LOVE MUSIC HATE RACISM not so supportive of Morrissey

Theo

Active Member
I read Love Music Hate Racism's most recent statement about the Morrissey controversy and, while they welcome Morrissey's support, they're not sounding like they're having a love-in with Morrissey.

First, they gush over the NME, strongly reiterating and underlining how fantastic the NME has been to their cause:

NME
LMHR would like to reiterate and underline the fantastic and invaluable contribution that NME and it’s staff have made this year to the anti-racist cause and to LMHR in particular.

Their backing has hugely raised the profile of LMHR and the anti- racist movement in general. To date, in addition to 140,000 CD’s mounted on the NME’s cover on October 19th, around 450,000 of the NME/LMHR/NUT CD sleeves have been distributed across the UK in school, colleges, youth networks, at gigs and in workplaces. There has been a significant increase in the number of people actively involved in the campaign and in putting on LMHR shows all over the country. The Paddingtons and others’ excellent letter announcing the formation of Hull LMHR which appeared in the same issue of NME as the Morrissey interview - and which has received no media attention whatsoever - is a great example. The NME’s editor, Conor McNicholas, has gone further than any other national media figure in backing the campaign, particularly - in article after article - refusing to be squeamish about calling the British National Party (BNP) a fascist organisation which should have no part in a democratic society.

NME’s vocal support for LMHR has also provoked a very useful debate via it’s letters page and in the wider media on both organised racism as well as the wider racist ideas on which the likes of the BNP feed.

We are proud for our campaign to be associated with the NME and want to continue working together with them.


Then they turn to Morrissey, briefly and politely accepting his support:

Morrissey
Morrissey’s publicly stated commitment to anti-racism, and his offer of practical support to the LMHR campaign should be welcomed by everyone. LMHR is about fighting for an anti racist culture in music. We want every artist and musician to back the campaign, and to join us in fighting back against the rise of the fascist BNP against mainstream politicians playing the race card, and for the human rights of everyone to not face discrimination or attack on the basis of skin colour, race or religion.


Then, after stating they don't require a supporter to have a particular position on immigration, they attack Morrissey's alleged approach to the subject as reported by the NME (alleged because, as LMHR noted, there's pending litigation):

Immigration
We do not ask for people to have a particular position on immigration in order to accept their support for LMHR.
There are a range of positions that people can take on this question, from a belief that all immigration controls should be scrapped to the idea that the UK’s borders should be closed completely. In 1979, Margaret Thatcher said that “people rather fear being swamped by an alien culture”, and this remains the tone of much of what passes for “debate” in Britain today around the question of immigration. Loaded terms like ‘flood’, ‘influx’ and so on, are the norm. The anti-migrant press never talk about the large number of people leaving the UK, and rarely about the demographic time bomb in which falling birth rates and an ageing population mean that immigration is vital to the UK economy. Much less do the same commentators tell the British public that based on the last official figures available migrants actually contribute net benefit of 2% to the UK’s GDP - rather than being a drain on resources and services as we’re constantly told. Last year, asylum applications fell by 8% to just over 23,000. The same year over 73% of refugee applications were refused by the government. Thousands of genuine refugees are locked up in government detention centres. The ‘debate’ around immigration is not conducted in a vacuum, but in an atmosphere bordering on hysteria with racist assumptions and overtones. We very rarely hear scare stories about white American/Australian/South African/Northern or Western European immigrants to the UK for example.


Morrissey allegedly used the words "flood" and "influx," which Love Music Hate Racism regard as loaded terms that are not helpful for healthy debate as the debate is being conducted in an atmosphere of hysteria with racist assumptions. It sounds like Love Music Hate Racism take the Billy Bragg view on Morrissey's comments using "inflammatory" language.

So, they aren't calling Morrissey a racist, but it's not exactly a mutual admiration society.
 
D

Dave

Guest
Yes, they jumped on his comments and tried to use it to their benefit, and then they saw that if they forged some sort of alliance with him that they could play both sides.

Love Music, Hate Racism is a well intentioned idea but it's a clumsy slogan, and I'm not sure how effective or influential they are. I sort of think that you are either racist or not, based on how you were raised, and that having Pete Doherty or someone sing a song about how we should all get along isn't really going to stop any racial violence. If you are the sort of person that is going to think, "Gee, racism is wrong" because some pop star said so, then you are a robot/puppet anyway. Which I think is cool with LMHR as long as you buy one of their t-shirts and a membership card for your wallet.
 

Theo

Active Member
What Love Music Hate Racism would call Morrissey a racist for is:

Culture
There is also a common, and racist, idea that other ‘cultures’, particularly at the moment ‘Islamic culture’ represent a threat to ‘British culture’ or ‘the British way of life’. Such ideas are a nonsense. Even forty years ago, the idea of a single identifiable ‘British culture’ was questionable to say the least. Britain, like every other country, was and remains culturally divided along lines of class, race, gender and in many other ways. What we do have is a multicultural society and we believe that this sort of society enriches life for everybody who lives in it. This sort of society has not arrived completely by accident - people have argued and fought for it over decades. We need to continue to defend and extend our multicultural society, to unite to expose and take on the racists and fascists. Multiculturalism is inherent in music and so we believe that music plays a fantastic role in the anti racist struggle. We welcome working with everyone who agrees with this.


If Morrissey agrees, Love Music Hate Racism welcomes working with him.

This could be problematic if we dug around too long in Morrissey's past interviews. Haven't there been some where he regards other cultures as a threat to British culture?

