Another court case debate

[Was I ever any good]

I think if somebody just about made my mother and sister homeless , then I’d throw the 4king pint all over them.

 

[Amy]

I think if somebody just about made my mother and sister homeless , then I’d throw the 4king pint all over them.

The only person who put M's family at risk of 'homelessness' was Moz himself, by refusing to pay Mike what he was ordered to pay.

 

[MoneyChangesEverything]

The only person who put M's family at risk of 'homelessness' was Moz himself, by refusing to pay Mike what he was ordered to pay.

BUT BUT BUT Joyce should count himself lucky to be able to be in the same band as the Godlike, Flawless, Perfect Moz!!!!

 

[Young And Alive]

The only person who put M's family at risk of 'homelessness' was Moz himself, by refusing to pay Mike what he was ordered to pay.

This is correct, sadly.

Rightly or wrongly, Joyce won the court case. Morrissey appealed but lost. It was time to cough up, lick his wounds and move on, which is what Johnny did.

 

[Crisstti]

This is correct, sadly.

Rightly or wrongly, Joyce won the court case. Morrissey appealed but lost. It was time to cough up, lick his wounds and move on, which is what Johnny did.

Still, if Joyce was lying he’s surely still responsible.

 

[Amy]

Still, if Joyce was lying he’s surely still responsible.

Morrissey and Marr couldn't prove that Mike was lying beyond he said/she said conversations so it's irrelevant. Ultimately the court decision stood and Morrissey should have paid up, but he tried to outrun it. The lien that Moz claims was put on his mother and sister's houses was a direct result of his non-payment.

 

[Crisstti]

Morrissey and Marr couldn't prove that Mike was lying beyond he said/she said conversations so it's irrelevant. Ultimately the court decision stood and Morrissey should have paid up, but he tried to outrun it and dragged out the whole saga for years.

It's irrelevant only in a legal sense.

I for sure think that, for his own sanity, he should have just paid up and let the whole thing go once the legal judgement was final...

 

[Amy]

It's irrelevant only in a legal sense.

I for sure think that, for his own sanity, he should have just paid up and let the whole thing go once the legal judgement was final...

That's the only sense that matters.

 

[Crisstti]

That's the only sense that matters.

I beg to disagree.

 

[Amy]

I beg to disagree.

You said that "if Mike was lying" then somehow he would still be responsible for endangering the M family homes. He isn't responsible - even if he was lying - because all Moz had to do to avoid that lien was to pay up. That's why it's not relevant.

 

[Tessa Ray]

I beg to disagree.

Disagree with reality? The fact is that Morrissey left the country rather than deal with the legal consequences of losing that case and left his family to deal with it.

 

[Eldritch]

I think if somebody just about made my mother and sister homeless , then I’d throw the 4king pint all over them.

In a scenario like that you probably should have paid that somebody the money he is legally entitled to.

 

[Surface]

Should this be moved to off topic, doesn’t feel right discussing Morrissey and Mikes court case in a thread about Andy Rourke passing away.

 

[Crisstti]

You said that "if Mike was lying" then somehow he would still be responsible for endangering the M family homes. He isn't responsible - even if he was lying - because all Moz had to do to avoid that lien was to pay up. That's why it's not relevant.

He would still be responsible in a moral sense, since he started the whole thing and would have also sought payment through these properties. All hypothetical of course, we don't really know.

PS I agree this discussion should probably be moved to from this thread.

 

[Surface]

He would still be responsible in a moral sense, since he started the whole thing and would have also sought payment through these properties. All hypothetical of course, we don't really know.

PS I agree this discussion should probably be moved to from this thread.

This should be moved and a bit odd that the moderators haven't done so.

You're right, he did start the whole thing but the courts decided in Mike's favour twice, it was Morrissey who for whatever reason didn't pay what he should, so like anyone else would do Mike went after his assets.

Morrissey responded with a statement on True To You three days later revealing that Joyce had received £215,000 each from Marr and Morrissey in 1997, along with Marr's final back-payment of £260,000 in 2001. Morrissey failed to make his final payment because, he said, he was overseas in 2001 and did not receive the paperwork. Joyce obtained a default judgement against Morrissey, revised his outstanding claim to £688,000, and secured orders to claim a hold of the singer's income and assets in the UK. This was a source of ongoing inconvenience and grievance to Morrissey, who estimated that Joyce had cost him at least £1,515,000 in recovered royalties and legal fees up to 30 November 2005.

 

[Crisstti]

This should be moved and a bit odd that the moderators haven't done so.

