Morrissey and Linder

It's a part of his above mentioned unused sleevenote for the compilation that was supposed to be released in 1985/86, but was cancelled. That part is quoted in the sleevenotes for Ludus CD reissues, which are written by James Nice, the boss of LTM (Les Tempes Modernes), the label that specializes in reissuing obscure post-punk bands, which reissued Ludus back catalogue in 2002. Nice's sleevenotes accompany all 3 CDs, and they can also be read at LTM site as Ludus biography:

http://home.wxs.nl/~frankbri/ludushis.html

The quote from Morrissey's unused 1985 sleevenote is at the end. I've never seen the complete text of that sleevenote, just quote and the phrase mentioned by Simon Goddard in his book.
I find all of Morrissey's reviews of Ludus very interesting to read. Here's an excerpt from another one of his reviews, this one from mid 1981 (this one is also quoted in the Ludus biography that I provided the link to):

"Ludus perch uneasily on the fringes of all things bright and avant-garde. Being the only sensible recipe for the culturally damaged, theirs is a name destined to be in everyone's mouth, should justice prevail. Knowing that it very rarely does, Ludus are out to at least stretch their patience with the world to the very elastic limit. And it is never denied that their music is unlike almost anyone else's."

He also wrote reviews full of praise of their live shows, from the time when 'Steven Morrissey' worked Record Mirror. "Severed Alliance" mentions his review of their first gig with Ian Devine (who replaced guitarist Arthur Kadmon and bassist Willie Trotter in mid 1979): "Morrissey ensured that the ensemble's lengthy three-song set was documented extensively in the pages of Record Mirror and praised 'scene veteran' Linder for delivering 'a wild melange od ill-disciplined and extraneous vocal movements apparently without effort'. New boy Devine was deemed 'tragically anonymous, but probably prefers to be', while Toby, like many drummers in Morrissey's firmament of fame, simply 'cannot be faulted'. "

And this review of a Depeche Mode concert with Ludus as the support (22 August 1981 - Record Mirror ) is amusing because Moz is so passionate in his musical hate as well as in his love:

"Depeche Mode may not be the most remarkably boring group ever to walk the face of the earth, but they're certainly in the running. Their sophisticated nonsense succeeds only in emphasising just how hilariously unimaginative they really are. At once we recognise four coiffured Barry White's (a nauseating version); "cain't get enough of your lerve" they profess too dull to be even boring. They ressurect every murderouly monotous cliche known to modern man, and "New Life" looms as nothing more than a bland jelly-baby. Still the man from 'Jackie' was impressed, knowing that, at leat, these boys have nice hair... and the conveyor belt moves along. Ludus, plainly wishing they were elsewhere, hammered out a passionate set to an audience possibly hand-picked for their tone deafness. But Ludus like to wallow in other people's depravities and therefore their music offers everything to everyone. Linder was born singing and has more imagination than Depeche Mode could ever hope for. Still Depeche Mode get the Jackie spread. No justice!" "

:D Depeche Mode ar one of my favourite bands, but only for their output from 1986 onwards - I have to say I'd agree with Moz if I heard them in their early days, I hate "I Just Can't Get Enough" and most of their early synth-pop stuff!

According to "Songs That Saved Your Life", he also wrote a "factual resume 'Let's Look at Ludus' - a press release for Linder's post-punk/jazz outfit. In it, he refers to them as being 'flower-like', a figurative simile borrowed from Oscar Wilde which would again reappear within the lyrics of 'Miserable Lie' to describe Morrissey's own 'flower-like life."

But the most interesting texts he wrote about have been in the recent years - in the sleevenotes for his compilation "Under the Influence":

"Gliding in without oars, Ludus belong to the sea. Linder comes into position against the light, at double-sail, holding her words prepared. The weight of despair lifts like a deceptive fog only because the voice sings. “Breaking the Rules” might appear to be a statement, but like all Ludus songs, it is really a question laid out like a statement. This is the delightfully recurring now-that-you’ve-got-me-where-I-want-you Linder trick. I want to be caught. Linder’s tags of verse offer advice, strength, warmth, sustenance and inspiration, as she sings – not roughly, but firmly. I want to be caught twice. My mouth cannot close whilst “Breaking the Rules” plays... "

and in the essay he wrote for Linder's monograph "Linder Works 1976-2006, which you can read in my earlier thread:


http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=64515&highlight=monograph

"I first saw Linder as she introduced Buzzcocks onstage at the Lesser Free Trade Hall in Manchester during the summer of 1976. A few months later, I would spot Linder sitting on a table during the soundcheck for the Sex Pistols third Manchester gig. I was 17, and biologically inferior to everyone else. Linder was a bit older, with terrifying hair. I decided to approach her, specifically to prove to her that I had no viewpoint whatsoever about anything. Some 30 years later, that conversation has yet to pause.