Fortunately for Morrissey, many of his comments along these lines have singled out American culture and "Americanization" as the big threat. Fortunate because left-wingers are almost always down with anti-Americanism. It's high-fives all around when a Far Leftist hears about a Starbucks getting its windows smashed.

But whatever you do, Morrissey, never say a single bad word about Islamic culture. Stick with that stuff about Middle Eastern Tunings, trust me. I actually gasped when you said the Danish cartoonists who drew pics of Muhammad had nothing to apologize for while you witnessed Islamist protestors outside a hotel. Although I would've thought everyone in sight - most especially all the billions of "moderate Muslims" we are told are everywhere - would've given their support to freedom to speech when it was under assault by thuggishly anti-freedom Islamists seething in blood-thirsty protest, by the time you made that comment I realized it was considered a "controversial" thing to say outside the ranks of "right-wing Islamophobes".

Even though Islam isn't a race any more than American is, you will indeed be a filthy racist if you are concerned about Islamic culture's influence within your country. If your government gives haven to radical, terror-loving imams who open Islamist franchises in your city to recruit mass-murdering suicide bombers and dish out endless incitements to violence, hate, and barbarism, this is in no way a threat to anyone.

Even if they're making bombs in the basement of the radical mosque! Even if they're raising funds for terrorist groups! If the Islamist franchises popping up in your city are spreading the abuse of women to the extent that the local women's shelters are loaded with the victims, do not worry your head off. Just as people in Australia shouldn't raise an eyebrow about one of the foremost Muslim leaders in their country opining that an uncovered woman who's gang-raped got what she deserves because it's like putting raw meat in front of cats. So, keep the noise down about the woman in your town enslaved by fundamentalist Islam, living in quiet desperation.

Unfortunately for me, I believe Islamist extremism is rampant within Islamic culture and, because it is spreading into Europe, it's a type of cultural imperialism that is a threat to the cultures, ways of life, and values of western nations. Certainly more of a threat than a Starbucks or a Wal-Mart or Hollywood movies. To say this is in light of Love Music Hate Racism's statement on whose support they welcome is to say that I will not take my cue from Morrissey and kiss this organization's ring in order to not be branded a "racist."

And so I am free. Free to think as I like and say what I feel.
 
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Theo

Active Member
A note on anti-Americanism. I think much anti-Americanism is silly, retarded, and backwards, but that's not to say some of it isn't a healthy, natural, or at least understandable reaction to American over-dominance. I can understand how people feel some of these things, and have never been bugged by the song "America Is Not The World", which also has some love for America. I live in America, adore American culture, generally admire and am proud of its cultural influence abroad (though not the hamburger), and find much of the attacks on "American cultural impersialism" trendy and misguided. Yet even I can simultaneously (though to a lesser degree) relate to to the feelings behind some of those comments, just not the backasswards ones.
 
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who would you listen to deliver the anti-racist message

choice 1. a politician

choice 2. your fav pop-star

it may be simple but people listen to music & listen to the message their pop-stars say! It really is that simple but so effective.

I remember Rock against Racism as a kid, it does work.

love

Grim
P.s. Dave why do you engage with thicko he only comes he to spread his nut job theories.
 

Theo

Active Member
Love Music, Hate Racism is a well intentioned idea but it's a clumsy slogan, and I'm not sure how effective or influential they are. I sort of think that you are either racist or not, based on how you were raised, and that having Pete Doherty or someone sing a song about how we should all get along isn't really going to stop any racial violence. If you are the sort of person that is going to think, "Gee, racism is wrong" because some pop star said so, then you are a robot/puppet anyway. Which I think is cool with LMHR as long as you buy one of their t-shirts and a membership card for your wallet.


Looking around Love Music Hate Racism's site, I saw they issued a heated attack on David Cameron because Cameron said something about how rap music that glorifies thug culture and violence has a negative influence. "Clueless Cameron puts the knife into black music" http://www.lovemusichateracism.com/uncategorized/2006/06/09/cameron-puts-the-knife-into-black-music/

Love Music Hate Racism are of the view that pop music can have all these positive influence on listeners' mentalities, so why can't pop music also sometimes have negative influences?

Well, actually that's not quite true. They do think some music has a negative influence. Love Music Hate Racism say this at the end of their attack on Cameron:
There’s certainly one sort of music that’s clearly linked to violent crime: the racist rubbish peddled by the British National Party (BNP)’s record label “Great White Records”. The BNP have apparently been handing out racist music CDs at schools at the same time as several young black people have been murdered by racists with knives and axes. Why do we not hear a storm of protest from David Cameron about this ‘culture’??


(I noted tonight in another thread that Cameron has spoken out quite strongly against anything and everything to do with the BNP.)

I'm not sure how much influence pop music can have. I think it can have some, and I suspect it's easier for music to have a positive influence because I think people would rather have their better angels re-enforced by the music they listen to than their uglier sides. But I'm pretty sure the most thuggish hip hop does re-enforce the worst things going on in thug subculture amongst at least some people. I know someone in my life (and many of her acquaintances) for whom that seems to be the case (and she's currently in jail...again.....). It's a hard thing to work out because most people who listen to thug rap don't want to emulate the worst things in the lyrics. I listen to thug rap because it amuses me! :p But the notion that thug rap doesn't have some negative influence on some people is not true.

Love Music Hate Racism go after Cameron like this:
In a bid to get headlines about his tough stance on knife and gun crime, Cameron trotted out the tired old racist myth that hip-hop music encourages violent crime.

No hesitation to throw around the "racist" word when it's a Tory. Forget the fact that Cameron would find many allies in America from black people who live in the most violent neighborhoods.

