Linder on Morrissey in Guardian (18/01/2020)

A very nice interview with Linder Sterling in today’s The Guardian:

How the artist Linder went from Orgasm Addict to Chatsworth House - Observer Design

Excerpt:

She also became known as Morrissey’s muse and went on to photograph him extensively in the early 90s as he toured the US. “We shared the same taste, liked the same books,” she says. “We shared a house for a brief period in Whalley Range – it was a red-light district then.” With his counterintuitive views on the far-right For Britain party, Morrissey is a touchy subject these days, but Linder is loyal. “We’ve always disagreed,” she says. “It’s a healthy disagreement, the sort that comes with unconditional love.”

Just a shame about the unnecessary framing, The Guardian.

 
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Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
You'd have more chance with the economic argument & even the social cohesion one if you weren't mixing it up with bithrates & negative attributes to groups of people.

Lowkey Patriotism is sneaking back anyway & the extreme version of diversity is getting quietly shelved, because it's failed resoundly at the ballot box & it's giving too much power to wedge issues & Twitter mobs.
Birthrates of one group over another have everything to do with future social cohesion.

When Muhummad Ali said on TV that blacks and whites shouldn't breed nobody berated him at all. Back then people either agreed or thought 'that's his opinion, fair play.' He didn't mean he hated whites, he just said blacks and whites were 'different people'. He was talking about general behaviour and culture. There was no hatred in his comments and it lost him no fans at all.

Though I don't as a rule agree with him on this, I understand his standpoint here. Why? Because I have the personal experience of having grown up and always lived in areas of full spectrum urban diversity and have observed the negatives at first hand.

I understand about the clashing of cultures more than most.

There should be no ban or stigma on openly mentioning or debating any issue. If a topic makes somebody feel 'uncomfortable' then perhaps that actually shows how important a subject is. For years we've been sweeping open debate of so many things under the carpet, and the results are really showing.
 
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Verso

Well-Known Member
Ah, yes. Just a normal person who considers Morrissey their best friend and cares deeply about the birthrates of non-white people.
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
Ah, yes. Just a normal person who considers Morrissey their best friend and cares deeply about the birthrates of non-white people.
I am of the white European race. Why would I not be concerned when my race is officially dying in number and all others are due to explode in number? This is not right-wing nonsense. It is official predicted stats.

Ask any black person how they'd feel if their race was dying.

Not one black person on this earth would shrug and say: so what. Not one. Whites have been conditioned into a permanent state of low-self esteem and to believe that any talk of race is 'scary and evil'. No other race thinks like this.

In that regard whites are actually the stupidest race.
 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Birthrates of one group over another have everything to do with future social cohesion.

When Muhummad Ali said on TV that blacks and whites shouldn't breed nobody berated him at all. Back then people either agreed or thought 'that's his opinion, fair play.' He didn't mean he hated whites, he just said blacks and whites were 'different people'. He was talking about general behaviour and culture. There was no hatred in his comments and it lost him no fans at all.

Though I don't as a rule agree with him on this, I understand his standpoint here. Why? Because I have the personal experience of having grown up and always lived in areas of full spectrum urban diversity and have observed the negatives at first hand.

I understand about the clashing of cultures more than most.

There should be no ban or stigma on openly mentioning or debating any issue. If a topic makes somebody feel 'uncomfortable' then perhaps that actually shows how important a subject is. For years we've been sweeping open debate of so many things under the carpet, and the results are really showing.

They really don't, because pretty much everything that forms our group/s is invented or edited. Flags, history, heroes, enemies, names, customs - none of it is set in stone.

Our big mistake was leaving the English (or British) with a nonexistent or negative group identity, because we were too busy attacking the old value system to notice we were creating a vacuum. And nature... etc...

Various things make groups clash, none of it is to do with skin colour or innate behaviour (beyond skin colour being a visible difference & therefore easy to target).
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
They really don't, because pretty much everything that forms our group/s is invented or edited. Flags, history, heroes, enemies, names, customs - none of it is set in stone.

Our big mistake was leaving the English (or British) with a nonexistent or negative group identity, because we were too busy attacking the old value system to notice we were creating a vacuum. And nature... etc...

Various things make groups clash, none of it is to do with skin colour or innate behaviour (beyond skin colour being a visible difference & therefore easy to target).
So what if groups and flags were at some distant point in the past invented?

The Irish as a solid united group achieved independence from centuries of English oppression. Years of stuggle left them with a population half its size due to murder (the Famine) or having to leave. Should they not be allowed to live and thrive in their own land now without mass immigration altering their culture and country?

I understand that Christianity treats all men equal (and so does genuine Marxism) but that doesn't mean that different cultures thrown together will necessarily thrive.

