Morrissey is a nasty human being

[Worm]

I think the story about The Smiths snubbing Factory is a non-starter. Had they signed with Factory their image would have been identical with their image on Rough Trade because Morrissey supervised everything from start to finish. Peter Saville's genius would not have been needed. They didn't want to be in Factory's stable of bands and that's that. Probably had a lot to do with their dislike of Anthony H. Wilson, but then I'm sure the feeling was mutual. I don't buy the idea that Wilson is jealous.

I'm sure his opinion of Morrissey is biased, of course, but at the same time I've no reason to assume his opinion is wrong. All of us would be treated very nicely by Morrissey if we ran into him in a pub, or met him backstage. But does anyone here honestly think they'd be treated as well working with him day in and day out for a few months in a recording studio, or for a much longer period of time as an employee of Rough Trade, EMI, et al? If I were to strike up a friendship with Morrissey tomorrow I'd be thrilled but I'd know it was just a matter of time before the ax fell. Maybe the moment he found a "rancid LP" in my collection.

Wilson is no less flawed than Morrissey, I admit. But I love what the man did for indie music. Even if you don't buy into his self-glorifying version of Manchester history, he was there and did enough to deserve a lot of credit. Very, very funny interview. Thanks for posting it.

 

[CharethCutestory]

Im going to say what i think the great man Morrissey would say about this thread.

Meh.

I think he'd say it was vulgar.

 

[CharethCutestory]

All of us would be treated very nicely by Morrissey if we ran into him in a pub, or met him backstage.

I agree with most of what you said, but this bit?

I reckon he'd be a right twat with people. He thinks he's it, you see.

 

[nightandday]

Morrissey's reasons for not eating meat have nothing to do with its taste, and I don't believe that he ever expressed any opinions on the taste of bacon, so comments such as "and bacon is tasty" are obviously pointess and stupid. But what else would you expect...

and the problem with this is?
you can find cures for illnesses without using our fellow creatures...
are the prisons not full?

Sorry?? You lost me with that last comment.

What do the number of people in prisons have to do with finding cures for illnesses, which should be done without using our fellow creatures??

 

[duchess_of_fork]

I agree with most of what you said, but this bit?

I reckon he'd be a right twat with people. He thinks he's it, you see.

see i disagree. a person i encountered on myspace got to meet him backstage (she waited around for hours etc etc)..actually, she asked his bodyguard as he was leaving the venue if she could hug him, the guy said no, but morrissey said yes....she started crying and he picked her up in his arms, told her its ok and kissed her forehead! and then when she told him he's "her life" he said "thanks, but not really".

i mean...how many musicians would be this nice to a person? i don't think that many! and she has a picture with him...it's adorable, her eyes are red from crying! and morrissey, of course, looks gorgeous in it.

i think he'd be nice to people who deserve it...and those who don't...well, it's only human to send off negative vibes to people you dislike!

 

[CharethCutestory]

i think the last sentence just reassured me that this is a wasted rebutal. anyone who knows that there are living beings out there suffering and having their lives taken away, but still supports that industry just because "it's tasty" obivously can't have much integrity or compassion...or anything really...going for them in their life.

ta-da.

So. What you're saying is. Anybody who eats bacon cannot "have much integrity or compassion...or anything really...going for them in their life", personally I think that's a little niave, and that, in about 10 years time, when you're all grown up, you might just look back on that and realise just how small minded you sound. I could be wrong though, it has been known.

Besides, it is tasty, especially with brown sauce.

Martin Luther king was, I think we can all agree, one of the bravest, most significant advocates of freedom and liberty in known history. However, he wasn't a vegetarian, open your eyes and realise that in the grand scheme of thing, eating meat really isn't that big a deal.

 

[nightandday]

I think the story about The Smiths snubbing Factory is a non-starter. Had they signed with Factory their image would have been identical with their image on Rough Trade because Morrissey supervised everything from start to finish. Peter Saville's genius would not have been needed. They didn't want to be in Factory's stable of bands and that's that. Probably had a lot to do with their dislike of Anthony H. Wilson, but then I'm sure the feeling was mutual. I don't buy the idea that Wilson is jealous.