You're right, he did start the whole thing but the courts decided in Mike's favour twice, it was Morrissey who for whatever reason didn't pay what he should, so like anyone else would do Mike went after his assets.

Morrissey responded with a statement on True To You three days later revealing that Joyce had received £215,000 each from Marr and Morrissey in 1997, along with Marr's final back-payment of £260,000 in 2001. Morrissey failed to make his final payment because, he said, he was overseas in 2001 and did not receive the paperwork. Joyce obtained a default judgement against Morrissey, revised his outstanding claim to £688,000, and secured orders to claim a hold of the singer's income and assets in the UK. This was a source of ongoing inconvenience and grievance to Morrissey, who estimated that Joyce had cost him at least £1,515,000 in recovered royalties and legal fees up to 30 November 2005.

It seems pretty outrageous if that's how it went. Why would the outstanding claim against Morrissey be so much higher than against Marr? Just accrued interest? Also, I don't know how the UK legal system works, but a default judgement? One would also think there would have been lawyers who could have been notified on his behalf.

If Moz didn't pay that amount then, it would of course have continued to grow...

 

[Was I ever any good]

It seems pretty outrageous if that's how it went. Why would the outstanding claim against Morrissey be so much higher than against Marr? Just accrued interest? Also, I don't know ow the UK legal system works, but a default judgement? One would also think there would have been layers who could have been notified on his behalf.

If Moz didn't pay that amount then, it would of course have continued to grow...

Join the club ….. nobody here in the UK knows how the legal system works either.

Morrissey was stitched up like a kipper….
Probably because he had lashed out at the British establishment for years.

If you Gob off for long enough in merry olde England they will come down on you like a ton of bricks.

 

[Surface]

It seems pretty outrageous if that's how it went. Why would the outstanding claim against Morrissey be so much higher than against Marr? Just accrued interest? Also, I don't know ow the UK legal system works, but a default judgement? One would also think there would have been layers who could have been notified on his behalf.

If Moz didn't pay that amount then, it would of course have continued to grow...

Marr paid when he was meant to and made his final payment in 2001 Morrissey didn't, he lost his appeal in 1998, from what I understand Morrissey didn't pay until 2005 (I my be wrong)

 

[Young And Alive]

This should be moved and a bit odd that the moderators haven't done so.

You're right, he did start the whole thing but the courts decided in Mike's favour twice, it was Morrissey who for whatever reason didn't pay what he should, so like anyone else would do Mike went after his assets.

Morrissey responded with a statement on True To You three days later revealing that Joyce had received £215,000 each from Marr and Morrissey in 1997, along with Marr's final back-payment of £260,000 in 2001. Morrissey failed to make his final payment because, he said, he was overseas in 2001 and did not receive the paperwork. Joyce obtained a default judgement against Morrissey, revised his outstanding claim to £688,000, and secured orders to claim a hold of the singer's income and assets in the UK. This was a source of ongoing inconvenience and grievance to Morrissey, who estimated that Joyce had cost him at least £1,515,000 in recovered royalties and legal fees up to 30 November 2005.

The excuse about him being overseas in 2001 seems rather flimsy to me.

I am quite sure Morrissey would have had a UK based solicitor at the time, especially given that he had unfinished legal business with Joyce.

Had it been Morrissey pursuing Joyce for money, you can bet your bottom dollar that Morrissey would have used all legal means available to make him cough up. So I don't get why he takes issue with Joyce doing the same thing.

It still baffles me why the four of them weren't given contracts to sign in 1982 clarifying what each member would earn from the band. They may have been young and naive, but Joe Moss and Geoff Travis weren't.

 

[Crisstti]

The excuse about him being overseas in 2001 seems rather flimsy to me.

I am quite sure Morrissey would have had a UK based solicitor at the time, especially given that he had unfinished legal business with Joyce.

Had it been Morrissey pursuing Joyce for money, you can bet your bottom dollar that Morrissey would have used all legal means available to make him cough up. So I don't get why he takes issue with Joyce doing the same thing.

It still baffles me why the four of them weren't given contracts to sign in 1982 clarifying what each member would earn from the band. They may have been young and naive, but Joe Moss and Geoff Travis weren't.

That seems odd me as well. At least here, normally your attorney would be notified on your behalf. But if there was a default judgement, then it seems he did not have an attorney representing him on this matter then.

Well, he takes issue because he did NOT consider that he owed Joyce any money.

You make a very good point in your last paragraph. Joe Moss for sure should have insisted that contracts were clear and signed…