Johnny Marr / Instagram: "Back in the same spot 38 years later. Camden Electric Ballroom. 21st May 1983."

Not a usual post from Marr:

FWD.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

There can be little doubt, though, that this is at least partly due to the political interests of many faux-socialist media types. DogChain is excellent to my objective ears; Moz's best in decades. There is a childish inclination to overstate a liking for Marr in order to underline the self-congratulatory virtue signalling stance against Morrissey.

I think this is absolutely correct. Similarly, there is an equally childish and also misguided inclination to be overly dismissive towards and critical of Marr in order to somehow underline your Morrissey fandom. As if liking and respecting both is impossible.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

…or, unlike Melvis, he can continue to do a number of things and produce amazing music with people from all over the spectrum. There’s a reason that your beloved Lurch can’t sell his own records, put together a proper band or pack a venue.

Melvis wants to whine. Marr wants to play.

mic drop. Fak Arf.

The mic was dropped on your head. I hope you recover soon. 💐

 

[Surface]

I think this is absolutely correct. Similarly, there is an equally childish and also misguided inclination to be overly dismissive towards and critical of Marr in order to somehow underline your Morrissey fandom. As if liking and respecting both is impossible.

Spot on Gregor, for me it works like this:

I look forward to a Morrissey album more than a Marr album
I look forward to a Marr gig more than a Morrissey gig

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Spot on Gregor, for me it works like this:

I look forward to a Morrissey album more than a Marr album
I look forward to a Marr gig more than a Morrissey gig

Makes perfect sense to me.

 

[Thewlis]

I don't know what the situation is like elsewhere but in the UK, Marr is outperforming Morrissey in almost every aspect. His albums receive much more critical acclaim - Call the Comet scored 78/100 on average (Metacritic), Morrissey's last two have scored 59 and 62.
Since Morrissey's mass fan desertion (after he started publicly supporting far-right politics in 2018/2019) Marr's albums now sell more than Morrissey's and, most incredibly of all, radio stations will now happily play new songs with Johnny Marr singing but not with Morrissey singing.
And as Amy pointed out, he's benefiting hugely these days by being seen as the 'good guy from the Smiths'. Marr was in a pretty desperate state 10 years or so ago, hanging out with second division indie bands like the Cribs, but his stock has arguably never been higher than it currently is.
Still, I'm not a huge fan. Find his albums a struggle and, although I enjoy the live shows, he only seems to properly come alive when he sings Morrissey's lyrics. Be nice for him to at least occasionally acknowledge the contribution that Morrisey has made to his success.

Nah, the world is bigger than the UK.

Just look at the spotify-numbers for Morrissey last albums and Johnny’s and you will see a big difference in popularity.
Also, do you honestly think Johnny could do a Vegas-residency or headline Riot Fest or Cruel World? The difference in popularity between the two is still huge.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Nah, the world is bigger than the UK.

Just look at the spotify-numbers for Morrissey last albums and Johnny’s and you will see a big difference in popularity.
Also, do you honestly think Johnny could do a Vegas-residency or headline Riot Fest or Cruel World? The difference in popularity between the two is still huge.

Again, you cannot draw comparisons like that. Also, it’s unfair to Marr and certainly doesn’t make Morrissey look like a bigger star. You’re not doing anyone any favors.

 

[Surface]

Again, you cannot draw comparisons like that. Also, it’s unfair to Marr and certainly doesn’t make Morrissey look like a bigger star. You’re not doing anyone any favors.

Thewlis often quotes Spotify all the time but fails to appreciate that bands like James who's main following is UK based, have far more monthly listens than Morrissey. She also seems to forget that Morrissey has built a following over 33 years while Marr's has been over the last 7 years.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

Thewlis often quotes Spotify all the time but fails to appreciate that bands like James who's main following is UK based, have far more monthly listens than Morrissey. She also seems to forget that Morrissey has built a following over 33 years while Marr's has been over the last 7 years.

I keep repeating that, but it doesn’t seem to register.

 

[Thewlis]

I know all that, just responding to a post claiming ‘Johnny Marr is now more popular than Morrissey’ which by any means is ridiculous.

 

[Surface]

I know all that, just responding to a post claiming ‘Johnny Marr is now more popular than Morrissey’ which by any means is ridiculous.

