Post Whatever You Are Thinking At This Very Moment

[Redacted]

When I used to work for one of the bands I worked for, there was this grimey woman who used to hang around all the time, she was a groupie. No one wanted to be around her unless one of the guys wanted a quick bj or something, so she used to follow everyone around trying to insert herself into conversations or run along after people who were going to grab a bite to eat and invite herself. There were so many times my husband and I would be hanging around before a show at the venue talking about something and she would just come over to us and stare at us until one of us acknowledged her. Eventually, we just started walking away from her and she would not get the hint, like at all. She always had weed on her and she was always high and she would start telling me things like well, I smoked too much weed and I don't want to drive home and I will have to sleep in my car tonight if you don't let me crash at your house. I told her she really needs to learn how to plan ahead and refused to let her near my house. She was sort of a low level person, worked in a deli, complained about it all the time, rented a room, and literally had no life skills. She was the underachiever in her family, her brothers are both highly educated and have prestigious careers. She would never stop trying to start trouble among the people around the band and even with the band, everything with her was drama. I was completely avoiding her for a while and it was just so pathetic how she would constantly try to get my attention and then it got really weird. She started thinking things I did were about her, even tho I was completely avoiding her. She would make up scenarios in her head about me doing xyz and it was because of her and repeating this to people who became alarmed and started to tell me about it. Things got weirder and weirder and then one day I was at a party and someone asked me how things were going with the band. I mentioned this woman and it turns out that the person I am talking to has mutual friends with her and gave me a gigantic ton of dirt on her and I used every bit of it and got rid of her. Life is funny sometimes.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

When I used to work for one of the bands I worked for, there was this grimey woman who used to hang around all the time, she was a groupie. No one wanted to be around her unless one of the guys wanted a quick bj or something, so she used to follow everyone around trying to insert herself into conversations or run along after people who were going to grab a bite to eat and invite herself. There were so many times my husband and I would be hanging around before a show at the venue talking about something and she would just come over to us and stare at us until one of us acknowledged her. Eventually, we just started walking away from her and she would not get the hint, like at all. She always had weed on her and she was always high and she would start telling me things like well, I smoked too much weed and I don't want to drive home and I will have to sleep in my car tonight if you don't let me crash at your house. I told her she really needs to learn how to plan ahead and refused to let her near my house. She was sort of a low level person, worked in a deli, complained about it all the time, rented a room, and literally had no life skills. She was the underachiever in her family, her brothers are both highly educated and have prestigious careers. She would never stop trying to start trouble among the people around the band and even with the band, everything with her was drama. I was completely avoiding her for a while and it was just so pathetic how she would constantly try to get my attention and then it got really weird. She started thinking things I did were about her, even tho I was completely avoiding her. She would make up scenarios in her head about me doing xyz and it was because of her and repeating this to people who became alarmed and started to tell me about it. Things got weirder and weirder and then one day I was at a party and someone asked me how things were going with the band. I mentioned this woman and it turns out that the person I am talking to has mutual friends with her and gave me a gigantic ton of dirt on her and I used every bit of it and got rid of her. Life is funny sometimes.

sometimes i think you are legit an actual psycho. and im not one of those people who throws that word around for everyone they meet online either (although i have met some weird f***ers online)

 

[Amy]

I don't expect you to understand though, AMY!! (which is why I'm loathd to engage in this discussion with you, if you havent noticed!!)

Why? You're entitled to your opinion. For me it makes no sense to say you're in favour of suicide, but not of assisted suicide - in both cases it's the same person making a real value judgement on whether their life is worth living.

 

[Amy]

Because I always know EXACTLY what to expect from you, Amy!! Every time!!