Most tormentedly aware, Linder seemed to know something that I knew. We both spoke in cinematic language, and we both somehow knew that our presence on earth was trouble enough for those around us. How had we endured?

From a rented room in Whalley Range Linder's art supplied the unspoken. She led me by the lapel to Janice G. Raymond's The Transsexual Empire, Calvin C. Hernton's Sex and Racism, and to Philippe Aries' Western Attitudes Towards Death. To me, her life, then, was messianic. Linder took up the pen, the brush, the chalk, and stood as if behind a machine gun, perceiving danger swiftly and more keenly than the shell-suited mutants of surrounding Manchester.

In 1980, Linder's art spoke of the delusions of possession, your life - your body! - does not belong to you. She seemed to have a need to sing that went further than revenge.

I did not know or hear anyone at all across human civilisation who was like Linder. The vital centre of Linder's songs was the failure to find personal gratification, for which the singing of these songs momentarily restored the balance. In live performance, Linder carried tales that allowed us to glimpse the abyss, against a backdrop of tough and boyish bog-water guitars and thunderous drums. Linder tore the lyrics out with her teeth, every song addressing the self, or asking: Is your life enough?

The first single by Linder zapped into the then hollowed independent chart in March of 1980 at number 32. All of our suffering seemed to be temporarily over. Although the songs read as screams, Linder moved smoothly like a brooding Julie London. The women of punk sang in clipped and chopped no-moral-code regional accents, while Linder's angry voice was soft and soothing. However, the musical mood throughout England during this time was of sociability and savage ignorance. Post-punk major labels had reinstated the blank aspect that would protect them, as if to tell us that we had had our fun, after all.

Squeezing through, Linder's Single Of The Week status in the reasonably respected Sounds magazine, was chased a week later by the most hateful and paranoid rail against her very being; concern with female desire was seen as a sexual transgression (of some kind). The bad killed the good.

Visually, Linder's protean quality suggested a female Eugene Sandow; the body a vehicle of... unwillingness; a naturally beautiful woman with the ideal of everything, who physically embodied the ideal, yet who sang in temporal terms of forces of containment. 'Would you like to unlock me?' Houdini provided source material for Linder's live presentations.

In 1982, her best album, Riding the Rag, was buried without ceremony by the press. One triumphant review on the NME battleground could not quite provide enough oxygen. Late in 1983, Linder stopped singing. 'I'm by nature / soli-tary'.

The Linder of the Second Period intensified her artistic endeavours. 'A bag of tricks / is my poli-tics.'

In my view, Linder's life is a docudrama, potent and therefore lethal. She is aware of the inevitable punishment for those who seek to kick against the enforced limitations of their lives, and she is aware of the price you pay for exposing restraints. The 1990s had Linder and me replacing the dead white greenish cast of unforgiving Manchester with the bright catacombs of El Paso, Los Angeles and Phoenix; Linder armed with her cameras, and me with a despair long past explaining.

In time a tale will be told."
 
Ludus are a truly terrific band - probably the best one of i've gotten into through Morrissey. Its really tough to pick a favorite song, although obviously "Breaking the Rules" stands out as one of the catchier ones, since almost all the songs have this strange melodic and rhythmic structure that catch you in various points of the song. I find that most of the albums are not exactly listenable from start to finish, and I don't mean that in a bad way. Its more like I end up finding portions in the song that catch my ear more than others which means to me that Ludus never strived for homogeniety; each song is literally a work of art with lots of different musical ideas thrown in - its really kind of overwhelming!

Unfortunately, as Morrissey also pointed out, this makes it impossible for them to be on the radio, but I was shocked to find their albums on iTunes USA this morning! What the...!?!? It was a pleasant surprise though. :)
 
Ludus are a truly terrific band - probably the best one of i've gotten into through Morrissey. Its really tough to pick a favorite song, although obviously "Breaking the Rules" stands out as one of the catchier ones, since almost all the songs have this strange melodic and rhythmic structure that catch you in various points of the song. I find that most of the albums are not exactly listenable from start to finish, and I don't mean that in a bad way. Its more like I end up finding portions in the song that catch my ear more than others which means to me that Ludus never strived for homogeniety; each song is literally a work of art with lots of different musical ideas thrown in - its really kind of overwhelming!

Unfortunately, as Morrissey also pointed out, this makes it impossible for them to be on the radio, but I was shocked to find their albums on iTunes USA this morning! What the...!?!? It was a pleasant surprise though. :)

Really all I have is a bunch of downloads, I'm definitly getting that, thanks :) She's amazing, she should be an icon in herself. I mean even if her artistic output wasnt so brilliant just the things she says and her ideas would be iconic.
 
