people, things and events that shaped Moz

There's a quote from Morrissey where he spells out exactly why he loves Wilde. He said it was the fact that Wilde used simple easy to understand language that attracted him. As a working class kid with little education it was the first time he realised that you didn't have to be an esoteric intellectual using long complicated words to be a great writer. So it gave him some hope.

Thanks, I hadnt read any of those quotes, but they are really good reasons to love him. my mum used to read Wilde fairytales and I always loved 'The nightingale and the rose' and ofcourse 'the selfish giant'. I read 'the Picture of Dorian Gray' a few months ago, I was really suprised because there were so many quotes I've heard that always assumed were Wilde himself but theyre actually Lord Henry, of course the preface the best :)
 
Obviously the man's Catholicism is a MASSIVE (s)influence on him. I was at the superb Moz gig on Tuesday night in Chicago and was surprised to see tee-shirts depicting the man as a priest on them. Then again, he has had a helluva lot of acolytes confessing their private pains and passions to him over the years, much as he did in his own 'confessional' lyrics, so the tee-shirt design makes perfect sense. Guilt, sexual shame (especially for any homosexual proclivities - Catholicism isn't a big fan of gays), pain-is-good-so-hurt-me-again-cos-I-love-to-hate-it masochism...all present and correct in the man's work. Hell, he even lives in Rome now, and that's the Pope's city.

And didn't any of you ever read the SUPERB psychbio Saint Morrissey by Mark Simpson? He draws a good few illuminating conclusions about Morrissey and his work in it. Well written and WELL worth a read. And Moz likes the book too, which tells you something, though Simpson was slightly disappointed to learn this. He still doesn't want to meet his idol, though Moz would like to meet him.
 
That guy, Robert Mackie, supposedly photocopied the letters and sold the copies in the late 1980s. (Obviously, I can't vouch for that, it's just what the person who posted them on the Internet claims.)

There is always a possibility that it could be a fantastic forgery, but I don't see any reason to believe it is. The style and content are typical Moz. And I would be more surprised if none of his former pen-pals had ever tried to sell the letters he sent them at the time when he wasn't famous.

I'm open to the suggestion they could be genuine, I'd just always assumed they weren't, so I'm interested to hear your opinion. Thanks for replying.

Has anyone got a link for these postcards/letters or know where I can read them?

Cheers :)
 
Obviously the man's Catholicism is a MASSIVE (s)influence on him. I was at the superb Moz gig on Tuesday night in Chicago and was surprised to see tee-shirts depicting the man as a priest on them. Then again, he has had a helluva lot of acolytes confessing their private pains and passions to him over the years, much as he did in his own 'confessional' lyrics, so the tee-shirt design makes perfect sense. Guilt, sexual shame (especially for any homosexual proclivities - Catholicism isn't a big fan of gays), pain-is-good-so-hurt-me-again-cos-I-love-to-hate-it masochism...all present and correct in the man's work. Hell, he even lives in Rome now, and that's the Pope's city.

And didn't any of you ever read the SUPERB psychbio Saint Morrissey by Mark Simpson? He draws a good few illuminating conclusions about Morrissey and his work in it. Well written and WELL worth a read. And Moz likes the book too, which tells you something, though Simpson was slightly disappointed to learn this. He still doesn't want to meet his idol, though Moz would like to meet him.
He said he liked it? When was it? Is there a link? I would love to read what he said.

Well, he used to dress up as a priest (and make the band members dress up as nuns :D ) during the Quarry tour. :p Am I the only one who thinks that the the Catholicism influence has been, well, a bit exaggerated lately? I don't remember people going on about it before he moved to Rome. It was probably more of an influence on Madonna (Louisa Chiccone) than on Morrissey.
 
Religion always affects you in some way or another and to be able to reflect about it is always a good thing (from my atheist point of view).
 
Morrissey is Catholic in the same way he is a West Ham supporter. :p
I don't know, did he ever say West Ham were crap and that they have nothing to do with football? :p Because he did say very negative things about Catholicism, that it only seems to make people feel bad about absolutely everything, and "it has nothing to do with Christianity". And now I'm supposed to think that all these years he has actually been a closet believer in all things Catholic? :rolleyes:

Being raised as Catholic/Orthodox/whatever doesn't mean that you actually uphold any of those beliefs. Most people wouldn't identify themselves as atheist, but it's easy to see that religion has very little influence over their actual lives and behaviour. Otherwise nobody would masturbate, use contraceptives, have oral sex, have sex before marriage, have extra-marrital affairs, eat cheese/butter/meat/eggs during fast, and so on. I don't think that most people even know much about religious matters, or have even given it much thought.

Yes, people who have had a religious upbringing are usually affected by it in this or that way, but it's quite often in an adverse way. Talking about Irish people - Dave Allen comes to mind with his jokes about Catholic priests, Sinead O'Connor with her public criticism of Catholicism and ripping the Pope's picture...


BTW here are a few nice quotes about religion, from Reverend Timothy Lovejoy:

(In response to the rise of the new cult called the Movementarians) "This so-called "new religion" is nothing but a pack of weird rituals and chants designed to take away the money of fools. Let us say the Lord's Prayer forty times but first let's pass the collection plate! "

"(Holding Bible) Marge, have you ever actually read this thing? Practically everything is a sin. Technically, we're not allowed to go to the bathroom."
 
