” he says. “It felt to an adolescent audience that it was giving them agency to act differently – two men dancing together not in an overtly homoerotic or political way, but just having fun together in their own unique way.”

Moreover, Morrissey pioneered a musical expression that wasn’t geared towards heterosexual romance – or even romance in general. “To have somebody that wasn’t singing either, ‘I’m in love with you,’ or, ‘You broke up with me,’ but singing, ‘I’m not really sure if I want love, I don’t know if I want romance’ – he managed to encapsulate feelings that so many people had,” says Fletcher. “I don’t think anybody had come along with that.”

Constance says that Morrissey’s less explicitly masculine presentation has “allowed a softer side of men in indie bands to come through” in the years since. “I feel like men can share a bit more in the indie world, and they can sing and get things off their chest a bit more, rather than being just this like brutal anarchist punk or superstar over-sexual glam-rock male,” she says. “Someone like [the 1975’s] Matty Healy – Morrissey was the first of that [archetype].”

“Like a lot of the best bands of that time,” says Reed, the Smiths’ “stature has grown – the music has spread around the world. British indie music was massively influential on music that came out of North America, South America, Australia, all around, probably more than in the UK. That isn’t specific to the Smiths, but the Smiths are a big part of that.”

“They proved you could be an indie band, make the charts and be successful,” says Fletcher. “Do things on your own terms, be controversial, make great music, be proud of guitars, not be luddites. You could be all of those things.”
 
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Yes, could definitely pass for a midget in high waisted jeans. I’m an expert in this field.
scanty are you a midget expert or a high waisted jeans expert,intriguing stuff.
 
I honestly liked this article, more so than yesterda’s (which wasn’t bad). The different contributors together sum it up so nicely: it was not one or two things that stood out in the case of the Smiths, like a fascinating voice or virtuose guitarist. It’s nearly everything that was setting them apart. There’s of couse Johnny’ guitar playing and Morrissey’s unique humour and singing style and the interplay between them, but also their looks, clothes, sleeves, literary references, musical references, their outreach to all sorts of misfits (not just LGTB community), …. Can you name me another band as all-rounded as the Smiths were ? And yes, I am also glad to see the recent re-appreciation of Andy’s bass playing and of how that contributed to the unique Smiths sound.
 
I remember when I first started hearin' The Smiths,
I'd listen to a song and say "that's their best song".
Then I'd listen to another song and say "turns out
this one here's their best song".
Then I'd listen to another song and say "well whata
ya know, guess this is their best song".
Pretty soon I had a revealin' revelation and realized,
"all these songs are great!".
🎶👯‍♂️🎵👯‍♀️🎶
 
This bit is incredibly homophobic:

“The two of them dancing together as men, but both being very feminine and, in Johnny’s case, quite androgynous, was incredibly powerful,” he says. “It felt to an adolescent audience that it was giving them agency to act differently – two men dancing together not in an overtly homoerotic or political way, but just having fun together in their own unique way.”

Morrissey was ok as long as he was feminine & it wasn't "overtly" homoerotic.
How exactly is that homophobic?
 
This bit is incredibly homophobic:

“The two of them dancing together as men, but both being very feminine and, in Johnny’s case, quite androgynous, was incredibly powerful,” he says. “It felt to an adolescent audience that it was giving them agency to act differently – two men dancing together not in an overtly homoerotic or political way, but just having fun together in their own unique way.”

Morrissey was ok as long as he was feminine & it wasn't "overtly" homoerotic.
You find that homophobic? f***ing hell :ROFLMAO:
 
I remember when I first started hearin' The Smiths,
I'd listen to a song and say "that's their best song".
Then I'd listen to another song and say "turns out
this one here's their best song".
Then I'd listen to another song and say "well whata
ya know, guess this is their best song".
Pretty soon I had a revealin' revelation and realized,
"all these songs are great!".
🎶👯‍♂️🎵👯‍♀️🎶

We are truly blessed to have The Smiths. Song for song, there's no better artist. There are many (not most) GREAT artists of course, but none were as complete as The Smiths.

It's not just about the wonderful music either, the way the covers/sleeves looked were like nothing else. Though, the music....the stories in the songs, the multiple melodies throughout with drums proper, driving and tastefully done. So many styles fused into one, and this they never tired of. All of this takes you to a different place, like great artists can, but part of The Smiths are with you forever. And the part that stays with you has always been improving your life, you've grown from it.
 
