Independent / James Moore: "Morrissey on tour is the last thing Britain needs right now" (July 23, 2022)

Last edited by a moderator:
R

Ron27

Guest
These people make me puke. They just can’t accept that everyone won’t fall in-line behind their narrative. Well f*** them. Viva Morrissey
 

🐈🐈🐈

Well-Known Member
Not Marr, he'd boogered off by then. That was one of his short lived replacements.
Very true, Ivor Perry wasn’t it? Anyway, it would’ve been a cracking b-side for Stop Me…. Still, seems way too Marr-ish, so given it was never completed, probably the base was laid down and Marr just ‘left it’
 
M

music 1969

Guest
The prudes ! Always blaming morrisey for their problems !! His own people. !!blah blah😶
 

Emotional Guide Dog

Chairman Of The Bored
Today in the Independent:


It's like they're so desparate to say something they're just saying anything.
 

Ketamine Sun

Now, today, tomorrow and always
Very true, Ivor Perry wasn’t it? Anyway, it would’ve been a cracking b-side for Stop Me…. Still, seems way too Marr-ish, so given it was never completed, probably the base was laid down and Marr just ‘left it’

But have you heard the aborted version of Bengali? I don’t believe the music was written by Street. All that we know, in regards to its sound, it was described as more aggressive.

Anyone correct me if I’m wrong or misremembered the info that’s available on this version of the song.


Ok so here’s some info about it …


‘A first version of this song was demoed at Powerhouse Studios in London in August 1987, in the interim between the end of the Smiths and the beginning of Morrissey's solo career. The lyrics on this early version are a rough draft of those that would appear in the definitive and now familiar version, but the music was written by Ivor Perry (who was considered at the time as a replacement for Johnny Marr) and is completely different.

The definitive version with music by Stephen Street was recorded a few months later (likely October) at Wool Hall Studios in Bath. Street also acted as producer as well as bassist. The other musicians on the recording were Vini Reilly (guitar) and Andrew Paresi (drums).’


 

🐈🐈🐈

Well-Known Member
But have you heard the aborted version of Bengali? I don’t believe the music was written by Street. All that we know, in regards to its sound, it was described as more aggressive.

Anyone correct me if I’m wrong or misremembered the info that’s available on this version of the song.


Ok so here’s some info about it …


‘A first version of this song was demoed at Powerhouse Studios in London in August 1987, in the interim between the end of the Smiths and the beginning of Morrissey's solo career. The lyrics on this early version are a rough draft of those that would appear in the definitive and now familiar version, but the music was written by Ivor Perry (who was considered at the time as a replacement for Johnny Marr) and is completely different.

The definitive version with music by Stephen Street was recorded a few months later (likely October) at Wool Hall Studios in Bath. Street also acted as producer as well as bassist. The other musicians on the recording were Vini Reilly (guitar) and Andrew Paresi (drums).’


So it was a case of copy cat?
 

Ketamine Sun

Now, today, tomorrow and always
So it was a case of copy cat?

Some of the lyrics may have been the same, the title was. But the aborted version was described as aggressive, so that would imply that the Street version that we know is not a copy cat.

Very true, Ivor Perry wasn’t it? Anyway, it would’ve been a cracking b-side for Stop Me…. Still, seems way too Marr-ish, so given it was never completed, probably the base was laid down and Marr just ‘left it’

I just assumed you heard the aborted version of Bengali, if you’re saying as you have above how it would have made ‘a cracking b-side for Stop Me…. Still, seems way too Marr-ish’.
 

🐈🐈🐈

Well-Known Member
Some of the lyrics may have been the same, the title was. But the aborted version was described as aggressive, so that would imply that the Street version that we know is not a copy cat.



I just assumed you heard the aborted version of Bengali, if you’re saying as you have above how it would have made ‘a cracking b-side for Stop Me…. Still, seems way too Marr-ish
No no, just that I’d heard he’d begun work on it at the beginning of the end, laid down some chords and then post-Smiths it was smoothened out and asked to be replicated in a Marr-ish way…. This was hear say, I’ve sadly never heard the demo…. Anywhere to be found?
 

Ketamine Sun

Now, today, tomorrow and always
No no, just that I’d heard he’d begun work on it at the beginning of the end, laid down some chords and then post-Smiths it was smoothened out and asked to be replicated in a Marr-ish way…. This was hear say, I’ve sadly never heard the demo…. Anywhere to be found?

You mean Perry was asked to rescue some abandoned sketches that Marr left behind on tape in order to write the earlier version Bengali? Don’t know where that info came from, if I read it, then I forgot that bit.

Anyway, we still don’t know if it would have made a ‘cracking b-side’ since we haven’t heard it.
 

🐈🐈🐈

Well-Known Member
You mean Perry was asked to rescue some abandoned sketches that Marr left behind on tape in order to write the earlier version Bengali? Don’t know where that info came from, if I read it, then I forgot that bit.

Anyway, we still don’t know if it would have made a ‘cracking b-side’ since we haven’t heard it.
‘Cracking b-side’ meant for Bengali as it is now…..
 

Ketamine Sun

Now, today, tomorrow and always
‘Cracking b-side’ meant for Bengali as it is now…..



Very true, Ivor Perry wasn’t it? Anyway, it would’ve been a cracking b-side for Stop Me…. Still, seems way too Marr-ish, so given it was never completed, probably the base was laid down and Marr just ‘left it’

Ah ok. The way your above older post sounded when read made me think that you were referring to the original aborted version.
 