Which is a shame, because I was just trying to engage with you in a civil way and I agree with some of your points, but you went back to your usual glib, rude crap about "poverty of spirit". I don't see anything valuable in suffering in a hospice, for weeks on end, etc, or wrong in wanting to skip that suffering if you can.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

Why? You're entitled to your opinion. For me it makes no sense to say you're in favour of suicide, but not of assisted suicide - in both cases it's the same person making a real value judgement on whether their life is worth living.

okay, im sorry, i just thought you would be closed to my opinion, having already formed yours and thinking you know it all!

like i said it's about having that apparatus in place in society, where other people can look at a persons life and confirm "yeah maybe you should die." it's a very bad, ugly precedent to set. i dont like the idea that happy lives are more valuable and more worth living than miserable lives. because a miserable life might give the person the opportunity to face their misery and suffering with dignity and nobility of spirit, and in my opinion, that would make the suffering worth it. THAT is worth more than comfort. and that is what makes a life worth living. i also just believe in acceptance. millions of people have had painful deaths and if that is what nature has prescribed for us to experience i dont see why we shouldnt just accept that. i also believe that pain can be a beautiful integrative experience, and maybe one that is necessary in the experience of death. there are other emergent properties of pain, besides the pain itself, like the euphoria a person experiences when drowning, or the sense of warmth one experiences when freezing to death, that might be worthwhile and necessary to experience. and i think that in the case of animals, they are probably more in tune with all of this than humans, so i imagine they're probably more stoic and accepting when it comes to their own pain than we give them credit for.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

also if you're going to commit suicide it should be a deeply personal wordless thing, between you and yourself. no one else should be involved in it.

 

[Barking]

I am as divided about the question of euthanasia as I am about all the other questions that concern the control humans exert on others' lives.

What right do humans have to shorten lives in any circumstance? Or... To spay and neuter (I 'd like to see them try that with me!) ? etc etc. Or to deny a woman the right to abort? Or to sentence anyone to death?

Yes I think choosing for others is basically wrong, but I do think euthanasia with pets can be the right and even christian thing to do sometimes. Without a human most animals would have a much shorter life expectancy. How long would most pets last in the modern world? The time it takes for a chicken to cross a road and not get to the other side, for most of them. Let's not forget that there's nothing natural about most pets' lives, and nothing naural about most pets' deaths. It's not "in the order of things "most of the time. It's a car, it's cancer from a chemical, it's a swallowed lego, etc. For a lot of animals, death is man -made anyway. So why not take the final responsibility, since most animals are forced to live in the humans' world, and not their own?

And anyway, see, it's nice to be governed by principles but these often crumble when faced with the mess that is reality. Would I give a hand to a human on their deathbed? Would Hitler let a very sick German sheperd suffer for weeks? And which one of us would be frowned upon for speeding things up?

I guess what I'm saying is, I wouldn't like to have to decide.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Tonight
My assistant
Will pass among
You

His cap will
Be empty

Hey non-e
Non-e

The most intimate
Personal choices
And requests
Central to your
Personal dignity

Will be sung





‘Like everyone I know, I am torn about this subject. I understand the problem and why some people want it but I’m very frightened about the idea of people engineering our deaths in a technological way. That’s the bothering thing about it to me. So that’s why I recorded it because it’s a current issue but then again it’s also one of those timeless subjects. It’s absolutely brutal, especially in the “Lullaby lullaby” section where I’m absolutely screaming it so there’s no vocal quality at all in it. It’s not a quiet lullaby it’s an absurd lullaby because I’m shouting it.*’

 

[Lucifer Sam]

"Destiny for some is to save lives
But destiny for some is to end lives ... "

 

[Lucifer Sam]

@Ketamine Sun , I really like your new signature gif. You've chosen a good one. The movement is gentle and soothing, and there's no swift kick when it restarts. And of course, a great image.

 

[Barking]

"Destiny for some is to save lives
But destiny for some is to end lives ... "

Destiny for some could be to do both...

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

@Ketamine Sun , I really like your new signature gif. You've chosen a good one. The movement is gentle and soothing, and there's no swift kick when it restarts. And of course, a great image.

have to thank @goinghome that made it.

 

[Lucifer Sam]

“….. But there is no end.”

