A
Anonymous
Guest
Or put a proper-grammar filter on the site, saving us from posts like yours.
Oh my god. it's Robby!
spontaneously luminescent
look, is this site mostly shit now? 
yes
best way around this problem is to not come here for very long when you come here
just breeze through things quickly, skipping most of it obviously
trust me, it works
yes
best way around this problem is to not come here for very long when you come here
just breeze through things quickly, skipping most of it obviously
trust me, it works
Last edited:
S
Skylarker
Guest
First of all I assume you are "optikal" as it is my response to his post you seem to be referring to...yet now you are posting anonymously...even though you think that the anonymous posting feature should be nixed...
Secondly, it's called "irony." An anonymous poster started a thread on how to improve the site; you jumped on board and expounded on his ideas, including, foremost, your suggestion that anonymous posters should not be allowed to post.
Do I have to explain it further?
A
Anonymous
Guest
well, we're going nowhere with this. I understand you don't want to make any changes and that's fine, it's your site. I thought putting the positive items into focus, instead of the negative, would make the site's visitors more positive, especially those who do not visit on a daily basis and sometimes miss them. I understand you're doing this a long time and your feelings towards Morrissey are probably not the same, as they were back when you started. Being a technical person you probably attribute lesser importance to graphics and the visuals. You have your truth and things are black and white and by the book, but you have to remember this is supposed to be a fan site, not strictly a news site that lists the news as they come, not putting emphasis on anything in particular and just filing articles in. Again, only my 2 cents. You probably feel Morrissey is ungrateful and maybe he is, I think you would be right to expect financial or other assistance from him, but that's how people are and that's why I always kick myself if I put someone's best interests before mine and without them asking. Anyway, thanks for listening.
Borewhore
Muscle Hunk
look, is this site mostly shit now?
yes
best way around this problem is to not come here for very long when you come here
just breeze through things quickly, skipping most of it obviously
trust me, it works
Works perfectly for me! ^5
applebuttaz
Member
Davidt be damned! How dare you not post morrissey's biggest accomplishment in years?! Receiving the keys to the city?!...that's front headline news worthy! Call in the bcc and the rest of their 5 thousand channels and call in msnbc and fox, other news stations!
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Anonymous
Guest
FAO: Davidt
No need to be sarcastic.
Davidt, I thought about something that I think we can agree on. Since the banner graphics are now history, the site visually looks to me at least a bit gloomy and lifeless. I think you can use the same script that you used for the banners, to feature interchanging photos (the image would change every time you reload the main page, as it did with the banners), with the images of the last month or calendar month, with a short caption and a link to the story it pertains to. I believe most stories with pictures are positive anyways, so it would be mostly positive and would bring some color back to the site. I'm sure you can find an appropriate, noticeable spot for a mid or large size photo.
I think it won't take a lot of time to put on and maintain.
What do you think?
No need to be sarcastic.
Davidt, I thought about something that I think we can agree on. Since the banner graphics are now history, the site visually looks to me at least a bit gloomy and lifeless. I think you can use the same script that you used for the banners, to feature interchanging photos (the image would change every time you reload the main page, as it did with the banners), with the images of the last month or calendar month, with a short caption and a link to the story it pertains to. I believe most stories with pictures are positive anyways, so it would be mostly positive and would bring some color back to the site. I'm sure you can find an appropriate, noticeable spot for a mid or large size photo.
I think it won't take a lot of time to put on and maintain.
What do you think?
cornelius blaze
Boychild mustn't tremble!
Re: FAO: Davidt
look, is this site mostly shit now?
yes
best way around this problem is to not come here for very long when you come here
just breeze through things quickly, skipping most of it obviously
trust me, it works
peptastic
New Member
Re: FAO: Davidt
I think vibes of any sort is too subjective.
I don't think the negative "Moz is retiring" story from the guardian made the site in any way negative to discuss it. Though the spirit of the article was in a way negative. More important,the follow-up that he wasn't retiring.
Whitewashing the site and pretending lawsuits with n.m.e don't happen would be foolish. As fans we find that thing interesting.
We can handle different news without being affected emotionally. I don't need Davidt to protect me from the big bad n.m.e for example.
I think vibes of any sort is too subjective.
I don't think the negative "Moz is retiring" story from the guardian made the site in any way negative to discuss it. Though the spirit of the article was in a way negative. More important,the follow-up that he wasn't retiring.
Whitewashing the site and pretending lawsuits with n.m.e don't happen would be foolish. As fans we find that thing interesting.