I honestly liked this article, more so than yesterda’s (which wasn’t bad). The different contributors together sum it up so nicely: it was not one or two things that stood out in the case of the Smiths, like a fascinating voice or virtuose guitarist. It’s nearly everything that was setting them apart. There’s of couse Johnny’ guitar playing and Morrissey’s unique humour and singing style and the interplay between them, but also their looks, clothes, sleeves, literary references, musical references, their outreach to all sorts of misfits (not just LGTB community), …. Can you name me another band as all-rounded as the Smiths were ? And yes, I am also glad to see the recent re-appreciation of Andy’s bass playing and of how that contributed to the unique Smiths sound.
They were the perfect band. Had one thing changed it likely wouldn’t have been the same. They caught the proverbial lightning in a bottle as a collective.
 
They were the perfect band. Had one thing changed it likely wouldn’t have been the same. They caught the proverbial lightning in a bottle as a collective.
Were they the perfect band? It's very easy to become nostalgic. No band is perfect. Don't get me wrong - I love The Smiths. But there are lots of Morrissey albums I love just as much - if not more.
 
Were they the perfect band? It's very easy to become nostalgic. No band is perfect. Don't get me wrong - I love The Smiths. But there are lots of Morrissey albums I love just as much - if not more.
For me, they WERE the perfect band… they encapsulated everything I was looking for in both style and substance. Musically and lyrically they were unmatched in meeting my preferences. And of course it is just a personal preference, but I’m comfortable saying it most definitely isn’t colored by nostalgia 😊
 
We are truly blessed to have The Smiths. Song for song, there's no better artist. There are many (not most) GREAT artists of course, but none were as complete as The Smiths.

It's not just about the wonderful music either, the way the covers/sleeves looked were like nothing else. Though, the music....the stories in the songs, the multiple melodies throughout with drums proper, driving and tastefully done. So many styles fused into one, and this they never tired of. All of this takes you to a different place, like great artists can, but part of The Smiths are with you forever. And the part that stays with you has always been improving your life, you've grown from it.
One of the things I love the most about The Smiths is just how very short their lifespan was. If you're going to trap lightning in a bottle as you put it then it kind of feels right that they only lasted for five years. That glorious strike of lightning obviously had some electricity left in it as Morrissey embarked on a momentous solo career like three minutes later.

I thank the music gods that they aren't one of those bands that went on for too long and then split and reformed to make a terrible album and split and reformed and so on...
 
Nice article, as was the previous one, except for the digs at Morrissey, which are completely unnecessary, if someone is writing about the music and the importance of The Smiths for the British, as well as for the worldwide indie music culture fans.

I love music. So I love many bands, singers and musicians, but The Smiths are still the band of my life. Even though I'am South American and grew up very far from their local culture and the matters they sang about.

There are elements, ingredients in The Smiths' music that transcend space, time and culture, as my love can honestly attest.

Congratulations to Morrissey, John Marr, Andy Rourke (in memoriam) and Mike Joyce for The Smiths 40th anniversary. ❤️❤️❤️❤️

VIVA THE SMITHS !!!!
 
Thoroughly enjoyable read.

Affleck’s has since been run over by people who have stinking ego issues and codswallop.

M and The Smiths will always be ours because we created them, our environment did and nothing and no one can be like us Northerners, no matter how hard the rest of you UK lot try because only we knew and know and feel and felt.
 
Thoroughly enjoyable read.

Affleck’s has since been run over by people who have stinking ego issues and codswallop.

M and The Smiths will always be ours because we created them, our environment did and nothing and no one can be like us Northerners, no matter how hard the rest of you UK lot try because only we knew and know and feel and felt.


The north produced The Fall, the north produced The Stone Roses, etc. Listen to how different all these bands sound to each other.

So how much is the role of the environment
playing into this? It is important, but I believe it’s the mind of the artist that transcends one’s local and narrow surroundings. The way the art moves the individual belongs to everyone, no one ‘owns’ it.
 
We are truly blessed to have The Smiths. Song for song, there's no better artist. There are many (not most) GREAT artists of course, but none were as complete as The Smiths.

It's not just about the wonderful music either, the way the covers/sleeves looked were like nothing else. Though, the music....the stories in the songs, the multiple melodies throughout with drums proper, driving and tastefully done. So many styles fused into one, and this they never tired of. All of this takes you to a different place, like great artists can, but part of The Smiths are with you forever. And the part that stays with you has always been improving your life, you've grown from it.