The thing is this. Global Capitalists love immigration because of its financial benefits for the very rich. That's why we're told day after day by the media how diversity is our strength. Propagandists know that when you repeat a message through the media long enough, the words stick because most people don't actually think for themselves. Orwell and Noam Chomsky for years warned us all about this.
 
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Nerak

Reverse Ferret
I am of the white European race. Why would I not be concerned when my race is officially dying in number and all others are due to explode in number? This is not right-wing nonsense. It is official predicted stats.

Ask any black person how they'd feel if their race was dying.

Not one black person on this earth would shrug and say: so what. Not one. Whites have been conditioned into a permanent state of low-self esteem and to believe that any talk of race is 'scary and evil'. No other race thinks like this.

In that regard whites are actually the stupidest race.

We're not divided into great races battling for world domination.

The idea that every person with the same skin colour is on the same page is ridiculous. People fight everywhere, over everything.
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
We're not divided into great races battling for world domination.

The idea that every person with the same skin colour is on the same page is ridiculous. People fight everywhere, over everything.
Why create more fighting and more problems which may one day explode into race wars?

That's my point.

And the answer is one thing. Money for the uber-rich.
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
Here's a question.

Was the benefits of Pakistani immigration to Britain worth the gang raping and torture of literally thousands upon thousands of white English girls?
 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
So what if groups and flags were at some distant point in the past invented?

The Irish as a solid united group achieved independence from centuries of English oppression. Years of stuggle left them with a population half its size due to murder (the Famine) or having to leave. Should they not be allowed to live and thrive in their own country now without mass immigration altering their culture and country.

I understand that Christianity treats all men equal (and so does genuine Marxism) but that doesn't mean that different cultures thrown together will necessarily thrive.

The thing is this. Global Capitalists love immigration because of its financial benefits for the very rich. that's why we're told day after day by the media how diversity is our strength. Propagandists know that when you repeat a message through the media long enough, the words stick because most people don't actually think for themselves. Orwell and Noam Chomsky for years warned us all about this.

It was The Enlightenment that formed the concept of different cultures co-existing in a secular state & it did so because The Reformation ripped Europe apart.

If England/Britain hadn't been so punitive towards Catholics, the British Isles could be one political unit right now.

And the reason it oppressed Catholics long after Spain stopped being a genuine threat is because of fear-mongering about fake Catholic plots & prejudices about Catholics, esp. the Irish being violent, stupid, inferior, ugly, devious, spiteful, charming but like kids etc etc.

I understand that some aspects of diversity might be triggering fears of being colonised & I get that listening to rebel songs as you grow up does create a fiercely tribal outlook that might be hard to give up (& it was enabled by the left as revolutionary violence often is) - but I would expect an Irish Catholic to remember, just a little bit, that we used to be The Evil Other That Had To Be Kept Out.
 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Here's a question.

Was the benefits of Pakistani immigration to Britain worth the gang raping and torture of literally thousands upon thousands of white English girls?

Was it worth having Radio One if it gave us Jimmy Savile?

Is it worth having men in the country when they commit the vast majority of violent & sexual crimes? (I did actually find an old 1970s feminist pamphlet that argued that - like we'd hand over our Dads & our brothers & our boyfriends).
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
It was The Enlightenment that formed the concept of different cultures co-existing in a secular state & it did so because The Reformation ripped Europe apart.

If England/Britain hadn't been so punitive towards Catholics, the British Isles could be one political unit right now.

And the reason it oppressed Catholics long after Spain stopped being a genuine threat is because of fear-mongering about fake Catholic plots & prejudices about Catholics, esp. the Irish being violent, stupid, inferior, ugly, devious, spiteful, charming but like kids etc etc.

I understand that some aspects of diversity might be triggering fears of being colonised & I get that listening to rebel songs as you grow up does create a fiercely tribal outlook that might be hard to give up (& it was enabled by the left as revolutionary violence often is) - but I would expect an Irish Catholic to remember, just a little bit, that we used to be The Evil Other That Had To Be Kept Out.
I'm well aware of that. But not one of the Easter Rising fighters, for example, would say Ireland is now free. They fought for Irish people - of the present and future. Not for EU membership or engineered mass immigration as population replacement for the monetary gain of billionaires. If any of them rose from the grave now Leo V would one dark night feel the cold steel of a pistol pressed to the back of his neck.
 
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Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
Was it worth having Radio One if it gave us Jimmy Savile?