We can handle different news without being affected emotionally. I don't need Davidt to protect me from the big bad n.m.e for example.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Re: FAO: Davidt
I thought we would all enjoy it, if the positive stories were highlighted in some way. Especially from the visual standpoint, why not utilize the photographs you have in a more prominent way and add some color to the site? Say photos or videos from the latest gig, Morrissey sighting or poster. Why instead settle for thumbnails? The only color in the site were the banners and now they are also gone. It just looks like it is a site for software developers with the latest Java updates, instead of a fan site and a site about music and the arts. That's what I was alluding to when I said Davidt was a technical person. He's more interested in the site's code, etc. and there's nothing wrong with it. I just thought I'd suggest some kind of a change, which wouldn't require much work on his part.
I think vibes of any sort is too subjective.
I don't think the negative "Moz is retiring" story from the guardian made the site in any way negative to discuss it. Though the spirit of the article was in a way negative. More important,the follow-up that he wasn't retiring.
Whitewashing the site and pretending lawsuits with n.m.e don't happen would be foolish. As fans we find that thing interesting.
We can handle different news without being affected emotionally. I don't need Davidt to protect me from the big bad n.m.e for example.
I thought we would all enjoy it, if the positive stories were highlighted in some way. Especially from the visual standpoint, why not utilize the photographs you have in a more prominent way and add some color to the site? Say photos or videos from the latest gig, Morrissey sighting or poster. Why instead settle for thumbnails? The only color in the site were the banners and now they are also gone. It just looks like it is a site for software developers with the latest Java updates, instead of a fan site and a site about music and the arts. That's what I was alluding to when I said Davidt was a technical person. He's more interested in the site's code, etc. and there's nothing wrong with it. I just thought I'd suggest some kind of a change, which wouldn't require much work on his part.
!Viva Hate!
Well-Known Member
Re: FAO: Davidt
Your suggestions go against entirely everything that is taught in Web Design.
Your suggestions go against entirely everything that is taught in Web Design.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Re: FAO: Davidt
No it's not. Just look at the websites of CNN, NBC, NY Times, etc. The headline picture is always a large size photo and often larger than the other stories' pictures. I suggested to dedicate a section (perhaps above the Recent Article Comments on the right) that would contain a medium or large size photo or video, that changes every time you load the site, each time from a different story from the last week or month.
No it's not. Just look at the websites of CNN, NBC, NY Times, etc. The headline picture is always a large size photo and often larger than the other stories' pictures. I suggested to dedicate a section (perhaps above the Recent Article Comments on the right) that would contain a medium or large size photo or video, that changes every time you load the site, each time from a different story from the last week or month.
!Viva Hate!
Well-Known Member
Re: FAO: Davidt
So because CNN, NBC, and the NY Times does it, that means it ceases to go against what schools teach concerning Web Design?
The goal usually sought after is supposed to be sleekness, a uniform and complementary color scheme, and a design and format conveying your message that takes up the least possible space without being illegible...and to be fair, this is part of the reason I find all of the sites you just listed to be absolutely unappealing as far as aesthetics go. Those pages are so cluttered with mess and uselessness I'm surprised anyone even frequents them.
Also, you're proposing something that would potentially highlight stories that others have deemed negative...unless you're advocating hand-picked stories rather than a random generator.
So because CNN, NBC, and the NY Times does it, that means it ceases to go against what schools teach concerning Web Design?
The goal usually sought after is supposed to be sleekness, a uniform and complementary color scheme, and a design and format conveying your message that takes up the least possible space without being illegible...and to be fair, this is part of the reason I find all of the sites you just listed to be absolutely unappealing as far as aesthetics go. Those pages are so cluttered with mess and uselessness I'm surprised anyone even frequents them.
Also, you're proposing something that would potentially highlight stories that others have deemed negative...unless you're advocating hand-picked stories rather than a random generator.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Re: FAO: Davidt
I don't think one has to go to a 'Web Design school' to be a web designer and I don't know what their design rules are and why would one have to go by these rules (which obviously no one does anyway). Maybe you went to a Web Design school and therefore believe your opinion matters over that of the biggest professionals in the field.
If the design is about conveying a message, what do you think this site's message is currently?
The NY Times and CNN sites are quite conservative and are what news sites, like Mo-Solo, usually look like.
Mo-Solo's layout is based on a general free source code, which can be used for sites of all sorts. There's nothing wrong with adjusting it to the desired purpose here, which is a musical artist fan site. You want a front page design that says that and that has some color in it.
Had you read the thread you would know Davidt was against hand picking which stories to highlight, for time constraint reasons and/or for his belief that the stories should keep moving. I suggested the random generator, as most stories with pictures and videos are positive in any case and it would be automatic, so it won't take much time to maintain, just putting the pictures and videos into a folder, which he already does.
I don't think one has to go to a 'Web Design school' to be a web designer and I don't know what their design rules are and why would one have to go by these rules (which obviously no one does anyway). Maybe you went to a Web Design school and therefore believe your opinion matters over that of the biggest professionals in the field.
If the design is about conveying a message, what do you think this site's message is currently?
