James Maker Statement: Is Morrissey a racist?

Discussion in 'General Discussion archive 2018 (read-only)' started by Famous when dead, Apr 26, 2018.

By Famous when dead on Apr 26, 2018 at 4:15 PM
  1. Famous when dead

    Famous when dead Vulgarian Moderator

    Dec 7, 2000
    Birmingham, U.K.


    Is Morrissey a racist?

    The answer is an emphatic 'no'. In the forty years that I have known Morrissey, I have never once heard a racist epithet pass his lips. The terms 'racist', 'fascist', and 'Islamophobe' are so freely used nowadays against those whose opinions and worldview differs from our own, that they have lost their power and meaning.
    Also, there is a worrying trend on the Left that, ironically, echoes fascism in its intolerance of reasoned debate. One is not only 'wrong' in expressing a different opinion, but one is also now 'evil'. I believe that calling Morrissey a racist is unjustifiable and wrong.
    However, if you want to run out of the house wearing a garment ill-suited to the elements in order to throw Viva Hate into the Manchester Ship Canal, then that is, of course, your right.

    In supporting Brexit, this does not make Morrissey an immigrant-hating 'Little Englander' who lives only to reverse the metric system and bring back steam trains. The truth is, there are myriad reasons why people voted to leave the EU. One of them is a mistrust of Brussels technocracy where unelected representatives make decisions that are arguably a matter for sovereignty.
    Patriotism and Nationalism are very distinct: the former is characterised by an affection for one's country; the second is a more extreme and unforgiving form of allegiance to one's homeland. Morrissey might be guilty of patriotism, but not of nationalism.

    Opposing Sharia Law in the UK, or FGM, or institutionalised misogyny—which is (trigger warning) widespread in the developing world—is an appropriate Western response borne of democracy and the development of civil liberties. It is neither racist nor Islamophobic.
    After all, if I were to move to the United Arab Emirates in search of a better life, I wouldn't reasonably expect to be able to build a hot dog stand empire, serving pork products whilst dressed in a gender-neutral miniskirt.

    To oppose halal slaughter is to oppose slaughter with additional cruelty. The zakat tax payable for Halal certification is used by Islamic organisations to fund mosques and religious schools. Such is the many-tentacled nature of zakat, it is difficult to determine whether it is also being used to crowdfund Islamist extremism. There is a growing concern in some quarters that it might be.

    Hitler was indeed 'Left-wing' in the sense of incorporating the word 'socialist' into the party's name to cynically draw voters away from communism and towards populist nationalism dressed as socialism. Hence, 'Hitler was Left-wing.' Morrissey was not suggesting that Hitler and Yvette Cooper (for example) share the same political ideals. The fact is, Left-wing totalitarianism looks little different to Right-wing authoritarianism — if you're being oppressed, it's the same experience.

    Again, is Morrissey a racist?
    My answer is an emphatic 'no'.

    James Maker.

    • Like Like x 21
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
    1. Derek17
      Trusting Marx to tell me what socialism "really" is, is like trusting a KKK member to tell me what I should think about white supremacy.
    2. Charlie Cheswick
      Charlie Cheswick
      Which writers do you prefer to get your information for what Socialism is?

      Plato? Machiavelli?
    3. vegan.cro  spirit #345
      vegan.cro spirit #345
      Skinny chill with the nonsense.:rolleyes:
      Socialists have been killing each other since the day they first existed. Robespierre whacked a good number of them,
      Stalin killed millions of them, Lenin had many shot during his brief reign. All of them all socialists and commies.
      Nobody has killed more Socialists and Commies than Socialists and Commies.:guitar:

      Very weak minded, these left wing loon posts.:straightface:
      • Informative Informative x 1
      • Redundant Redundant x 1
    4. vegan.cro  spirit #345
      vegan.cro spirit #345
      Plato? Machiavelli?:crazy:
      • Redundant Redundant x 1
    5. Derek17
      What is it with socialists and taking things from other people? One may have one's own ideas and interpretations.
    6. Derek17
      It's hard to argue with that.
    7. Charlie Cheswick
      Charlie Cheswick
      Once again Derek, read and understand, I prefer mixed systems because Capitalism without a Socialist element is shit and Socialism without a Capitalist element is shit.