Is it worth having men in the country when they commit the vast majority of violent & sexual crimes? (I did actually find an old 1970s feminist pamphlet that argued that - like we'd hand over our Dads & our brothers & our boyfriends).
Jimmy Savile was one man, whereas the numbers of the Northern Muslim rape gangs are mind boggling! It's been going on with impunity for decades and it's neverending. Before Pakistanis in the UK this simply wasn't happening. These are outrageous acts of racist hate. If the girls were not working-class the government would have literally sent the army in.

Denial and a weak argument Nerak.

'Diversity is our strength' was invented by a highly paid PR company. And taxpayers footed the bill.

But now it's time to tear up the propaganda campaign. People are waking up and realising they've been lied to for a very long time.
 
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Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Jimmy Savile was one man, whereas the numbers of the Northern Muslim rape gangs are mind boggling! Before Pakistanis in the UK this simply wasn't happening. These are outrageous acts of racist hate. If the girls were not working class the government would have cracked down on this.

Denial and a weak argument Nerak.

It's not denial or weak! And it wasn't one Savile, it was a whole culture of abuse in the Entertainment industry.

Re. The grooming gangs. The police ignored an organized crime ring, so it made money & grew unchecked. (I'm guessing someone took bungs because they bury the money aspect as much as they can).

Gangs are mostly from the same background because that's the safest way to recruit. You can't advertise.

Glasgow & Dublin have terrifying gangs & (not that it matters) they're white. I assume England does too.
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
It's not denial or weak! And it wasn't one Savile, it was a whole culture of abuse in the Entertainment industry.

Re. The grooming gangs. The police ignored an organized crime ring, so it made money & grew unchecked. (I'm guessing someone took bungs because they bury the money aspect as much as they can).

Gangs are mostly from the same background because that's the safest way to recruit. You can't advertise.

Glasgow & Dublin have terrifying gangs & (not that it matters) they're white. I assume England does too.
Whether intentionally or not, you're dismissing the unprecedented nature of the Northern Muslim rape gangs. No, it hasn't happened before at this scale - ever.

Glasgow and Dublin have terrifying white gangs who would literally rip the testicles out of any paedo they came across.

I wish London had more gangs like them.

Down here we just have blacks with machetes hacking each other up because one stepped on the other's Nikes.
 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Whether intentionally or not, you're dismissing the unprecedented nature of the Northern Muslim rape gangs. No, it hasn't happened before at this scale - ever.

Glasgow and Dublin have terrifying white gangs who would literally rip the testicles out of any paedo they came across.

I wish London had more gangs like them.

It has. Prostitution is a grim business. The only unusual thing is that it caught the public's imagination. And that's because it encapsulates a lot of concerns about race, class, child abuse & authority. If they'd prosecuted it properly at the time, it wouldn't have turned into this huge story.
 

Nerak

Reverse Ferret
Jimmy Savile was one man, whereas the numbers of the Northern Muslim rape gangs are mind boggling! It's been going on with impunity for decades and it's neverending. Before Pakistanis in the UK this simply wasn't happening. These are outrageous acts of racist hate. If the girls were not working-class the government would have literally sent the army in.

Denial and a weak argument Nerak.

'Diversity is our strength' was invented by a highly paid PR company. And taxpayers footed the bill.

But now it's time to tear up the propaganda campaign. People are waking up and realising they've been lied to for a very long time.

I agree Diversity is Strength needs junked.

It's old & it irritates people.

But its underlying intent isn't wrong.
 

Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
I agree Diversity is Strength needs junked.

It's old & it's irritating people.

But it's underlying intent isn't wrong.
It's a happy clappy hippy bullshit term that through media dissemination and peer pressure many people actually bought in to.

'Diversity of Opinion is our Strength' is a better one because it means we can openly debate and attempt to solve problems.
 
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Pippistrella

Well-Known Member
It has. Prostitution is a grim business. The only unusual thing is that it caught the public's imagination. And that's because it encapsulates a lot of concerns about race, class, child abuse & authority. If they'd prosecuted it properly at the time, it wouldn't have turned into this huge story.
They weren't all prostitutes as you well know. But many were when the gangs had finished with them.

Don't really understand why you're attempting to lessen the seriousness of the issue. Yeah, big deal, it's always happened...

The benefits of Pakistani immigration (whatever they are) simply aren't worth the misery of a single one of these tortured girls.

Even black gangs have the courtesy to keep most of their violence to themselves.
 
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Nerak

Reverse Ferret
They weren't all prostitutes as you well know. But many were when the gangs had finished with them.

Don't really understand why you're attempting to lessen the seriousness of the issue. Yeah, big deal, it's always happened...

The benefits of Pakistani immigration (whatever they are) simply aren't worth the misery of a single one of these tortured girls.

Even black gangs have the courtesy to keep most of their violence to themselves.

I'm not lessening. It's serious crime. I'm putting it in context.
 

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