When they got the music and artwork combinin' like that,
it's what ya call a "package deal".
:thumb:
 
I'll refer you to The Guardian again:

FIFTEEN years after Tom Robinson announced that he was 'glad to be gay', homosexuality is still a stigma in the music business. Despite the large number of gay people working behind the scenes in the industry, gay pop stars are still discouraged from being open about their sexual orientation.
Even now, just the suggestion of homosexuality is thought to have a negative impact on record sales. When, two years ago, The Face magazine published a photo of a T-shirt imprinted with Jason Donovan's face and the words 'Queer as f***', the teen idol immediately sued for libel (and won). Moreover, Tom Robinson, one of the few crusading gay stars, has taken refuge in marriage (to a woman) and fatherhood. The number of stars who are openly gay can still be counted on the fingers of one hand: Elton John, Boy George, Mark Almond, Jimmy Sommerville and kd lang. Others, such as the Pet Shop Boys and Right Said Fred, may camp it up but have never publicly announced a sexual preference. Sommerville excepted, these people, along with seventies disco preeners The Village People and the late Freddie Mercury are accepted by the business as colourful eccentrics rather than as gay men and women. They've been allowed to be homosexual as long as their benign with it.

(Caroline Sullivan, the Guardian, 17 December 1993)
That article you've quoted is clearly rueing the fact that there is (or was, at time of writing in 1993) a stigma about being gay.

You seem to be interpreting it as The Guardian celebrating the fact that there were so few openly gay pop stars, which is the complete opposite of what the journalist is saying.
 
The north produced The Fall, the north produced The Stone Roses, etc. Listen to how different all these bands sound to each other.

So how much is the role of the environment
playing into this? It is important, but I believe it’s the mind of the artist that transcends one’s local and narrow surroundings. The way the art moves the individual belongs to everyone, no one ‘owns’ it.
That’s fair enough as you feel as you feel however, they (none of them for that matter) wouldn’t have been The Smiths had they come from Colombia or California, would they now? And M knows it himself.
 
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That’s fair enough as you feel as you feel however, they (none of them for that matter) wouldn’t have been The Smiths had they come from Colombia or California, would they now? And M knows it himself.

Yes of course, not as we know them. But with artists like Morrissey and Marr leading the band, they could have been just as wonderful coming from anywhere. They would just be creating and pulling inspiration from a different locality and background.
 
How beautiful and well summed up;
Richard King, author of the book How Soon Is Now: The Mavericks and Madmen Who Made Independent Music 1975-2005, says the Smiths created a give and take with their fans that felt fresh. “Morrissey wasn’t an adolescent, but he did seem to know how to articulate the extremes of adolescence, and there were very few people who did,” he says. “There was a sense of generosity and value in every release – the picture sleeves, the tone they used, the B-sides: everything they did had this value that you couldn’t find anywhere else – and it felt like it was coming directly from the band. It meant that the emotional investment that you put in as an adolescent, into the songs and their meaning, you felt like that investment was returned by the band in their quality control and their look.”
I’ve read better stuff. Anything with the word ‘Maverick’ deserves the bin. But it wasn’t always the case.
 
The stuff you quoted from 30 years ago I also don't know if I agree with. 'Coming out as gay' just isn't for everyone - and for all sorts of reasons, not just internalised homophobia. Some people just might be bisexual. Some people just don't want to be labelled - it's all just sex, after all. Some men may be married or in a committed 'straight' relationship, but having sex with men on the side - 'women for children, men for pleasure' is not an unusual saying in some Muslim countries. Some men are 'gay for pay'. Some men have sex with other men in prison, because there is no access to the opposite sex. Some men might be in a job that makes coming out impossible. Some people may have religious doubts about expressing their sexuality. For this reason most sexual health services, for example, don't use the word 'gay'. The accepted term in sexual health services is 'men who have sex with men'. That term is used because they recognise that 'men who have sex with men' (MSM) is a much larger group than 'gay men'. In fact, globally speaking, out and proud gay men would make up a very tiny minority of MSM. That will probably always be the case. In the great sweep of history feeling obliged to 'come out' as gay is a mere blip of recent history. Perhaps it will be a passing fad? Moz certainly would seem to have expressed the hope that it is. There are just human beings - and human sexuality. Nothing more. Nothing less.
She has a point though.
 

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