      Now back to Socialism, tell me again which philosipher you have read to form your opinions on. As apparently Marx is one to be dismissed. I get the feeling it's Fox News or Ronald Reagan.
    8. Derek17
      You keep telling me to read and understand, as if reading and understanding the Qur'an would turn me in to a Muslim. That's not how it works!

      Crony capitalism and socialism produce the same net effects: more concentration of wealth in the rich and more government control and regulations over said wealth. Pass!

      If you want to improve capitalism for the average person, you need to reduce taxes and encourage companies to invest in their employees. I don't see why the government should be trusted more with money than a company that stands to lose. Use that leverage to incentivize companies to invest in their employees. Companies do need to be more employer-friendly, I will say that, but they can't take steps to be so if they are shackled by higher taxes and unnecessary regulations. You simply have the wrong solution to a basic problem that, I think, we tend to agree on.

      If you want to understand why socialism and neo-Marxism are terrible, particularly on a big-picture human and psychological level, check out Jordan Peterson.
    9. Charlie Cheswick
      Charlie Cheswick
      If you read a bit of Marx you might find yourself agreeing with a lot of what's in there. You might hate it all but at least you'll be informed. Just relying on biased 2nd hand material means you'll be misinformed. I'm not trying to convert you, just get you to know what you're talking about.

      As for regulations, a lot of great things have come from having strong Unions. All of those things you take for granted as an employee, pay, holidays, the unlikelihood that you'd be killed or maimed at your workplace, yep, Unions. Of course there are loads of things that are ridiculous now but I'd argue that is more down to the culture of everyone suing everyone else than some kind of communist consipracy and that has nothing to do with Socialism or Capitalism.

      As for taxes, the modern problem is that a lot of tax just doesn't get paid because some people appear to be exempt thanks to corruption and so it has to come from the rest of us. It'd be more productive, instead of ranting about imaginary Socialists when let's face it, our governments both sides of the pond are a long way off that, you stayed on track with the real issue which is money disappearing out of the system with a helping hand from our governments meaning everyone else gets the squeeze.

      And to reiterate Derek, my preference is a mixed system so ranting about Socialism is lost on me. I didn't grow up under Reagan and the Red Menace, I just look at what works and what doesn't.
      • Like Like x 1
    10. vegan.cro  spirit #567
      vegan.cro spirit #567
      Read Marx? You get Marx every time you tune to CNN or the BBC.
      Problem with taxes is that the too may live off assistance and handouts and pay 0 taxes.:rolleyes:
      • Redundant Redundant x 1
    11. Charlie Cheswick
      Charlie Cheswick
      5 minutes Thickwit.
    12. Derek17
      I should note that we in Canada are being governed by a socialist administration that merely has appropriated the Liberal label and which is headed by a neo-Marxist-feminist half-wit. I'm not sure that he understands what he's doing most of the time but the country is going down the tubes because of his handlers nonetheless.

      For the good of "people-kind," we must end socialism NOW.

      Also, I just think there are much better ways to accomplish the same things as unions are designed to. I see PROFITS as better leverage than union influence. Keep it pure and simple. Give additional tax breaks to companies that will pledge to provide certain perks for their employees. There's your incentive. If they were to fail to comply with the guidelines, simple: they would incur a tax penalty. Companies can be held accountable relatively organically, and the government, as much as it would prefer to be, stays out of everyone's pockets as much as possible.
    13. Charlie Cheswick
      Charlie Cheswick
      Would you like to work without holidays Derek?
      Would you like to work without any work and safety regulations?
      Would you like to work for whatever your employers see fit or would you like a proper wage?
      Or maybe Derek, you're the employer that sees those things as getting in the way of profits? Pesky workers.

      The tax penalty Derek is you pay your taxes. It's the same for all of us. Or be a selfish bastard.

      The taxation in Canada is relatively fuck all, far less than most countries.