I know. Sounds like samsara. Now that's an unpleasant thought.

 

[Barking]

...Or neither...
Destiny for some could be to watch telly and doze in the sun and send unemployment services packing...

Ahem.

it's a good thing I don't get any money from them because I may have been a bit cheeky. I mean do I look like a dog who does the dishes?! (Yes I do, but only at home!) (that tail is so handy)

 

[Lucifer Sam]

If all is energy, and we are energy. Then it’s
not too far fetched to accept that even after the body dies, we don’t.

Maybe. Our energy does continue, though almost certainly not in the form of our unique individual consciousnesses. But I'm not afraid if reincarnation is true, because I don't remember any past lives, which means my next one won't remember this one. A shame that it will have to suffer. The best outcome would be annihilation—where "the future is ended by the long, long sleep." Which, if the heat death of the universe theory turns out to be correct, will be the end of everything that can suffer (at least in this universe).

 

[Amy]

okay, im sorry, i just thought you would be closed to my opinion, having already formed yours and thinking you know it all!

like i said it's about having that apparatus in place in society, where other people can look at a persons life and confirm "yeah maybe you should die." it's a very bad, ugly precedent to set. i dont like the idea that happy lives are more valuable and more worth living than miserable lives. because a miserable life might give the person the opportunity to face their misery and suffering with dignity and nobility of spirit, and in my opinion, that would make the suffering worth it. THAT is worth more than comfort. and that is what makes a life worth living. i also just believe in acceptance. millions of people have had painful deaths and if that is what nature has prescribed for us to experience i dont see why we shouldnt just accept that. i also believe that pain can be a beautiful integrative experience, and maybe one that is necessary in the experience of death. there are other emergent properties of pain, besides the pain itself, like the euphoria a person experiences when drowning, or the sense of warmth one experiences when freezing to death, that might be worthwhile and necessary to experience. and i think that in the case of animals, they are probably more in tune with all of this than humans, so i imagine they're probably more stoic and accepting when it comes to their own pain than we give them credit for.

No, not at all - I guess in some ways I am quite conflicted in how I feel so I am interested in opinions.

I do think there are a lot of thorny ethical issues around assisted suicide. I'm not sure if you've ever seen How to Die in Oregon (2011) which looks at different experiences of terminally ill people seeking assisted death - there is a scene which really drives home how dying becomes a business and that didn't sit well with me. If you meet the criteria, you can get a standard preparation of barbiturates to do the deed, say - but there are all kinds of companies and 'salesmen' looking to flog you things for $$$$. The more money you have, the more you're led to believe you can buy the really potent stuff to do it faster. "Buy this stuff for $100 and it might take 2 hours to die, buy this other stuff for $500 ...", that sort of thing. The documentary tries to be balanced but lots of food for thought.

In the UK, the Assisted Dying Bill has been rejected many, many times in recent years and is currently being considered again, it's a big issue. I don't think I could be the person to mix that lethal cocktail, I don't think I could press the button - but at the same time, I would want somebody to be brave enough to do it for me if I wanted out. I have really mixed feelings. Not long ago, a guy couldn't bear to see his mother suffer anymore so he threw her from a first-floor landing and got a suspended sentence. I can imagine feeling like that. It's desperate.

 

[Siena]

No, not at all - I guess in some ways I am quite conflicted in how I feel so I am interested in opinions.

I do think there are a lot of thorny ethical issues around assisted suicide. I'm not sure if you've ever seen How to Die in Oregon (2011) which looks at different experiences of terminally ill people seeking assisted death - there is a scene which really drives home how dying becomes a business and that didn't sit well with me. If you meet the criteria, you can get a standard preparation of barbiturates to do the deed, say - but there are all kinds of companies and 'salesmen' looking to flog you things for $$$$. The more money you have, the more you're led to believe you can buy the really potent stuff to do it faster. "Buy this stuff for $100 and it might take 2 hours to die, buy this other stuff for $500 ...", that sort of thing. The documentary tries to be balanced but lots of food for thought.