I think that you deserve some sort of award, at least for Poster Who Turns the Discussion In the Most Unexpected Direction! :) I'm surprised that you haven't heard the story of the guy from Sudan who had to marry a goat, it was all over internet at one point, but if you want me to tell you more, I'll do it later in Official Off-topic Thread. I'd prefer to take the discussion on goat-loving to Off-topic - the place for all the siliness & in-depth political and anthropological discussions! :cool:

Thank you! The last award I got was for an attempt at dancing, and to be honest, a good kick up the arse in front of my entire school would have left me with more dignity. But oh well, at least this way, I'm able to walk. Anyhow, I remember that story now, and at the time I thought that the sentencing for the Sudan Lad was rather strange. Why punish the goat for something that he did (presuming of course that the goat was not the seducter)?

About Linder and Morrissey, he does talk about her in a very romantic and poetic way, so at the least, I guess we could say that he has 'friendly feelings' for her. Which of course, lends itself to the claim that he has romantic feelings for her also. Oooooh I just had a thought...............let's have a 'Morrisseys' Speculated Lovers Thread'! I've heard loads of names that have been linked with him, and I've always wanted to know if they really were significant, and more importantly, who they were at all, at all! (Actually, a more important question which needs to be asked in relation to Morrissey is this - Has our dear MozMeister any love for Maths? And if not, why not?)


But yes, we should discuss that upsetting matter (goats and matrimony) in another thread, however, the sweet call of Mathematics beckons me at present.............;)
 
When I was in the tender age of 12 and was only starting to get into Smiths I went to a friend's house and his sister (then 18), who was a big Smiths fan and one of the biggest Smiths "experts" of those times, was watching some documentary about them that contained interviews with the band, some journalists and - amongst others - Linder. I asked her "Who's she?" and she responded "That's Linder. She's now Morrissey's best friend but they were lovers and I heard they used to make love all covered in mayonaise". Although I later realized she was only kidding, the picture of them naked, all covered in mayonaise was stuck in my mind for so long that even now I have difficulties to believe that didn't really happen! Funny how you can't fight some things off although you know they aren't actually true ... aaah *erase* *erase* but it's not working!
 
Anyhow, I remember that story now, and at the time I thought that the sentencing for the Sudan Lad was rather strange. Why punish the goat for something that he did (presuming of course that the goat was not the seducter)?
There was actually some conversation at the time on the issue whether the goat consented to sex or not... and someone suggested that she, at least, did not refuse, or she would have kicked him really hard. i wonder if that's considered enough. Hmmmm.... But we don't know what she thought of the marriage business! And I wonder how she said 'I do'? :confused:

Oooooh I just had a thought...............let's have a 'Morrisseys' Speculated Lovers Thread'! I've heard loads of names that have been linked with him, and I've always wanted to know if they really were significant, and more importantly, who they were at all, at all!
OMG, that would be a long thread!! Isn't that practically everybody who has ever been known to have spent more than 5 minutes in his company? I'm not even sure that all those people exist... :rolleyes: :p

Well, at least he has never been linked to any cats, dogs or goats! (or has he?...) :p
 
About Linder and Morrissey, he does talk about her in a very romantic and poetic way, so at the least, I guess we could say that he has 'friendly feelings' for her. Which of course, lends itself to the claim that he has romantic feelings for her also.
That reminds me...

Have you seen this:

http://www.paulstolper.com/portfolios_diamond.php?1

http://www.edinburgh-printmakers.co.uk/folios/diamond_dust/index.htm

It's a silkscreen version of the photo of Morrissey in concert that Linder took in 1991, published in a 'Diamond Dust portfolio' (including the works of Peter Saville, Damien Hurst and several other artists). The title is quite interesting:

linder.jpg



Linder
Mon Coeur ne bat que pour Morrissey
Silkscreen on paper with diamond dust, 2003
50.5 x 75 cm
Edition of 60
Published by Paul Stolper
 
Thanks for all of the info on Ludus Nightandday :) I'm very curious to hear some of their stuff.

Very interesting that Morrissey refers to 'a rented room in Whalley Range' in that essay for Linder.
Hmm..!
 