      Honestly Derek, you appear to be living in insane 'alt-right' cuckoo land. I added the alt right because of the barminess of your position. Completely nutty.

      There are places for you to live though, have a watch of Louis Theroux's documentary on like minded tax avoiders. Go live there in your paranoid nutter right wing libertarian paradise.

      That or understand that we have taxes for a reason, such as an education for EVERYONE, roads for EVERYONE, hospitals for EVERYONE, roads for EVERYONE, a fire service for EVERYONE. Or you can fight against taxation and think fuck those who aren't you.

      Maybe you can explain why certain groups of people don't deserve any of the above or why only more wealthy people deserve the above.

      ps, I noted you said Marxist again despite not having a clue what Marx ever wrote.
      Last edited: May 11, 2018
    14. vegan.cro  spirit #567
      vegan.cro spirit #567
      We have Marxism coming out of our collective eyeballs-in the movies, the news, the snowflakes, and they want us to read Marx. Just like Bernie Sanders with a straight face, talking about finance and economics despite working all his life to not have a job.
      "Read Marx":crazy:
      Like a shot in the head, we need to read Marx.:eek:
    15. Derek17
      Bud, I'm not saying we should revoke everything that already exists. All I'm saying is, in the future, there are better, more efficient ways of achieving the things you are talking about. You're becoming rather hysterical, however, and I'm not sure why.

      There is nothing selfish about wanting the government to take less of EVERYONE'S money and wanting companies to be employee-friendly in an ORGANIC manner.

      More "alt-right" slander.

      See, every time I offer a fair and thought-provoking response, you come at me with hysterical, childish, and defamatory nonsense. I'm sorry, but you're losing the battle of ideas. Insulting me and attempting to disparage my motives will not change the fact that socialism is a terrible, twisted, tried-and-failed-umpteen-hundred-times system that has no place in society moving forward.

      Why would I want my money going to "education" when that "education" involves neo-Marxist institutions of indoctrination? People like Jordan Peterson are denied funding for ideological reasons. Why would I want to provide funding for people who get paid hundreds of thousands of dollars to make up pseudo-intellectual garbage about queer theory and feminist dance therapy? Why don't you just send in a donation to For Britain while we're at it? Oh wait! You refuse? That would be your own free CHOICE. Funny how my free choice doesn't matter when the government forces me to fund ideological entities that I oppose.

      Otherwise, you're taking this to ridiculous extremes. I'm not an anarchist. I am fine with the government using my money to maintain the roads, etc. As I have mentioned before, there does, however, need to be more transparency. The government in this province has literally understated the deficit by billions of dollars. Next you're going to tell me that there is some self-less feel-good value in flushing a few hundred dollars down the toilet.

      Corrupt governments thrive on socialism.
      • Like Like x 1
    16. Derek17
      I really didn't think the conversation would become this ridiculous. I have been, I would say, more than reasonable.
      • Like Like x 1
    17. bhops
      Care to elaborate on what a 'mixed system' might look like? Clearly you've got a framework in mind and I'm curious (and open to the idea) of hearing more.
      • Like Like x 1
    18. bhops
      The problem with Socialism is that nobody seems exactly sure how to implement it or what it means. Much like Christianity or Islam there seems to be different 'branches' of socialism. In fact in Charlie's own words he sees socialism 'as a theory' and something that has 'never been implemented properly.' Now Marx has been writing about Socialism since 1848 and many socialists have claimed that socialism would work if only it could be done properly. Now why in 170 years it has never been implemented properly should tell you a lot about what type of system it is, it's right up there with unicorns and rainbows with a pot of gold at the end of them (which of course will be distributed evenly between groups as approved by committee shere everyone is contented with the group decision and lives happily every after.)
      • Like Like x 1
    19. Derek17
      Yes, Charlie, I am curious to hear what your specific ideas are. I have thrown some out, which I think are actually interesting and innovative.
      • Like Like x 1
    20. Anonymous
      Funny thing...I’ve heard it through James’s mouth that Morrissey IS racist
      • Troll Troll x 1

Share This Page