The NY Times and CNN sites are quite conservative and are what news sites, like Mo-Solo, usually look like.
Mo-Solo's layout is based on a general free source code, which can be used for sites of all sorts. There's nothing wrong with adjusting it to the desired purpose here, which is a musical artist fan site. You want a front page design that says that and that has some color in it.
Had you read the thread you would know Davidt was against hand picking which stories to highlight, for time constraint reasons and/or for his belief that the stories should keep moving. I suggested the random generator, as most stories with pictures and videos are positive in any case and it would be automatic, so it won't take much time to maintain, just putting the pictures and videos into a folder, which he already does.
Re: FAO: Davidt
You are correct in that I am not much of a visual designer. Perhaps you can come up with a mock up graphic on an updated design and others can give some feedback. The main goal is to provide information / links to the latest items of interest so I think a chronological display is best. Any hand-picked articles, randomly generated articles, or large graphics that have been seen for more than a week would be a deterrent to the main goal.
You are correct in that I am not much of a visual designer. Perhaps you can come up with a mock up graphic on an updated design and others can give some feedback. The main goal is to provide information / links to the latest items of interest so I think a chronological display is best. Any hand-picked articles, randomly generated articles, or large graphics that have been seen for more than a week would be a deterrent to the main goal.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Re: FAO: Davidt
I'm not talking about a complete revamp of the site, because it's mainly a news site and the current format is appropriate.
A complete change of the graphics would require a lot of work and changing the site's code. That's why I suggested above, a small feature section on the right side with a random picture or video, which would not affect the chronological display and would not require a lot of work. I thought it would be best if the pictures/videos were related to the stories of the last month or week to keep things current, but you can choose whatever theme you like, you have a large gallery on the site already or you can embed chosen Morrissey, Morrissey influenced or Morrissey's own influences videos from Youtube. I can make a mock up graphic, though it doesn't seem anyone's too keen on the idea.
I'm not talking about a complete revamp of the site, because it's mainly a news site and the current format is appropriate.
A complete change of the graphics would require a lot of work and changing the site's code. That's why I suggested above, a small feature section on the right side with a random picture or video, which would not affect the chronological display and would not require a lot of work. I thought it would be best if the pictures/videos were related to the stories of the last month or week to keep things current, but you can choose whatever theme you like, you have a large gallery on the site already or you can embed chosen Morrissey, Morrissey influenced or Morrissey's own influences videos from Youtube. I can make a mock up graphic, though it doesn't seem anyone's too keen on the idea.
!Viva Hate!
Well-Known Member
Re: FAO: Davidt
I didn't say they did.
Correct.
No one HAS to go by anything. I simply stated that the suggestions offered are the exact opposite of what most professional instructors teach.
Plenty of sites do. Search engines such as Google being the most blatantly obvious examples. In fact, most pages that feature frames implement the same basic design. Even Morrissey's official site ItsMorrisseysWorld.com during the release of 'Refusal' and 'Swords' had a similar design.
I have seen sites designed by high school students that are more professional than CNN.com, NBC.com, and the NY Times. It takes nearly no effort or imagination at all to create a framed web page with Shockwave animations and Java dropdown menus. Are YOU one of the biggest professionals in the field or do you assume that because NBC, CNN, and the NY Times has a website, then it must have been designed by the best of the best?
If I recall, even Morrissey's official website was just an edited form of a template that Universal Music used for a number of their artists that they had purchased from a small-time web designer. Hell, even when I was in high school businesses and newspapers/news channels would essentially hire their web design work out to students for passing grades!
I think the design conveys what the site outside of the forums and comments essentially is - a cold, unbiased database.
And when it comes down to it, what color scheme really fits a site about Morrissey? You can't very well splash two-tone red & yellow everywhere just for the sake of adding color.
Like DavidT pretty much said, if you can think of something that looks good, he likes, and that works...he'll consider it. If you can do something positive like this to help the site, by all means go for it.
Those sites, especially CNN, fill a large portion of 'the first thing you see' area with advertisements. Not only is counterproductive, it's annoying. A site is supposed to be designed with convenience in mind and the average person doesn't want to have to go searching for something because it's been buried by clutter. The thing I like about Solo's design is that it isn't a bunch of Headlines with a thumbnail and that's that. You at least have an idea of the content of the article before you click on it.
I agree. But until someone comes up with an improvement that works, I think this scheme is just fine.
I read it, I was just being sarcastic.
Only, it isn't that simple. He would have to go back and edit previous articles to include pictures, as most don't include any pictures or videos whatsoever, AND the majority of articles do not have any videos or images remotely related to them with the exception of the post show reports during a tour.
I didn't say they did.
Correct.
No one HAS to go by anything. I simply stated that the suggestions offered are the exact opposite of what most professional instructors teach.