Did they really snub them? I thought that Rob Gretton said that their demo tape was 'shit; and that The Factory weren't interested in signing them.

 

[nightandday]

http://www.g4tv.com/pile_player.aspx?video_key=13046

What kind of shitty site is that? My browser only plays the video until the part when Wilson says he hates Morrissey. Could anyone tell me what else he says?

 

[Worm]

Factory (Rob and Tony) didn't think the demo tape was good. That's their side of the story. The Smiths' side is this:

Why not sign with Factory?

Johnny: "We'd be stuck in the 'Manchester scene' then. What we're thinking of isn't even in terms of national success. It's more like world wide..."

Morrissey: "Factory aren't really interested in new groups. Factory have been good, but they now belong to a time that is past. Look, we had a great social life, Factory has been great, but let's leave all that behind us now."

"Look, the quote that best sums up the Smiths is from Jack Nichells' book Men's Liberation: 'We are here and it is now'. I feel really strongly about NOW. I don't want to wait around, I don't care about two years time, things have got to happen RIGHT NOW for the Smiths. And I think they will."

Sounds, June 4, 1983​

That could be a wounded reaction to Factory's indifference to their demos. My impression, though, was that this was their attitude even before they sent the demo tape in. At that point in their career they may have sent in their demos to a few labels they didn't really like so as not to limit their choices, or perhaps to create a buzz or a bidding war. Maybe Joe Moss sent Rob the tape without their knowledge. Maybe the Manchester scene was so small the tape just got around on its own.

The main thing is, whatever their reasons for sending their demos in, they were lukewarm on Factory, as revealed in the comments above and later comments made about Factory's sterility, New Order's aura, and so on. Over the years the idea has taken root that The Smiths rejected Factory and not the other way around. I don't think I could reproduce the timeline of all the comments, but I believe the story of Tony and Rob not liking the demo tapes came about well after The Smiths' demise, when Tony-- as his is wont-- felt the need to piss a little harder than his enemies in the endless pissing war that is his glorious life.

 

[duchess_of_fork]

So. What you're saying is. Anybody who eats bacon cannot "have much integrity or compassion...or anything really...going for them in their life", personally I think that's a little niave, and that, in about 10 years time, when you're all grown up, you might just look back on that and realise just how small minded you sound. I could be wrong though, it has been known.

Besides, it is tasty, especially with brown sauce.

you're being an ageist. my views won't change in 10 years. age has nothing to do with it. anyone with a functioning heart and an ounce of intellect can understand how cruel the meat industry is. you're going for primitive pleasures, pleasures of taste. which is fine, but not when someone else loses their life for it. i fear you may never find real pleasures of life if you base them on flesh of another living being...

having said that, keep eating your bacon and brown sauce.., you'll regret it after your clogg your arteries.... what goes around, comes around....and i hope it catches up with you when you're chasing your little grandson around the tomatoe garden with an orange wedge in your mouth...

 

[CharethCutestory]

you're being an ageist. my views won't change in 10 years. age has nothing to do with it. anyone with a functioning heart and an ounce of intellect can understand how cruel the meat industry is. you're going for primitive pleasures, pleasures of taste. which is fine, but not when someone else loses their life for it. i fear you may never find real pleasures of life if you base them on flesh of another living being...

having said that, keep eating your bacon and brown sauce.., you'll regret it after your clogg your arteries.... what goes around, comes around....and i hope it catches up with you when you're chasing your little grandson around the tomatoe garden with an orange wedge in your mouth...

Sorry, all of my last post didn't make it so I edited it in, it went like this -

"Martin Luther king was, I think we can all agree, one of the bravest, most significant advocates of freedom and liberty in known history. However, he wasn't a vegetarian, open your eyes and realise that in the grand scheme of thing, eating meat really isn't that big a deal.".

Nice Godfather reference though. Always nice to have someone, particularly someone who claims to care so much about the life of "creatures", to wish death on you.

Regardless of whether you think I'm the tyranny of evil men or not, please try and not close yourself off to new ideas. I expect a great many of my opinions will change over the next 10 years, it's called learning.