Love Music Hate Racism also say:
Hip-hop and rap music is now hugely popular worldwide and like all music comes in many forms. Being, as Public Enemy’s Chuck D put it, “the CNN of the ghetto”, hip-hop more than any other music reflects the unpleasant harsh reality of poverty and racism in the world today.

I agree that rap music is sometimes like a "CNN of the ghetto." I only quote this because it's amusing how Love Music Hate Racism don't consider Chuck D a racist. This, a man who celebrates the hardcore racist Farrakhan in his lyrics and whose partner had to leave the group for saying anti-Semitic things.

Here's what Cameron said:

At a meeting with magazine editors, Mr Cameron said legislation alone was not enough to cut knife crime and insisted youth culture bore some of the blame for violence. He said: "It means saying to Radio 1: 'Do you realise that some of the stuff you play on Saturday nights encourages people to carry guns and knives?' Some people say that's part of the nanny state - I say the opposite."

Mr Cameron said his comments were an example of his having "the courage to speak up when you see something that is wrong" despite the fact that "you will get a lot of bricks thrown at you".

A spokesman for the Tory leader said: "He believes there is a lot of good music out there, and some musicians have been very positive role models and have highlighted important issues. But there are other cases where music encourages and glorifies violence. Governments can legislate, but as David has said before, that can only go so far. There also needs to be a change of culture and you need people to show cultural leadership."


Obviously it's a political strategy to attack hip hop, but that doesn't mean there's not a little truth in there too.

Or...I dunno. But once again, if you're a racist because you attack hip hop, Morrissey better hope Love Music Hate Racism doesn't go over his past interviews too closely!



Q: Without wishing to rekindle the old "burn down the disco, hang the blessed DJ" furore (any fool knows that "Panic" was written in response to Steve Wright playing Wham! after the Chernobyl newsflash) what do you seriously think of rap and hip-hop?

Morrissey: "I really do think it's a great musical stench. I find it very offensive, artless and styleless. To me it's very reminiscent of thuggery, pop thuggery. I don't want to hear it at all."

Q: But surely it just reflects a different culture from your own?

Morrissey: "I don't think it has anything to do with culture. Initially it did but I think it's burnt out. I know white people who are obsessed with it and feel it speaks to them but I find it remarkably illiterate, without any degree of cunning and without any degree of confrontation. I don't forgive that regardless of the category."


Morrissey is surprised when he finds he knows white folk into hip hop because it's such illiterate music? Imagine if Cameron had said THAT!



Morrissey, in a different interview: "But, ultimately, I don't have very cast iron opinions on black music other than black modern music which I detest. I detest Stevie Wonder. I think Diana Ross is awful. I hate all those records in the Top 40 - Janet Jackson, Whitney Houston. I think they're vile in the extreme. In essence this music doesn't say anything whatsoever."

Q: But it does, it does. What it says can't necessarily be verbalised easily. It doesn't seek to change the world like rock music by speaking grand truths about politics, sex and the human condition. It works at a much more subtle level - at the level of the body and the shared abandon of the dancefloor. It won't change the world, but it's been said it may well change the way you walk through the world.

Morrissey: "I don't think there's any time anymore to be subtle about anything, you have to get straight to the point. Obviously to get on Top Of The Pops these days, one has to be, by law, black. I think something political has occurred among Michael Hurl and his friends and there has been a hefty pushing of all these black artists and all this discofied nonsense into the Top 40. I think, as a result, that very aware younger groups that speak for now are being gagged."

Q: You seem to be saying that you believe that there is some sort of black pop conspiracy being organised to keep white indie groups down.

Morrissey: "Yes, I really do."


Oh my! Talk about sticking a knife into black music! Did Morrissey The 23rd mention this during his phone calls to Love Music Hate Racism?
 
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Theo

Active Member
I've decided it's unfair to go too many years back and dig up old Morrissey quotes.

In his anti-racism and anti-NME statement Morrissey says:

To anyone who has shown or felt any interest in my music in recent times, you know my feelings on the subject

In recent times. Morrissey did get a little more PC during that long break between Maladjusted and You Are The Quarry.
 
D

Dave

Guest
What Love Music Hate Racism would call Morrissey a racist for is:




If Morrissey agrees, Love Music Hate Racism welcomes working with him.

This could be problematic if we dug around too long in Morrissey's past interviews. Haven't there been some where he regards other cultures as a threat to British culture?

Fortunately for Morrissey, many of his comments along these lines have singled out American culture and "Americanization" as the big threat. Fortunate because left-wingers are almost always down with anti-Americanism. It's high-fives all around when a Far Leftist hears about a Starbucks getting its windows smashed.

But whatever you do, Morrissey, never say a single bad word about Islamic culture. Stick with that stuff about Middle Eastern Tunings, trust me. I actually gasped when you said the Danish cartoonists who drew pics of Muhammad had nothing to apologize for while you witnessed Islamist protestors outside a hotel. Although I would've thought everyone in sight - most especially all the billions of "moderate Muslims" we are told are everywhere - would've given their support of freedom to speech when under assault by thuggishly anti-freedom Islamists seething in blood-thirsty protest, by the time you made that comment I realized it was considered a "controversial" thing to say outside the ranks of "right-wing Islamophobes".

Even though Islam isn't a race any more than American is, you will indeed be a filthy racist if you are concerned about Islamic culture's influence within your country. If your government gives haven to radical, terror-loving imams who open Islamist franchises in your city to recruit mass-murdering suicide bombers and dish out endless incitements to violence, hate, and barbarism, this is in no way a threat to anyone.