Eldritch

Well-Known Member
But have you heard the aborted version of Bengali? I don’t believe the music was written by Street. All that we know, in regards to its sound, it was described as more aggressive.
I can't help but feel a bit sorry for Ivor Perry, who was clearly put in an impossible situation. Apparently Morrissey had the mindset that a guitarist and a songwriter like Johnny Marr could be replaced just like that by hiring somebody from the support band. Considering how swiftly the sessions ended, Morrissey must have had a rude awakening.
 

Ketamine Sun

Now, today, tomorrow and always
I can't help but feel a bit sorry for Ivor Perry, who was clearly put in an impossible situation.
agree.
Apparently Morrissey had the mindset that a guitarist and a songwriter like Johnny Marr could be replaced just like that by hiring somebody from the support band.

Was it only Morrissey? I could imagine there was also external forces at work putting pressure on the remaining members to carry on. So it was a group mindset trying to keep it together for various reasons. Also I imagine it was in a way the remaining members thumbing their noses at Johnny for leaving.

Considering how swiftly the sessions ended, Morrissey must have had a rude awakening.

I can’t remember what’s been written about the aborted session, or what’s to be believed. But I wouldn’t be surprised if it wasn’t about Perry not being capable enough, even if only to temporarily fill in. It seemed a bit rushed.
 

gashonthenail

Well-Known Member
Some comments on here seem to be from people who can't see past their idol-worship. Some others are knowingly misrepresenting the blog to unfairly and incorrectly suggest the author is saying that Morrissey touring is worse than everything that is wrong with the state of the UK at the moment.
I get it, I love the Smiths music, and some of Morrissey's solo stuff, but you have to look beyond that.
The blogger makes the very good point that it's difficult to separate the art from the artist. That's the problem I have. My views of the world are more in line with those Morrissey seemed to have back in his Smiths days, and his subsequent coming out as a misinformed bigot really turns my stomach. I get that some of you may share his views, and to you I'm no doubt a 'woke virtue signaller' so my opinion can be discounted. You're entitled to think that but, just as I do with your opinions I'd hope you'd at lest take the time to think about mine and at least consider them. Despite what Morrissey would have you think, we're all equal, every life is as valuable as any other. The 'immigration problem' he and others like to push is all part of the entitled establishment's need to scapegoat the poor and downtrodden and desperate (many of whom they have made that way, by invading other countries purely for economic gain) so that the poor and desperate and downtrodden natives of the UK blame the immigrants (and the disabled, and the unemployed) for their own situation, rather than the real culprits - the increasingly rich establishment. The UK is a rich country, we have enough money, even to support increased immigration. We have enough money to sort out all the problems we currently have, but those in power have made choices about who's deserving and who isn't. The more you ignore that, the richer they get.
I get the defensiveness, I get the loyalty to someone who (even though you don't and couldn't ever possibly really know) feels very important to you but, Jesus Christ - get some perspective, get some humanity and don't follow this disappointing pied piper in the direction the rich and powerful right wingers want you to go in.
Enjoy his music (I'm genuinely jealous that you still can) but don't blindly claim victimhood for someone who's now spent decades inciting hate towards others.

I would love to know what you think Morrissey's 'views of the world' were back in the good old days of The Smiths? He has always taken a staunchly working class view of the world. And what do you know - most working class people are against mass immigration. Or haven't you noticed? Do you not have much contact with working class people?
If you only focus on the positives of mass immigration - isn't that as bad as only focusing on the negatives? The truth, as usual, is probably somewhere in the middle. Many would argue that mass immigration has suited the 'rich establishment' as you call them very well - because it has kept labour costs down and increased the costs of renting a property, for example.
I'm not aware of Moz ever expressing hatred towards immigrants. He has clearly though taken a somewhat critical stance on mass immigration. That's allowed isn't it? Why are you so frightened of anyone critical of mass immigration? It's the establishment view that mass immigration and 'diversity' are socially good. When Moz expresses opinions critical of mass immigration - he is expressing an anti-establishment point of view.
 

Malarkey

Active Member
I would love to know what you think Morrissey's 'views of the world' were back in the good old days of The Smiths? He has always taken a staunchly working class view of the world. And what do you know - most working class people are against mass immigration. Or haven't you noticed? Do you not have much contact with working class people?
If you only focus on the positives of mass immigration - isn't that as bad as only focusing on the negatives? The truth, as usual, is probably somewhere in the middle. Many would argue that mass immigration has suited the 'rich establishment' as you call them very well - because it has kept labour costs down and increased the costs of renting a property, for example.
I'm not aware of Moz ever expressing hatred towards immigrants. He has clearly though taken a somewhat critical stance on mass immigration. That's allowed isn't it? Why are you so frightened of anyone critical of mass immigration? It's the establishment view that mass immigration and 'diversity' are socially good. When Moz expresses opinions critical of mass immigration - he is expressing an anti-establishment point of view.

He's said almost nothing about mass immigration.

And none of it is even close to your position.
 
R

Rodney Safetyfield

Guest
It's kind of odd that the same people bashing Moz defended Kanye West when he said the biggest mistake America made was ending slavery. Are any UK record stores refusing to stock Kanye?
 
D

Deleted member 3879

Guest
Morrissey and many people on this site think that British identity is so fragile, that a few immigrants can radically change it for the worse. :crazy:
 

Trending Threads

Top Bottom