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Catholics never, ever fully truly escape the Jesus Cult they have been indoctrinated into. Not for nothing does the Catholic Church say give me a child until the age of six, and he is mine forever. Acolytes can run but they can't hide...and seem to often end up back in the arms of the religion that screwed them up in the first place just to get some peace of mind.

Moz did indeed like St Moz. Mark told me in a phone call. He is a friend of mine.
 
Well he said this during the Smiths

"though I came from a monstrously large family who were quite absurdly Catholic, when I was six there were two very serious tragedies within the family which caused everybody to turn away from the church, and quite rightly so, and from that period onwards there was just a total disregard for something that was really quite sacrosanct previous to the tragedies. So yes, I experienced the severe, boring fear, but then I also experienced the realities of life."

And recently he said Catholism was 'sandblasted into u'. I'm not sure I've always thought it's been an exagerated influence.
 
Morrissey is an artist first and foremost.

Being a Catholic is his current fad, along with all things Italian. It's useful imagery for his art. That's how all artists work, using outside influences. That's not to say it's a shallow interest, it's just a starting block for his musings about life.

Next year it will probably be Oslo and the Protestant work ethic he is fascinated by.
 
lol... Irish comedian Dara O'Briain says that "I don't actually believe in God. Still a Catholic though. You'd think it would be pretty fundamental to the whole thing, believing in God, wouldn't you? But no... nothing could disconnect you from the Catholic Church in my experience". He then made a joke in rather poor taste about that you could join the Taliban, and still only be regarded as a 'bad Catholic'.
 
lol... Irish comedian Dara O'Briain says that "I don't actually believe in God. Still a Catholic though. You'd think it would be pretty fundamental to the whole thing, believing in God, wouldn't you? But no... nothing could disconnect you from the Catholic Church in my experience". He then made a joke in rather poor taste about that you could join the Taliban, and still only be regarded as a 'bad Catholic'.

Dara O'Brien's on the Panel (irish show) and when show guy came on slagging Catholism off he got really defensive. Moz is right it is sandblasted into you. Even if you think you're all atheist. When I heard 'Dear God Please Help Me', I really thought 'but he cant say that, that's blasphomus' :rolleyes:
 
Dara O'Brien's on the Panel (irish show) and when show guy came on slagging Catholism off he got really defensive. Moz is right it is sandblasted into you. Even if you think you're all atheist. When I heard 'Dear God Please Help Me', I really thought 'but he cant say that, that's blasphomus' :rolleyes:

lol I take it you're a Catholic, Christine?
 
I'm very surprised he's never admitted to liking Philip Larkin.
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Yes, i'm glad you've said that because i've always wondered about that. There seem to be lots of similarities in their work.
Just as an example, i've always thought "End of the family line" could almost be considered as some kind of 'postscript' to Larkin's famous poem "This be the verse".
I'd love to know what Moz's views on Larkin are.
Anybody know?
 
How many times has Morrissey written songs that are about/mention religion, God, Jesus, devil, saints, sin,..., in either 'blasphemous' or non-blasphemous way?

The Queen Is Dead and Vicar in A Tutu don't count, because they're just attacking, ridiculing or making fun of the church, not dealing with religion.

I can think of:

Yes, I Am Blind
Satan Rejected My Soul
I Have Forgiven Jesus
Dear God, Please Help Me
I Just Want To See The Boy Happy

plus there's a mention of 'born-against atheist(s)" in Nobody Loves Us and Black-Eyed Susan... does that count?


Compare this with some other songwriters, for instance Nick Cave:

(with The Birthday Party)
Several Sins
Big Jesus Trash Can
Mutiny In Heaven
A Catholic Skin

(with The Bad Seeds)
Well Of Misery
A Box For Black Paul
Tupelo (mixing God/Jesus and Elvis!)
Saint Huck (Elvis and Huckleberry Finn as saints!)
Jesus Met the Woman At The Well (cover)
- the title of the album of covers "Kicking Against the Pricks" comes from the Bible
- the title of the album "Tender Prey"
The Mercy Seat
Mercy
Up Jumped The Devil
City Of Refuge
Sugar Sugar Sugar
The Good Son
Foi Na Cruz
The Weeping Song (possibly)
Straight To You
Christina the Astonishing
(I'll Love You) Till The End Of the World (well, sort of... he does mention the God above!)
Red Right Hand
Do You Love Me? pt 1
Loverman (devil)
Song Of Joy ('red right hand' reference again)
Into My Arms
Brompton Oratory
There Is A Kingdom
Idiot Prayer
(Are You) The One That I've Been Waiting For?
As I Sat Sadly By Her Side
Hallelujah
God Is In The House
Oh, My Lord
Fifteen Feet Of Pure White Snow
Get Ready For Love
Messiah Ward (a love song and not much of a religious song, ut still, the reference in the title...)
Hiding All Away
Carry Me
O Chidren
Let The Bells Ring (a religious ode... to Johnny Cash this time!)
Bless His Ever Loving Heart
God's Hotel

and probably more that I've forgotten to mention.
 
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Yup, sandblasted into me. Damn religion teachers, hey did you guys know condoms give you cancer!! :rolleyes:

lol! I'm a Protestant, maybe we should have a mule-child :p
 
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