Even if they're making bombs in the basement of the radical mosque! Even if they're raising funds for terrorist groups! If the Islamist franchises popping up in your city are spreading the abuse of women to the extent that the local women's shelters are loaded with the victims, do not worry your head off. Just as people in Australia shouldn't raise an eyebrow about one of the foremost Muslim leaders in their country opining that an uncovered woman who's gang-raped got what she deserves because it's like putting raw meat in front of cats. So, keep the noise down about the woman in your town enslaved by fundamentalist Islam, living in quiet desperation.

Unfortunately for me, I believe Islamist extremism is rampant within Islamic culture and, because it is spreading into Europe, it's a type of cultural imperialism that is a threat to the cultures, ways of life, and values of western nations. Certainly more of a threat than a Starbucks or a Wal-Mart or Hollywood movies. To say this is in light of Love Music Hate Racism's statement on whose support they welcome is to say that I will not take my cue from Morrissey and kiss this organization's ring in order to not be branded a "racist."

And so I am free. Free to think as I like and say what I feel.

You have hijacked your own thread.
 

Theo

Active Member
You have hijacked your own thread.

I have a tendency to do that.

Okay, back to the topic, that being the not-seeming-so-enthusiastic support Love Music Hate Racism is returning to Morrissey after he sucked up to them.

Morrissey's statement says:

In print, the "new" NME do not explain this, but attempt to multiply the horror of Tim's friend by attributing "these people" and "those people" quotes to me - terms I would never use, but are useful to the "new" NME in their Morrissey-is-racist campaign because these terms are only used by people who are cold and indifferent and Thatcherite.

But he doesn't explicitly disown the terms Love Music Hate Racism describe as Thatcherite.

Love Music Hate Racism:

In 1979, Margaret Thatcher said that “people rather fear being swamped by an alien culture”, and this remains the tone of much of what passes for “debate” in Britain today around the question of immigration. Loaded terms like ‘flood’, ‘influx’ and so on, are the norm.

Unless this is another of my "bizarre theories," don't you think Morrissey was jabbed by Love Music Hate Racism? They're saying, "Oh, but you did use Thatcherite terms."

Unless the NME invented those words, too. But, why didn't Morrissey disown them like he disowned "those people"?

Not that I really care. Just have nothing better to do tonight.
 
Your post regarding where LMHR seem to stand in the Morrissey v's NME issue has prompted me to disclose the details of my loss of faith in LMHR. Below are emails from me to LMHR and from them to me, plus details of a couple of phone calls:

Subject: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 15:33:07 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

I am very interested in your comments regarding the way NME have printed an interview in this weeks edition:

http://www.gigwise.com/news.asp?contentid=39009

Regards,
Hugh Clark
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 17:24:35 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

hi Hugh,

we'll be issuing a statement on this this evening - check the website in the next couple of hours.

cheers

Lee

Love Music Hate Racism
[email protected]
www.lovemusichateracism.com
1st Floor, 231 Vauxhall Bridge Road, London, SW1V 1EH
Tel: 020 7801 2700 xt5101 or 5102 // mob: 07838 15605252

***************************************************************************************
As two days passed and no statement had been issued as promised, I called to ask them when it would be issued. I also expressed I wanted to make my feelings known to them about the NME article; LMHR stance regarding Morrissey v's NME; my views on the issue of racism; my view as a fan of over twenty years of Morrissey's position; and NME's long running anti-Morrissey agenda. They said they were dealing with it at that moment and took my telephone number, saying they'd call me back.

When they called back, they told me that Morrissey's management had been in contact with them at that they would have space at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts to promote their campaign. They also said they wanted Morrissey to make a clear statement regarding where he stood on the issue of racism. I had a long chat with the woman (forgot her name) who called me back. My feelings after the call were positive and she asked if she could call me again but that she had to go to attend a meeting.

***************************************************************************************

FYI: To date she has never called me back.
************************************************** *************************************

THEN

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 30/11/2007 14:09:09 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

When we spoke on the phone earlier today, I said I'd email you and 'the woman' who called me today my contact details. As promised:

My contact details removed from this post

I look forward to helping with your campaign and redressing the balance of the damage done by NME's agenda to damage Morrissey's reputation. You will discover a huge support from Morrissey's audience willing to do the same.

Regards,
Hugh

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 11:48 AM
Subject: Fwd: The NME

http://www.lovemusichateracism.com/:

'A further statement from LMHR on the Morrissey article in this week's NME will appear here shortly.'

When?

Hugh
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 10:08:00 GMT Standard
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi Hugh

Will be tonight, or failing that, tomorrow morning.

cheers,
Lee

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 12:38:28 GMT Standard Time
From: Morris[email protected]
To: [email protected]

Cheers!

The sooner, the better. I noticed a lot of the comments regarding the Morrissey v's NME story over the net and in the media, have included a lot of BNP supporters who have only this week discovered Morrissey. I wonder why?

Racism is too important an issue to be used by the NME for their own anti-Morrissey agenda. It was more than very naughty of them to try and paint Morrissey as a racist. Their personal desire to damage Morrissey has resulted in some people believing them or believing the misreporting of the issue from elsewhere.

The sooner this is sorted. The less damage they will have done to Morrissey and to the anti-racism campaign.

I fully expect your statement to call on Morrissey to clarify his position and I suspect he will. Hopefully you will also clarify your views on the NME spin and distance yourself from them. If you are seen to be in bed with the devil, it will damage your reputation too.