 

[duchess_of_fork]

Sorry, all of my last post didn't make it so I edited it in, it went like this -

"Martin Luther king was, I think we can all agree, one of the bravest, most significant advocates of freedom and liberty in known history. However, he wasn't a vegetarian, open your eyes and realise that in the grand scheme of thing, eating meat really isn't that big a deal.Martin Luther king was, I think we can all agree, one of the bravest, most significant advocates of freedom and liberty in known history. However, he wasn't a vegetarian, open your eyes and realise that in the grand scheme of thing, eating meat really isn't that big a deal".

Nice Godfather reference though. Always nice to have someone, particularly someone who claims to care so much about the life of "creatures, to wish death on you.

Regardless of whether you think I'm the tyranny of evil men or not, please try and not close yourself off to new ideas. I expect a great many of my opinions will change over the next 10 years, it's called learning.

king was brave for humans and he made significant change for us. however, he did nothing for the animals (and I, in no way believe, that human beings are more valuable than animals, so from that perspective, I don't find my statement, in any way, blasphemous) they could care less. specism sucks, just like racism. i'm sure he'd agree with me.

i don't wish you death, but what else do you expect me to say if you're such an avid supporter of unhealthy "food" like that!? i wish you traded your pig fat for tofu. i really do. it would make you feel better than ever and you'd know you're not living thanks to someone elses body.

maybe in the next 10 years you'll have a peta membership....

 

[WhyteGrrrl]

I find this thread hilarious.

 

[CharethCutestory]

i'm sure he'd agree with me.


maybe in the next 10 years you'll have a peta membership....

I'm pretty sure he wouldn't, and I'm definately sure I won't. I abhor violence towards humans you see, sure eating animals is violent towards them, but even by your own (to my eyes, foolish) arguement, you can see that a group that says they support "living creatures" and then violently attacks one species in order to help another, is f***ing fruitcake at best.

Comparing the farming of animals to the centuries of oppression black people suffered makes you sound like, well, a nobhead.

 

[Please]

Whatsizface kind of gave birth to the Manchester music scene. Without whatsizface I very much doubt this board would exist. Check the history books kid.

The same could be said for Wilson, would he have existed if it was not for his own mother, and further more tHe seX PisTols

 

[spleenhead]

but even by your own (to my eyes, foolish) arguement, you can see that a group that says they support "living creatures" and then violently attacks one species in order to help another, is f***ing fruitcake at best.

Attack one species to help another? You mean like the excuse people use for animal testing?

 

[lilikoi]

jeeez - doesn't chareth have anything better to do in life than to rehash the same old crap over and over again? I mean - WHY do you think anyone over here is interested in the fact that you eat f***ing bacon? dude: we GOT the message - really. change the f... channel!

 

[drunken goldfish]

Comparing the farming of animals to the centuries of oppression black people suffered makes you sound like, well, a nobhead.

Bashevis Singer once compared the meat industry to Treblinka. Was he a nobhead too? I'm not a vegetarian, but I definitely see his point. (I realize this makes me worse than "blind" meateaters...).

 

[CharethCutestory]

Bashevis Singer once compared the meat industry to Treblinka. Was he a nobhead too? I'm not a vegetarian, but I definitely see his point. (I realize this makes me worse than "blind" meateaters...).

I'm not familiar with the quote, so without seeing it in context I wouldn't really want to comment to be honest.

 

[drunken goldfish]

^^I just knew it as a famous saying by him, it turns out it's from a short story, The Letter Writer: "They have convinced themselves that man, the worst transgressor of all the species, is the crown of creation. All other creatures were created merely to provide him with food, pelts, to be tormented, exterminated. In relation to them, all people are Nazis; for the animals it is an eternal Treblinka."
While this is a character talking, Bashevis Singer was a very strong advocate of animal rights, so I think we can assume he felt this way himself. Anyway, even without the context, do you not see the parallels between the Holocaust and the way animals are treated? Not just the mass slaughter - I think what made the Holocaust different and more horrifying from all other cases of genocide was the fact that people were treated in the same horrible way we treat animals - experimented on, bodyparts used for products...