Is Morrissey still the role model he once was to you?

Fulham Road Lights

Ill-adjusted
I've come to a realisation recently, that the current incarnation of Morrissey does nothing for me. I got into him, primarily, because I felt that he was a voice for the lonely and so on (as I'm sure a lot of his fans feel) and he sang about it as if it was an awful thing. But his latest stuff seems to celebrate this rather than console those who suffer from it. He's almost become a caricature of himself, a self-parody if you will. I'm going to quote the good stuff first, and compare it with the songs that give the wrong message.

My favourite Morrissey songs about loneliness:

'That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore'. Top line - 'When you laugh about people who feel so very lonely, their only desire is to die, well I'm afraid it doesn't make me smile... Kick them when they fall down'.

'I Know It's Over'. Top line - 'I know it's over, though it never really began, but in my heart it was so real'.

'Never Had No One Ever'. Top line - 'I had a really bad dream, it lasted 20 years, 7 months, 27 days, and I never had no one ever'.

'I'd Love To'. Top line - 'Again, I lay awake, and I cried because of waste, I'd love to, but only with you'.

Morrissey songs about this subject which have taken a wrong turn:

'I'm OK By Myself'. Worst line - 'Could this be an arm around my waist? Well surely the hand contains a knife... This might make you throw up in your bed, but I'm OK by myself'.

'How Can Anybody Possibly Know How I Feel?'. Worst line - 'She told me she loved me which means she must be insane'.

Does anybody else feel like this? How am I meant to feel the same respect for the man when he's singing about my life in the wrong way?
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
I see that sometimes too. I think you just get to a point where you give up. Remember he was looking for someone...after 20-odd years of looking you become resigned and give up I suppose.
 

mauve21

Long time participant
Some people say that if you want love to come you have
to stop looking for it and if it's meant to happen it will!:straightface:
But that seems to indicate luck is involved and if you have poor luck
then you won't get love.
Plus if you try to force the issue you'll just meet people you don't like,or people you don't like will love you...
grrrr, I don't know. It's all a big pain in the behind.
I agree with you in a way, C.G. I have actually stopped looking and decided
I just live my life and if I meet someone that'll be a bonus.
But, I'm trying to not actually care about not "having someone" now,
as it's too painful if you worry about it......
 
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the_kaz

Active Member
I see that sometimes too. I think you just get to a point where you give up. Remember he was looking for someone...after 20-odd years of looking you become resigned and give up I suppose.

This is what I think too. I definitely don't see it as self-parody. I see it as the natural, logical, progression from Morrissey in his 20's and 30's.
 

billy scissors

a bit fond
I've come to a realisation recently, that the current incarnation of Morrissey does nothing for me. I got into him, primarily, because I felt that he was a voice for the lonely and so on (as I'm sure a lot of his fans feel) and he sang about it as if it was an awful thing. But his latest stuff seems to celebrate this rather than console those who suffer from it. He's almost become a caricature of himself, a self-parody if you will. I'm going to quote the good stuff first, and compare it with the songs that give the wrong message.

My favourite Morrissey songs about loneliness:

'That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore'. Top line - 'When you laugh about people who feel so very lonely, their only desire is to die, well I'm afraid it doesn't make me smile... Kick them when they fall down'.

'I Know It's Over'. Top line - 'I know it's over, though it never really began, but in my heart it was so real'.

'Never Had No One Ever'. Top line - 'I had a really bad dream, it lasted 20 years, 7 months, 27 days, and I never had no one ever'.

'I'd Love To'. Top line - 'Again, I lay awake, and I cried because of waste, I'd love to, but only with you'.

Morrissey songs about this subject which have taken a wrong turn:

'I'm OK By Myself'. Worst line - 'Could this be an arm around my waist? Well surely the hand contains a knife... This might make you throw up in your bed, but I'm OK by myself'.

'How Can Anybody Possibly Know How I Feel?'. Worst line - 'She told me she loved me which means she must be insane'.