Finally, do you know of any campaign to have racist videos removed from YouTube?

Regards,
Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

***************************************************************************************

I called them back and spoke with Lee highlighting how quick they were to speak out against Morrissey after reading the NME article and how weak their statement on the issue was, when they finally did released one. Lee claimed that this was due to the fact Morrissey had issued NME with a writ and LMHR did not want involved.

I said that their stance made it look like they were prepared to get into bed with the devil (NME) and by their statements, they appeared complicate with NME. He said their agenda was solely an anti-racism one and at times they had to get into bed with the devil, immediately insinuating that they were doing that by accepting Morrissey's management offer of space to promote their campaign.

I finished by saying I would support their campaign no matter what but I was a little disappointed with them. I went on to say there was a lot of support for their campaign in the Morrissey world and it wasn't wise to side with the NME and to distance themselves from Morrissey fans.

An interesting point to note was how defensive Lee was towards NME, when he could have easily avoided comment altogether, when I said in passing that I had tried many time since that NME was published to speak to somebody at the NME but how they point blank refused to and that on one occasion they referred to me as Jock when I called because I was not willing to give my name until the person I was talking to at NME told me his. FYI - I am Scottish.

***************************************************************************************

Subject: The NME
Date: 04/12/2007 15:19:44 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

There is talk amongst the Morrissey apostles of making a T shirt with the line, 'Love Morrissey Hate Racism.' This will happen. As you are planning to introduce new stock and will have a space in the venues at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts (although I don't know if that includes vending). I was thinking that if it was made by you guys, it could include Rock against racism, Unite against fascism and Love Music Hate Racism (officially).

What do you think?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: "I'm ready to hand out LMHR stuff now"
Date: 04/12/2007 16:34:53 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

People are asking if you need anybody to hand out LMHR stuff at the Morrissey concerts?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: Since over chat today over the phone
Date: 04/12/2007 17:57:42 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi

Since over chat today over the phone (with Lee). I understand better the present stance of LMHR but I want to highlight that Coner McNicholas wrote,"the language Morrissey uses is very unhelpful at a time of great tensions."

Why did he attempt to use the Morrissey article to inflame such tensions?

That is all!

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY
 

Uncleskinny

It's all good
Subscriber
Your post regarding where LMHR seem to stand in the Morrissey v's NME issue has prompted me to disclose the details of my loss of faith in LMHR. Below are emails from me to LMHR and from them to me, plus details of a couple of phone calls:

Subject: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 15:33:07 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

I am very interested in your comments regarding the way NME have printed an interview in this weeks edition:

http://www.gigwise.com/news.asp?contentid=39009

Regards,
Hugh Clark
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 17:24:35 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

hi Hugh,

we'll be issuing a statement on this this evening - check the website in the next couple of hours.

cheers

Lee

Love Music Hate Racism
[email protected]
www.lovemusichateracism.com
1st Floor, 231 Vauxhall Bridge Road, London, SW1V 1EH
Tel: 020 7801 2700 xt5101 or 5102 // mob: 07838 15605252

***************************************************************************************
As two days passed and no statement had been issued as promised, I called to ask them when it would be issued. I also expressed I wanted to make my feelings known to them about the NME article; LMHR stance regarding Morrissey v's NME; my views on the issue of racism; my view as a fan of over twenty years of Morrissey's position; and NME's long running anti-Morrissey agenda. They said they were dealing with it at that moment and took my telephone number, saying they'd call me back.

When they called back, they told me that Morrissey's management had been in contact with them at that they would have space at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts to promote their campaign. They also said they wanted Morrissey to make a clear statement regarding where he stood on the issue of racism. I had a long chat with the woman (forgot her name) who called me back. My feelings after the call were positive and she asked if she could call me again but that she had to go to attend a meeting.

***************************************************************************************

FYI: To date she has never called me back.
************************************************** *************************************

THEN

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 30/11/2007 14:09:09 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

When we spoke on the phone earlier today, I said I'd email you and 'the woman' who called me today my contact details. As promised:

My contact details removed from this post

I look forward to helping with your campaign and redressing the balance of the damage done by NME's agenda to damage Morrissey's reputation. You will discover a huge support from Morrissey's audience willing to do the same.

Regards,
Hugh

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 11:48 AM
Subject: Fwd: The NME

http://www.lovemusichateracism.com/:

'A further statement from LMHR on the Morrissey article in this week's NME will appear here shortly.'

When?

Hugh
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 10:08:00 GMT Standard
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi Hugh

Will be tonight, or failing that, tomorrow morning.

cheers,
Lee

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 12:38:28 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Cheers!

The sooner, the better. I noticed a lot of the comments regarding the Morrissey v's NME story over the net and in the media, have included a lot of BNP supporters who have only this week discovered Morrissey. I wonder why?

Racism is too important an issue to be used by the NME for their own anti-Morrissey agenda. It was more than very naughty of them to try and paint Morrissey as a racist. Their personal desire to damage Morrissey has resulted in some people believing them or believing the misreporting of the issue from elsewhere.

The sooner this is sorted. The less damage they will have done to Morrissey and to the anti-racism campaign.

I fully expect your statement to call on Morrissey to clarify his position and I suspect he will. Hopefully you will also clarify your views on the NME spin and distance yourself from them. If you are seen to be in bed with the devil, it will damage your reputation too.

Finally, do you know of any campaign to have racist videos removed from YouTube?

Regards,
Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

***************************************************************************************

I called them back and spoke with Lee highlighting how quick they were to speak out against Morrissey after reading the NME article and how weak their statement on the issue was, when they finally did released one. Lee claimed that this was due to the fact Morrissey had issued NME with a writ and LMHR did not want involved.