In the UK, the Assisted Dying Bill has been rejected many, many times in recent years and is currently being considered again, it's a big issue. I don't think I could be the person to mix that lethal cocktail, I don't think I could press the button - but at the same time, I would want somebody to be brave enough to do it for me if I wanted out. I have really mixed feelings. Not long ago, a guy couldn't bear to see his mother suffer anymore so he threw her from a first-floor landing and got a suspended sentence. I can imagine feeling like that. It's desperate.

Look , we die. We all die. Some struggle and it’s agony, by the grace of God some go easily. I’ve seen both sides of the sierra. I just don’t want some …. in a white coat deciding when I go, for a price . I love God. I leave it to him. Be brave, nothing else we should consider .

 

[Lucifer Sam]

Yes, we agree there. Our story and our bodies ( experiences, identity) are temporary. But I don’t believe those things are what we truly are.

But it’s not a shame to experience pleasure, and it would be a rarity to find someone who can claim that they’ve never. Life is pleasurable, go on, admit it.

I'll freely admit that my own life is pleasurable. I was born without birth defects into a middle-class family in the wealthiest country on earth in an age of great technological and medical ingenuity. But is life pleasurable for the six-year-old in the favela drinking polluted water, scrounging a waste dump for food or anything to sell for a dime? Is it pleasurable for the malarial infant with flies in its eyes in a country of famine and neglect? For the dairy cow or the battery hen? If life can be said to be overall pleasurable, then it has to be pleasurable for all sentient beings. Otherwise we're like pharaohs being fed grapes by the nubile ladies of our harem, who cool us with palm fronds as we gaze out from our palace at the hundreds of slaves toiling & dying under the hot sun to build our funerary monuments.

Do the living only suffer in your world?

It's difficult for me to see how something like a rock can suffer. If it turns out rocks can suffer, then good grief.

The interesting thing about the heat death of the universe is that all energy would become so sluggish and cold and dispersed and unconscious, there would still something to speak of, but it would just be like the softest reverberation of an OM. "Birthless and deathless." And that's fine with me.

 

[nicky wire's legs]

No, not at all - I guess in some ways I am quite conflicted in how I feel so I am interested in opinions.

I do think there are a lot of thorny ethical issues around assisted suicide. I'm not sure if you've ever seen How to Die in Oregon (2011) which looks at different experiences of terminally ill people seeking assisted death - there is a scene which really drives home how dying becomes a business and that didn't sit well with me. If you meet the criteria, you can get a standard preparation of barbiturates to do the deed, say - but there are all kinds of companies and 'salesmen' looking to flog you things for $$$$. The more money you have, the more you're led to believe you can buy the really potent stuff to do it faster. "Buy this stuff for $100 and it might take 2 hours to die, buy this other stuff for $500 ...", that sort of thing. The documentary tries to be balanced but lots of food for thought.

In the UK, the Assisted Dying Bill has been rejected many, many times in recent years and is currently being considered again, it's a big issue. I don't think I could be the person to mix that lethal cocktail, I don't think I could press the button - but at the same time, I would want somebody to be brave enough to do it for me if I wanted out. I have really mixed feelings. Not long ago, a guy couldn't bear to see his mother suffer anymore so he threw her from a first-floor landing and got a suspended sentence. I can imagine feeling like that. It's desperate.

uh you should see what they're doing in canada with MAID (medical assistance in dying). there was the case of this one man who was put into a psych ward for depression/not looking after himself, and when he first got there he was really angry about being put in there and wanted to go home. after a while of being there he opted for medical assisted suicide. the reason stated on the forms? hearing loss. his brother, who tried to talk him out of suicide, believes that the reason he chose it was because he was being petulant or something or other about being put into the psych ward. why hearing loss should be a reason why someone shouldnt live is beyond me. if i were hard of hearing i would feel really bad about that. i would wonder, does the canadian government think that i also shouldnt live? is my life worth less that those who can hear? there have been other reasons cited for people choosing MAID including not being able to afford their medical bills and bullshit reasons like that. makes me absolutely sick. apparently being depressed or having anxiety is a good reason to die as well. i just think that for people who are depressed and wanting to take their life, to hear someone confirming that yes, maybe death is a good option for you, would make them want to kill themselves even more. NOBODY can say whether someone elses life has value or not. and to say that a life that is unhappy or has challenges has less value than a happy life is disgusting and shows how far we've gone wrong as a society.