Although I later realized she was only kidding, the picture of them naked, all covered in mayonaise was stuck in my mind for so long that even now I have difficulties to believe that didn't really happen! Funny how you can't fight some things off although you know they aren't actually true ... aaah *erase* *erase* but it's not working!

i know how you feel
my mind is ravaged by scarring mental images from the past
:)
 
Thanks for all of the info on Ludus Nightandday :) I'm very curious to hear some of their stuff.
I could upload some of their stuff. Actually, I've already got so me stuff uploaded to savefile... but are wma files OK for you? :)

Very interesting that Morrissey refers to 'a rented room in Whalley Range' in that essay for Linder.
Hmm..!
Yes, I thought so, too. It's quite interesting that he keeps using the phrases he used in early Smiths songs, particularly "Miserable Lie", in his essays about Linder written a few years ago. There's something for Simon Goddard to pay attention to, if he ever gets round to a third edition of his book! He noted, as a link between "Miserable Lie" and Ludus/Linder, that Morrissey used the phrase 'flower-like', borrowed from Wilde, in his text about Ludus that he wrote a few months before the song was written. If I were in Goddard's shoes, I'd also note that Ludus song "Mutilate" (1981) has the chorus:

"Mutilate my mind
Measure up my kind"

and that Morrissey wrote in his sleevenotes for "Under the Influence":

“Breaking the Rules” might appear to be a statement, but like all Ludus songs, it is really a question laid out like a statement. This is the delightfully recurring now-that-you’ve-got-me-where-I-want-you Linder trick. I want to be caught. Linder’s tags of verse offer advice, strength, warmth, sustenance and inspiration, as she sings – not roughly, but firmly. I want to be caught twice."

compare with:


"So, goodbye
please stay with your own kind
and I'll stay with mine

There's something against us
it's not time
So, goodbye

I know I need hardly say
how much I love your casual way
but please put your tongue away
a little higher and we're well away
the dark nights are drawing in
and your humour is as black as them
I look at yours, you laugh at mine
and "love" is just a miserable lie
you have destroyed my flower-like life
not once - but twice
you have corrupt my innocent mind
not once - but twice

I know the wind-swept mystical air
it means: I'd like to see your underwear
I recognise that mystical air
it means: I'd like to seize your underwear
what do we get for our trouble and pain?
just a rented room in Whalley Range..."
 
Last edited:
isn't linder married right now? i cannot recall where i read that but i'm sure i came across it recently...
 
isn't linder married right now? i cannot recall where i read that but i'm sure i came across it recently...
She's living with the novelist/pop critic Michael Bracewell. I don't know if they are officially married, I suppose they aren't, because I've seen him referred to as her 'partner'. He was also in "The Importance Of Being Morrissey". I've also seen him on BBC, he did a documentary about Oscar Wilde (it was an old documetary, from 1995).
 
Hey, more great info, Nightandday - especially those references you highlighted in Miserable Lie - thanks :D

Oh, Miserable Lie is sooo about Linder. Who are we kidding!?I think you've just cemented that for me. ;)

I'm a completely technologically-retarded so I have no idea what sort of files would be suitable for some of your Ludus tracks. If I ever figure it out, I'll let you know! hehe Might see if I can find some Ludus CDs...though they're probably not that easy to come across.
 
I'm a completely technologically-retarded so I have no idea what sort of files would be suitable for some of your Ludus tracks. If I ever figure it out, I'll let you know! hehe Might see if I can find some Ludus CDs...though they're probably not that easy to come across.

If you use Windows, you can play wma files in anything - WMP, Winamp, itunes. But I think that Mac users can't use them. I've got most of the tracks in mp3 too, but wma files (ripped from CD) are smaller and therefore easier to upload.

I don't know if you can find Ludus CDs in stores, I had to order mine (you can order them from amazon, but it takes less time if you order them directly from LTM).
 
is there a gallery of Ludus/Linder photographs? I've seen a couple but never an organized website containing sort of chronological, collected pictures of her.
 
If you use Windows, you can play wma files in anything - WMP, Winamp, itunes. But I think that Mac users can't use them. I've got most of the tracks in mp3 too, but wma files (ripped from CD) are smaller and therefore easier to upload.

I don't know if you can find Ludus CDs in stores, I had to order mine (you can order them from amazon, but it takes less time if you order them directly from LTM).

Well, I do use windows, so I could play wma files...i think. God, I'm only 29, I should really have a grip on these things ;)
Yes, I imagine I won't find Ludus at my CD store, which is a shame.
 
is there a gallery of Ludus/Linder photographs? I've seen a couple but never an organized website containing sort of chronological, collected pictures of her.
I don't think so, there isn't any website dedicated to her. And I've sure googled a lot. But I do have a number pics collected here and there. It's not that easy to find her pics and info on her, although she's had a bit more exposure this year.

You can see what she looks like now in the pics and video documentation from her performance 'Working Class Goes To Paradise' from April this year, it's on the Tate Gallery website:

http://www.tate.org.uk/britain/exhibitions/triennial/liveworks/linder-video.htm


I downloaded the audios and videos from the performance to see what it is like. I can't say that I'm into performance art otherwise, but I found it...very compelling and very interesting.

linder_paradise_1.jpg


linder_paradise_8.jpg
 
Back
Top Bottom