I said that their stance made it look like they were prepared to get into bed with the devil (NME) and by their statements, they appeared complicate with NME. He said their agenda was solely an anti-racism one and at times they had to get into bed with the devil, immediately insinuating that they were doing that by accepting Morrissey's management offer of space to promote their campaign.

I finished by saying I would support their campaign no matter what but I was a little disappointed with them. I went on to say there was a lot of support for their campaign in the Morrissey world and it wasn't wise to side with the NME and to distance themselves from Morrissey fans.

An interesting point to note was how defensive Lee was towards NME, when he could have easily avoided comment altogether, when I said in passing that I had tried many time since that NME was published to speak to somebody at the NME but how they point blank refused to and that on one occasion they referred to me as Jock when I called because I was not willing to give my name until the person I was talking to at NME told me his. FYI - I am Scottish.

***************************************************************************************

Subject: The NME
Date: 04/12/2007 15:19:44 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

There is talk amongst the Morrissey apostles of making a T shirt with the line, 'Love Morrissey Hate Racism.' This will happen. As you are planning to introduce new stock and will have a space in the venues at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts (although I don't know if that includes vending). I was thinking that if it was made by you guys, it could include Rock against racism, Unite against fascism and Love Music Hate Racism (officially).

What do you think?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: "I'm ready to hand out LMHR stuff now"
Date: 04/12/2007 16:34:53 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

People are asking if you need anybody to hand out LMHR stuff at the Morrissey concerts?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: Since over chat today over the phone
Date: 04/12/2007 17:57:42 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi

Since over chat today over the phone (with Lee). I understand better the present stance of LMHR but I want to highlight that Coner McNicholas wrote,"the language Morrissey uses is very unhelpful at a time of great tensions."

Why did he attempt to use the Morrissey article to inflame such tensions?

That is all!

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

Great effort Hugh - wonder if they'll make their position clear?

Peter
 

justme

Love me outside!
Well, before that they issued a statement concerning moz and his collaboration with LMHR, that was OK.

"LMHR is a campaigning organisation opposed to all forms of racism and fascism.
We were therefore concerned at comments about immigration in Morrissey’s interview with NME magazine last week. After all, he is an artist who in March 2004 attended an early LMHR gig by the Libertines, where he signed a statement endorsing our campaign. We therefore felt it right and proper, when asked, to give Morrissey the opportunity to come out against racism. Below are excerpts from Morrissey’s statement.
His own full statement is published in today’s Guardian: www.guardian.co.uk and at www.true-to-you.com. We are very pleased to be working with him in 2008. "

so I can only immagine NME was not very happy about it... F***! I hate the NME - I'm praying evey day for this tabloid to disapear- may that be soon!! :mad:
 

cornelius blaze

Boychild mustn't tremble!
Your post regarding where LMHR seem to stand in the Morrissey v's NME issue has prompted me to disclose the details of my loss of faith in LMHR. Below are emails from me to LMHR and from them to me, plus details of a couple of phone calls:

Subject: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 15:33:07 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

I am very interested in your comments regarding the way NME have printed an interview in this weeks edition:

http://www.gigwise.com/news.asp?contentid=39009

Regards,
Hugh Clark
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 17:24:35 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

hi Hugh,

we'll be issuing a statement on this this evening - check the website in the next couple of hours.

cheers

Lee

Love Music Hate Racism
[email protected]
www.lovemusichateracism.com
1st Floor, 231 Vauxhall Bridge Road, London, SW1V 1EH
Tel: 020 7801 2700 xt5101 or 5102 // mob: 07838 15605252

***************************************************************************************
As two days passed and no statement had been issued as promised, I called to ask them when it would be issued. I also expressed I wanted to make my feelings known to them about the NME article; LMHR stance regarding Morrissey v's NME; my views on the issue of racism; my view as a fan of over twenty years of Morrissey's position; and NME's long running anti-Morrissey agenda. They said they were dealing with it at that moment and took my telephone number, saying they'd call me back.

When they called back, they told me that Morrissey's management had been in contact with them at that they would have space at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts to promote their campaign. They also said they wanted Morrissey to make a clear statement regarding where he stood on the issue of racism. I had a long chat with the woman (forgot her name) who called me back. My feelings after the call were positive and she asked if she could call me again but that she had to go to attend a meeting.

***************************************************************************************

FYI: To date she has never called me back.
************************************************** *************************************

THEN

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 30/11/2007 14:09:09 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

When we spoke on the phone earlier today, I said I'd email you and 'the woman' who called me today my contact details. As promised:

My contact details removed from this post

I look forward to helping with your campaign and redressing the balance of the damage done by NME's agenda to damage Morrissey's reputation. You will discover a huge support from Morrissey's audience willing to do the same.

Regards,
Hugh

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 11:48 AM
Subject: Fwd: The NME

http://www.lovemusichateracism.com/:

'A further statement from LMHR on the Morrissey article in this week's NME will appear here shortly.'

When?

Hugh
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 10:08:00 GMT Standard
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi Hugh

Will be tonight, or failing that, tomorrow morning.

cheers,
Lee

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 12:38:28 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Cheers!

The sooner, the better. I noticed a lot of the comments regarding the Morrissey v's NME story over the net and in the media, have included a lot of BNP supporters who have only this week discovered Morrissey. I wonder why?