as far as i know, terminal dehydration has always been an option both for medical patients as well as for prison inmates. in such a case, where force feeding a person against their will would be wrong, the only thing doctors can do is make them as comfortable as possible. i have no problem with that. that seems natural to me. when the will to live shuts down, no longer eating or drinking seems a natural conclusion, the body in sync with the spirit. it is, again, the sterile expedient application of death through euthanasia that does not and will never sit well with me or seem natural to me.

anyway, good to hear your thoughts. sorry for not giving you the benefit of the doubt and just being a jerk!

 

[Redacted]

Oh, don't worry about me, Redacted. I admire the energy and strength in your posts, and your characterization of this pitiful person you've mentioned in the other post is priceless, actually it's quite funny, if i may say so. It brightened up my day.
With regard to euthanasia, the only answer i have at the moment is, that one should never be casual about the decision-making. If you don't experience any internal conflicts, pangs of remorse or any other negative feelings, then something's terribly wrong. And such emotions emerge only in real life situations. You have to look at the individual case, each and every time, there is no time-saving patent answer or Fuehrer's order to shuffle you out of your own personal responsibility. And yes, there is always the chance that you might have to admit a mistake later on, no matter what your decision was.

What you write about morphine is interesting and it resembles what i witnessed at my grandmother's death bed in hospital. I am pretty sure that the staff at the hospitals has conversations with the clear-headed patients about the possibilities of morphine medication. I know that my grandmother wanted to see all her family around her death-bed on more time, and there was some weird mix of solemnity and, sometimes inappropriate i thought, joy of reunion, with people talking exuberantly as if at a family party and at the same time hushing each other, with my grandmother lying silently in the center unable to speak or react. After the big noisy crowd had left, thank god, i noticed that one of the nurses, who inquired if the family had gone now, was turning a valve at the head of my grandmother's bed. I was alone there with my brother and cousin, and 20 minutes later she was quietly dying, i noticed a rattling in her throat which then subsided. Her face was suddenly all relaxed, almost glowing and looked 20 years younger. What you describe about your morphine experience makes me hope that she was probably also pain free and in a state of peaceful semi-consciousness before she passed on.

When it comes to the question of a new pet, i experience a strong conflict between my love for animals and my current desire for freedom and adventure. I am planning to be pet-free for a year or so and then think about it again, but my heart is longing for a furry companion from the shelter right now. I have a sponsored cat child at the shelter though. This helps a little.

Glad to have brightened your day, we can only laugh at these kind of people, they don't deserve further thought.
I completely agree that euthanasia should be thoroughly thought through and not arrived at lightly and decided on a case by case basis. I see it as a last resort. H was not going to get better, there wasn't any treatment for him, he was dying and had been for days. At that point, keeping him alive was not noble and only a narcissist would think it is because they have no ability to reflect inward or think about other people or beings. There is no self, same for other personality disorders, but that's another conversation. When we get a pet, we take responsibility for every aspect of that pet's life. Pets should not have to needlessly suffer, there is no redemptive value in it, pets are innocent creatures who do not need redeeming or to learn the value of suffering.

As for your grandma, I do believe if that was morphine is was honestly more peaceful than you can imagine, I can't describe it, but there is no fear and no pain.

To be honest, we have come to enjoy the freedom of not having a pet to take care of, thought we do miss our pets very much and still talk about them. I have pics of H and my husband on my phone from H's last good day and I have still not been able to look at them yet.

You will know when the time is right again, if it is and if it never is, that is ok.