Plenty of sites do. Search engines such as Google being the most blatantly obvious examples. In fact, most pages that feature frames implement the same basic design. Even Morrissey's official site ItsMorrisseysWorld.com during the release of 'Refusal' and 'Swords' had a similar design.
I have seen sites designed by high school students that are more professional than CNN.com, NBC.com, and the NY Times. It takes nearly no effort or imagination at all to create a framed web page with Shockwave animations and Java dropdown menus. Are YOU one of the biggest professionals in the field or do you assume that because NBC, CNN, and the NY Times has a website, then it must have been designed by the best of the best?
If I recall, even Morrissey's official website was just an edited form of a template that Universal Music used for a number of their artists that they had purchased from a small-time web designer. Hell, even when I was in high school businesses and newspapers/news channels would essentially hire their web design work out to students for passing grades!
I think the design conveys what the site outside of the forums and comments essentially is - a cold, unbiased database.
And when it comes down to it, what color scheme really fits a site about Morrissey? You can't very well splash two-tone red & yellow everywhere just for the sake of adding color.
Like DavidT pretty much said, if you can think of something that looks good, he likes, and that works...he'll consider it. If you can do something positive like this to help the site, by all means go for it.
Those sites, especially CNN, fill a large portion of 'the first thing you see' area with advertisements. Not only is counterproductive, it's annoying. A site is supposed to be designed with convenience in mind and the average person doesn't want to have to go searching for something because it's been buried by clutter. The thing I like about Solo's design is that it isn't a bunch of Headlines with a thumbnail and that's that. You at least have an idea of the content of the article before you click on it.
I agree. But until someone comes up with an improvement that works, I think this scheme is just fine.
I read it, I was just being sarcastic.
Only, it isn't that simple. He would have to go back and edit previous articles to include pictures, as most don't include any pictures or videos whatsoever, AND the majority of articles do not have any videos or images remotely related to them with the exception of the post show reports during a tour.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Re: FAO: Davidt
Here's a mock up graphic I made, you should see how it works out effort-wise in regards to resizing images to fit the format:
http://s16.postimage.org/exyr6fkr9/mso.jpg
Here's a mock up graphic I made, you should see how it works out effort-wise in regards to resizing images to fit the format:
http://s16.postimage.org/exyr6fkr9/mso.jpg
Re: FAO: Davidt
I'll let others chime in with feedback to see if there is a strong interest but from my perspective:
1. Adding images slows down the web page in general - it's pretty optimized with small images but adding 3 large images would probably double the page load time with the size of the images and 3 additional image requests. It also pushes the main content down. As I mentioned before, it gets in the way of the main goal of getting the latest information. While at first glance it may be visually more appealing, I prefer to minimize the use of graphics.
2. The code changes for the images above the top 2 articles would not be trivial. The images are also an odd size - relying on automatically cropping images within the article would likely not be effective, I would have to custom crop and upload an image for each one which would probably double / triple the time it takes to publish an article.
3. Adding a module in the right column with an image would not be that hard with the current software. Each image would likely need to also be custom cropped to fit in that location so that is a bit of additional publishing work. I did choose to feature images before at the top of the page early in the site's history, around 1997-1998 and the extra time it took to choosing / sizing images frequently became a bit too much. Keep in mind this is not a site like CNN or the NY Times where there are a staff of several editors / programmers focused on content full-time. Seems like there should be some text indicating why that image is there. Does it link to something? Maybe it's the image you chose and I am not the 'frink' type but I wouldn't have thought to feature this image. Perhaps you want to volunteer to be the photo editor?
I'll let others chime in with feedback to see if there is a strong interest but from my perspective:
1. Adding images slows down the web page in general - it's pretty optimized with small images but adding 3 large images would probably double the page load time with the size of the images and 3 additional image requests. It also pushes the main content down. As I mentioned before, it gets in the way of the main goal of getting the latest information. While at first glance it may be visually more appealing, I prefer to minimize the use of graphics.
2. The code changes for the images above the top 2 articles would not be trivial. The images are also an odd size - relying on automatically cropping images within the article would likely not be effective, I would have to custom crop and upload an image for each one which would probably double / triple the time it takes to publish an article.
3. Adding a module in the right column with an image would not be that hard with the current software. Each image would likely need to also be custom cropped to fit in that location so that is a bit of additional publishing work. I did choose to feature images before at the top of the page early in the site's history, around 1997-1998 and the extra time it took to choosing / sizing images frequently became a bit too much. Keep in mind this is not a site like CNN or the NY Times where there are a staff of several editors / programmers focused on content full-time. Seems like there should be some text indicating why that image is there. Does it link to something? Maybe it's the image you chose and I am not the 'frink' type but I wouldn't have thought to feature this image. Perhaps you want to volunteer to be the photo editor?