Racism is too important an issue to be used by the NME for their own anti-Morrissey agenda. It was more than very naughty of them to try and paint Morrissey as a racist. Their personal desire to damage Morrissey has resulted in some people believing them or believing the misreporting of the issue from elsewhere.

The sooner this is sorted. The less damage they will have done to Morrissey and to the anti-racism campaign.

I fully expect your statement to call on Morrissey to clarify his position and I suspect he will. Hopefully you will also clarify your views on the NME spin and distance yourself from them. If you are seen to be in bed with the devil, it will damage your reputation too.

Finally, do you know of any campaign to have racist videos removed from YouTube?

Regards,
Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

***************************************************************************************

I called them back and spoke with Lee highlighting how quick they were to speak out against Morrissey after reading the NME article and how weak their statement on the issue was, when they finally did released one. Lee claimed that this was due to the fact Morrissey had issued NME with a writ and LMHR did not want involved.

I said that their stance made it look like they were prepared to get into bed with the devil (NME) and by their statements, they appeared complicate with NME. He said their agenda was solely an anti-racism one and at times they had to get into bed with the devil, immediately insinuating that they were doing that by accepting Morrissey's management offer of space to promote their campaign.

I finished by saying I would support their campaign no matter what but I was a little disappointed with them. I went on to say there was a lot of support for their campaign in the Morrissey world and it wasn't wise to side with the NME and to distance themselves from Morrissey fans.

An interesting point to note was how defensive Lee was towards NME, when he could have easily avoided comment altogether, when I said in passing that I had tried many time since that NME was published to speak to somebody at the NME but how they point blank refused to and that on one occasion they referred to me as Jock when I called because I was not willing to give my name until the person I was talking to at NME told me his. FYI - I am Scottish.

***************************************************************************************

Subject: The NME
Date: 04/12/2007 15:19:44 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

There is talk amongst the Morrissey apostles of making a T shirt with the line, 'Love Morrissey Hate Racism.' This will happen. As you are planning to introduce new stock and will have a space in the venues at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts (although I don't know if that includes vending). I was thinking that if it was made by you guys, it could include Rock against racism, Unite against fascism and Love Music Hate Racism (officially).

What do you think?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: "I'm ready to hand out LMHR stuff now"
Date: 04/12/2007 16:34:53 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

People are asking if you need anybody to hand out LMHR stuff at the Morrissey concerts?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: Since over chat today over the phone
Date: 04/12/2007 17:57:42 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi

Since over chat today over the phone (with Lee). I understand better the present stance of LMHR but I want to highlight that Coner McNicholas wrote,"the language Morrissey uses is very unhelpful at a time of great tensions."

Why did he attempt to use the Morrissey article to inflame such tensions?

That is all!

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

Slightly obsessive, can't you let Morrissey's lawyers and management deal with it.
 

vampares

now your name is Noonan
I hate this f'n thread already.

Moz is not racist. He is subtly anti-semetic in an esoteric way. He is not inflammatory. He may sing a little bit like there is no future, and I think he could use a little more sleep, but the mutations are causing this rash of paranoia; this is not the toaster in Ghost Busters that you have made it out to be. It is the bathtub the toast is thrown into.
 
Last edited:
Re: I hate this f'n thread already.

Moz is not racist. He is subtly anti-semetic in an esoteric way. He is not inflammatory. He may sing a little bit like there is no future, and I think he could use a little more sleep, but the mutations are causing this rash of paranoia; this is not the toaster in Ghost Busters that you have made it out to be. It is the bathtub the toast is thrown into.

Post of the Year!
 

HIM

New Member
Your post regarding where LMHR seem to stand in the Morrissey v's NME issue has prompted me to disclose the details of my loss of faith in LMHR. Below are emails from me to LMHR and from them to me, plus details of a couple of phone calls:

Subject: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 15:33:07 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

I am very interested in your comments regarding the way NME have printed an interview in this weeks edition:

http://www.gigwise.com/news.asp?contentid=39009

Regards,
Hugh Clark
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 28/11/2007 17:24:35 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

hi Hugh,

we'll be issuing a statement on this this evening - check the website in the next couple of hours.

cheers

Lee

Love Music Hate Racism
[email protected]
www.lovemusichateracism.com
1st Floor, 231 Vauxhall Bridge Road, London, SW1V 1EH
Tel: 020 7801 2700 xt5101 or 5102 // mob: 07838 15605252

***************************************************************************************
As two days passed and no statement had been issued as promised, I called to ask them when it would be issued. I also expressed I wanted to make my feelings known to them about the NME article; LMHR stance regarding Morrissey v's NME; my views on the issue of racism; my view as a fan of over twenty years of Morrissey's position; and NME's long running anti-Morrissey agenda. They said they were dealing with it at that moment and took my telephone number, saying they'd call me back.

When they called back, they told me that Morrissey's management had been in contact with them at that they would have space at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts to promote their campaign. They also said they wanted Morrissey to make a clear statement regarding where he stood on the issue of racism. I had a long chat with the woman (forgot her name) who called me back. My feelings after the call were positive and she asked if she could call me again but that she had to go to attend a meeting.

***************************************************************************************

FYI: To date she has never called me back.
************************************************** *************************************

THEN

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 30/11/2007 14:09:09 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

When we spoke on the phone earlier today, I said I'd email you and 'the woman' who called me today my contact details. As promised:

My contact details removed from this post

I look forward to helping with your campaign and redressing the balance of the damage done by NME's agenda to damage Morrissey's reputation. You will discover a huge support from Morrissey's audience willing to do the same.