I think he maybe in the UK at this moment in time but there's nothing to stop Morrissey reconnecting with his UK fan base apart from Morrissey

 

[Thewlis]

Yes, I was correcting Mike Rourke’s post on that. UK is also debatable, by the way.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

I don't know what the situation is like elsewhere but in the UK, Marr is outperforming Morrissey in almost every aspect. His albums receive much more critical acclaim - Call the Comet scored 78/100 on average (Metacritic), Morrissey's last two have scored 59 and 62.
Since Morrissey's mass fan desertion (after he started publicly supporting far-right politics in 2018/2019) Marr's albums now sell more than Morrissey's and, most incredibly of all, radio stations will now happily play new songs with Johnny Marr singing but not with Morrissey singing.
And as Amy pointed out, he's benefiting hugely these days by being seen as the 'good guy from the Smiths'. Marr was in a pretty desperate state 10 years or so ago, hanging out with second division indie bands like the Cribs, but his stock has arguably never been higher than it currently is.
Still, I'm not a huge fan. Find his albums a struggle and, although I enjoy the live shows, he only seems to properly come alive when he sings Morrissey's lyrics. Be nice for him to at least occasionally acknowledge the contribution that Morrisey has made to his success.

M was clear that he didn't believe she was far right!
& I don't think anyone would have doubted it if the NME hadn't lied about Madstock & then continued to reinforce the lie.
Further - I don't think he would have believed her if he hadn't had direct experience of being lied about.

Though I appreciate you putting in dates.

 

[Surface]

M was clear that he didn't believe she was far right!
& I don't think anyone would have doubted it if the NME hadn't lied about Madstock & then continued to reinforce the lie.
Further - I don't think he would have believed her if he hadn't had direct experience of being lied about.

Though I appreciate you putting in dates.

Doesn't matter how you interpret things Nerak, the damage was done between 2017 and 2019, Madstock had no impact on his career at all, in my opinion. The Maida Vale gig was the start of his problems and then he continued with his ill informed comment for another 12 months, thankfully he's now stopped.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

Doesn't matter how you interpret things Nerak, the damage was done between 2017 and 2019, Madstock had no impact on his career at all, in my opinion. The Maida Vale gig was the start of his problems and then he continued with his ill informed comment for another 12 months, thankfully he's now stopped.

I've verified it - got feedback from journalists - & I know how the media works.

The major damage was in 92. Every article & tweet harked back to it - suspicions confirmed.

 

[Gregor Samsa]

I've verified it - got feedback from journalists - & I know how the media works.

The major damage was in 92. Every article & tweet harked back to it - suspicions confirmed.

His career continued to thrive after Madstock, though. Now, since the 2017-2021 far-right/"plandemic" debacles, however, not so much.

 

[Surface]

I've verified it - got feedback from journalists - & I know how the media works.

The major damage was in 92. Every article & tweet harked back to it - suspicions confirmed.

How did it damage him? Have you seen where he toured after Madstock and the size of the venues he played also the albums pre Madstock charted at number 8 and number 4, the first album post Madstock was number 1 and certified gold, so not sure why you think Madstock (or any journalist) think it damaged his career.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

His career continued to thrive after Madstock, though. Now, since the 2017-2021 far-right/"plandemic" debacles, however, not so much.

Again - that's because the suspicion that he was a far right racist that the NME falsely created in 92 - & which had been persistently mentioned in his coverage ever since - appeared to have been confirmed.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

How did it damage him? Have you seen where he toured after Madstock and the size of the venues he played also the albums pre Madstock charted at number 8 and number 4, the first album post Madstock was number 1 and certified gold, so not sure why you think Madstock (or any journalist) think it damaged his career.

It damaged his reputation - which created the conditions to damage his career in 2017.

It's like a crack in a wall that slowly gets bigger.

 

[Surface]

It damaged his reputation - which created the conditions to damage his career in 2017.

It's like a crack in a wall that slowly gets bigger.

Disagree, it did not damage his reputation at all, different times and a different generation of people, no cancel culture shit going on in 92, lots of it from 17 onwards.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

Disagree, it did not damage his career at all, different times and a different generation of people, no cancel shit going on in 92, lots of it in 17 onwards.

Read his press cuttings. Read the online diatribes. They continually bring up the quotes that the NME claimed were racist in their hit piece, they falsely claim that he supported the National Front by flying the Union Jack in 92, they say this has been a pattern for 40 years.

The NME journalists are still working.

They've written Guardian articles in the past 5 years.

They've written for online publications like the Quietus.

They tweet relentlessly.

The NME's immigration hit piece happened because the editor thought the Madstock allegations were real - & I know that for a fact.

Journalists would not have amplified his likely to be fleeting interest in an unelectable vegan if they realised the NME had been using skinheads to take a pot shot at his sexuality.