Does anybody else feel like this? How am I meant to feel the same respect for the man when he's singing about my life in the wrong way?

He's not singing about your life,he's singing about his
 

Fulham Road Lights

Ill-adjusted
He's not singing about your life,he's singing about his

That was his very magic though. I felt this was why he commanded such an obsessive nature over his fanbase - because despite never having met most of them, he managed to sing about their lives with such precision. Our lives and his were meant to coincide. I always thought that was the main appeal of Morrissey. Now I've moved on from being an obsessive to simply enjoying his music, as our lives have taken differing turns.
 

CrookedLittleVein

Duck. Duck. Duck. Goose.
I've always loved Morrissey's defiance, his determination not to join in, which has been there from the start (you must not go to them, let them come to you) and is stronger than ever now. There's something admirable and strangely beautiful about his intractable separateness. I find it deeply romantic, very powerful. The music waxes and wanes but his unique presence endures.
 

Soil Falling Over

Happy outsider
I've always loved Morrissey's defiance, his determination not to join in, which has been there from the start (you must not go to them, let them come to you) and is stronger than ever now. There's something admirable and strangely beautiful about his intractable separateness. I find it deeply romantic, very powerful. The music waxes and wanes but his unique presence endures.

Ditto and more: I do think the vein of pride-in-separateness Fulham atributes to his recent work has always been there, especially in his humor. And it's not as if the his recent work only celebrates the solitary life: "let me kiss you" is the song that best speaks to my particular stripe of solitary-disposition. At all periods his work has both mourned and celebrated this odd way of life (though certainly a tone of defiant celebration has come stronger...).

But why does that frustrate you, Fulham? I think it is wonderful. The 'mournful' side gives me license to wallow (from time to time) in the dark-aspect of lone-ness; but the other side helps keep me from falling into self-pity. It helps remind me that our disposition has a strength and style all it's own and not to be ashamed.

Part of the vicious cycle of being an introvert or one comfortable-with-their-own-company is that at some points I feel self-conscious about always being seen in my community by myself (which can then lead to hiding-away). Re-connecting with Morrissey in recent years has help prevent me from feeling like a weirdo, helped me (as he implored early in his career) to "accept myself." Under his influence I am much stronger & able to say "sure, I'm an odd-ball & I take pride in it!"
 

sistasheila

tjekket
Part of the vicious cycle of being an introvert or one comfortable-with-their-own-company is that at some points I feel self-conscious about always being seen in my community by myself (which can then lead to hiding-away). Re-connecting with Morrissey in recent years has help prevent me from feeling like a weirdo, helped me (as he implored early in his career) to "accept myself." Under his influence I am much stronger & able to say "sure, I'm an odd-ball & I take pride in it!"
this....
 

Bluebirds

Well-Known Member
My favourite Morrissey songs about loneliness:


'Never Had No One Ever'. Top line - 'I had a really bad dream, it lasted 20 years, 7 months, 27 days, and I never had no one ever'.

I've always found that line hysterically funny
 

David

Member
I see Morrissey as deliberately engaging in self-parody these days. I think it's funny and interesting. It's in that way that he engages with his previous work, rather than heartlessly or meaninglessly trying to imitate it. He knows he can't summon up the persona he had in previous years, so he subtly perverts it. We always have the work from when he was genuinely suffering or when he could convince us that he was. Plus, he still can write with great pathos when he wants to ("Come Back to Camden," "Dear God, Please Help Me," "It's Not Your Birthday Anymore").
 

Bluebirds

Well-Known Member
I see Morrissey as deliberately engaging in self-parody these days.

Some might say he's been engaging in self-parody since 1986?
 
Ditto and more: I do think the vein of pride-in-separateness Fulham atributes to his recent work has always been there, especially in his humor. And it's not as if the his recent work only celebrates the solitary life: "let me kiss you" is the song that best speaks to my particular stripe of solitary-disposition. At all periods his work has both mourned and celebrated this odd way of life (though certainly a tone of defiant celebration has come stronger...).