Regards,
Hugh

----- Original Message -----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: Sunday, December 02, 2007 11:48 AM
Subject: Fwd: The NME

http://www.lovemusichateracism.com/:

'A further statement from LMHR on the Morrissey article in this week's NME will appear here shortly.'

When?

Hugh
************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 10:08:00 GMT Standard
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi Hugh

Will be tonight, or failing that, tomorrow morning.

cheers,
Lee

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: RE: The NME
Date: 03/12/2007 12:38:28 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Cheers!

The sooner, the better. I noticed a lot of the comments regarding the Morrissey v's NME story over the net and in the media, have included a lot of BNP supporters who have only this week discovered Morrissey. I wonder why?

Racism is too important an issue to be used by the NME for their own anti-Morrissey agenda. It was more than very naughty of them to try and paint Morrissey as a racist. Their personal desire to damage Morrissey has resulted in some people believing them or believing the misreporting of the issue from elsewhere.

The sooner this is sorted. The less damage they will have done to Morrissey and to the anti-racism campaign.

I fully expect your statement to call on Morrissey to clarify his position and I suspect he will. Hopefully you will also clarify your views on the NME spin and distance yourself from them. If you are seen to be in bed with the devil, it will damage your reputation too.

Finally, do you know of any campaign to have racist videos removed from YouTube?

Regards,
Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

***************************************************************************************

I called them back and spoke with Lee highlighting how quick they were to speak out against Morrissey after reading the NME article and how weak their statement on the issue was, when they finally did released one. Lee claimed that this was due to the fact Morrissey had issued NME with a writ and LMHR did not want involved.

I said that their stance made it look like they were prepared to get into bed with the devil (NME) and by their statements, they appeared complicate with NME. He said their agenda was solely an anti-racism one and at times they had to get into bed with the devil, immediately insinuating that they were doing that by accepting Morrissey's management offer of space to promote their campaign.

I finished by saying I would support their campaign no matter what but I was a little disappointed with them. I went on to say there was a lot of support for their campaign in the Morrissey world and it wasn't wise to side with the NME and to distance themselves from Morrissey fans.

An interesting point to note was how defensive Lee was towards NME, when he could have easily avoided comment altogether, when I said in passing that I had tried many time since that NME was published to speak to somebody at the NME but how they point blank refused to and that on one occasion they referred to me as Jock when I called because I was not willing to give my name until the person I was talking to at NME told me his. FYI - I am Scottish.

***************************************************************************************

Subject: The NME
Date: 04/12/2007 15:19:44 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

There is talk amongst the Morrissey apostles of making a T shirt with the line, 'Love Morrissey Hate Racism.' This will happen. As you are planning to introduce new stock and will have a space in the venues at the forthcoming Morrissey concerts (although I don't know if that includes vending). I was thinking that if it was made by you guys, it could include Rock against racism, Unite against fascism and Love Music Hate Racism (officially).

What do you think?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: "I'm ready to hand out LMHR stuff now"
Date: 04/12/2007 16:34:53 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi,

People are asking if you need anybody to hand out LMHR stuff at the Morrissey concerts?

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

************************************************** *************************************

Subject: Since over chat today over the phone
Date: 04/12/2007 17:57:42 GMT Standard Time
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi

Since over chat today over the phone (with Lee). I understand better the present stance of LMHR but I want to highlight that Coner McNicholas wrote,"the language Morrissey uses is very unhelpful at a time of great tensions."

Why did he attempt to use the Morrissey article to inflame such tensions?

That is all!

Hugh

************************************************** *************************************

NO REPLY

maybe they think you're stalking them.
 
Last edited:

Worm

Taste the diffidence
I have a tendency to do that.

Okay, back to the topic, that being the not-seeming-so-enthusiastic support Love Music Hate Racism is returning to Morrissey after he sucked up to them.

Morrissey's statement says:



But he doesn't explicitly disown the terms Love Music Hate Racism describe as Thatcherite.

Love Music Hate Racism:

Unless this is another of my "bizarre theories," don't you think Morrissey was jabbed by Love Music Hate Racism? They're saying, "Oh, but you did use Thatcherite terms."

Unless the NME invented those words, too. But, why didn't Morrissey disown them like he disowned "those people"?

Not that I really care. Just have nothing better to do tonight.

They're using him, he's using them. It's a marriage of convenience.

I don't think they're jabbing him at all, especially since the issue of "Thatcherite" terms is moot since they most likely wrote that statement before the Morrissey kerfuffle. Interesting to point out but I don't think it's a jab.

Another interesting point you bring up is Morrissey's changing viewpoint. As he himself said in the interview, traveling the world has opened up his mind. I do think you could say his view have changed since "Panic" in 1986. On the other hand, critics' tsk-tsk attitude toward his quotes about "black music" were silly to begin with because Morrisey had always been equally vocal about his disdain for lots of white music as well. I don't know if he used the word "vile" but he used words to that effect to describe most white bands, too, not just reggae outfits. In fact, "Panic", was inspired by hearing Wham! on the radio right after the Chernobyl news broke.
 
Last edited:

Jones

Senior Member
Someone should tell all the Guardian journalists that "influx" is a bad "BNP" type word as they are all merrily using it in their comment pieces for the paper.
 

snapyou

Humdee,dumdee,homocide
Re: I hate this f'n thread already.

Moz is not racist. He is subtly anti-semetic in an esoteric way. He is not inflammatory. He may sing a little bit like there is no future, and I think he could use a little more sleep, but the mutations are causing this rash of paranoia; this is not the toaster in Ghost Busters that you have made it out to be. It is the bathtub the toast is thrown into.

Well said :eek:
 
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