But why does that frustrate you, Fulham? I think it is wonderful. The 'mournful' side gives me license to wallow (from time to time) in the dark-aspect of lone-ness; but the other side helps keep me from falling into self-pity. It helps remind me that our disposition has a strength and style all it's own and not to be ashamed.

Part of the vicious cycle of being an introvert or one comfortable-with-their-own-company is that at some points I feel self-conscious about always being seen in my community by myself (which can then lead to hiding-away). Re-connecting with Morrissey in recent years has help prevent me from feeling like a weirdo, helped me (as he implored early in his career) to "accept myself." Under his influence I am much stronger & able to say "sure, I'm an odd-ball & I take pride in it!"

I really can't add anything to this. Very well put- I agree completely. :)

I see Morrissey as deliberately engaging in self-parody these days. I think it's funny and interesting. It's in that way that he engages with his previous work, rather than heartlessly or meaninglessly trying to imitate it. He knows he can't summon up the persona he had in previous years, so he subtly perverts it. We always have the work from when he was genuinely suffering or when he could convince us that he was. Plus, he still can write with great pathos when he wants to ("Come Back to Camden," "Dear God, Please Help Me," "It's Not Your Birthday Anymore").

I agree with this as well, although I think to some extent he's always engaged in self-parody: as Neil Hannon put it, "he can puncture his own balloon at will".
 

JohnnyMare

New Member
Morrissey has developped as an artist, and I agree with the earlier comment that he sings (and should sing) about his life - the fact that people find something about themselves in his work and connect to it is a by-product (as with any artist). This is why Morrissey is so well-respected. There are probably things that have happened in his life that have either made him look at or challenge his own views or given him more things to think (and write) about and that's what I want to hear - I wouldn't expect him to write anything solely to play up to character. I'm sure that he has gained new fans in recent years because of his current material and not because of his previous work or reputation.
 

murder and desire

Junior Member
That was his very magic though. I felt this was why he commanded such an obsessive nature over his fanbase - because despite never having met most of them, he managed to sing about their lives with such precision. Our lives and his were meant to coincide. I always thought that was the main appeal of Morrissey. Now I've moved on from being an obsessive to simply enjoying his music, as our lives have taken differing turns.

Yes but it is through no fault of Morrissey that you have changed your mind about him.
He is just singing songs of penned thoughts and stories, you do know some of the lines that have been quoted are meant to be amusing rather than sad?
Morrissey, is 50 something for goodness sake, he can't write as if he is 22 and living at his mums- know one would want him to would they?
With fans like his who needs an enema.
I would suggest that the thing that has changed most over the years is his type of fans.
In the past his fans seemed a lot more "with it", I tend to think maybe it's because this is an American site and a lot of Americans don't really get it, to be faire most British fans these days don't either.
I don't mean to sound damning or elitist it's just my observation, I just think Morrissey comes from a certain kind of English working class culture that died out by the 1990s, people seem to have also been brain washed by the media version of his life, even though they claim they haven't.

Just the other month someone on here- on hearing Morrissey talk about Bowie on one of the threads, where Moz says that Bowie over took Marc Bolan, in an artistic sense, and that Marc wasn't "able to sit at the table"- asked what did Morrissey mean by sit at the table!
I mean come on, come on it's enough to make one want to slam ones own hand in the door.
If someone can't understand a comment most correct thinking 11 year olds can understand, what hope is there of understanding his lyrics or anything else?
 

CrystalGeezer

My secret's my enzyme.
Just the other month someone on here- on hearing Morrissey talk about Bowie on one of the threads, where Moz says that Bowie over took Marc Bolan, in an artistic sense, and that Marc wasn't "able to sit at the table"- asked what did Morrissey mean by sit at the table!
I mean come on, come on it's enough to make one want to slam ones own hand in the door.
If someone can't understand a comment most correct thinking 11 year olds can understand, what hope is there of understanding his lyrics or anything else?

:guffaw::laughing::rofl::clap::ha-no:
 

Eraserhead

Accept Myself
But he's still the same underneath..............This you surely knew??
 
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