How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith albums?

Where do you think 'Years of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 albums?


  • Total voters
    65

Maurice E

Junior Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Well according to Boz, it's of similar quality to Vauxhall, which would place it way up there in the top 5 Moz/Smiths albums.
Altho before Quarry came out, Alain was saying that it was a cross between Vauxhall and Your Arsenal...
 

Jamie

Bluff, Ardour & Assoc.
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Well according to Boz, it's of similar quality to Vauxhall, which would place it way up there in the top 5 Moz/Smiths albums.
Altho before Quarry came out, Alain was saying that it was a cross between Vauxhall and Your Arsenal...
Not to mention that Morrissey has already dropped a superlative about it being his "strongest" to Janice Long. He says something along those lines every time he releases an album. Wasn't Maladjusted described as "the best of me?" (Well, better than YATQ, but still...) I have stopped anticipating something I enjoyed as much as V&I or Southpaw Grammar to mitigate my disappointment. I guess I will be happily surprised if something is that reliably strong again and doesn't fade after repeat listenings.

This poll reminded me of someone making the ludicrous statement in 2004 that Quarry was BETTER than The Queen Is Dead. Not to offend that person if they're still here, but I'll have to respectfully - yet vehemently - "agree to disagree," let's say...and forgive me if a cluck of the tongue or guffaw slips loose!

Cheers,
Jamie
 

Maurice E

Junior Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Not to mention that Morrissey has already dropped a superlative about it being his "strongest" to Janice Long. He says something along those lines every time he releases an album. Wasn't Maladjusted described as "the best of me?" (Well, better than YATQ, but still...) I have stopped anticipating something I enjoyed as much as V&I or Southpaw Grammar to mitigate my disappointment. I guess I will be happily surprised if something is that reliably strong again and doesn't fade after repeat listenings.

This poll reminded me of someone making the ludicrous statement in 2004 that Quarry was BETTER than The Queen Is Dead. Not to offend that person if they're still here, but I'll have to respectfully - yet vehemently - "agree to disagree," let's say...and forgive me if a cluck of the tongue or guffaw slips loose!

Cheers,
Jamie
Yep, I'd go along with most of that. Ever since Moz described Southpaw Grammar as his strongest songs (or some such), I've realised he's being disingenuous or (perhaps more likely) is just too close to the songs (at that particular point in time) to see how good they actually are in the overall context of his back catalogue.
Unlike Alain, I don't think Boz has ever talked up a Morrissey album prior to its release before though - maybe it's just because he hasn't been given the opportunity.
But describing it as 'special' (and remember he wasn't even directly asked about the album; just his six favourite) and Black Cloud as 'the classic' is grounds for optimism!
 

Jamie

Bluff, Ardour & Assoc.
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Unlike Alain, I don't think Boz has ever talked up a Morrissey album prior to its release before though - maybe it's just because he hasn't been given the opportunity.
But describing it as 'special' (and remember he wasn't even directly asked about the album; just his six favourite) and Black Cloud as 'the classic' is grounds for optimism!
Well, this is true and yet it's false, as someone once said. ;)

When Alain and Boz were interviewed by MOJO for the November 2002 issue, Boz was quoted as saying: "These tracks...[referring to the songs that became YATQ and the B-sides]they're just...superb." But I hear what you're saying. Boz might also be enthusiastic because he has songs on the album and the lead-off single.

I see credits and debits looking ahead so far. My Dearest Love was lovely and hopefully a signpost of Alain's other material, but his lack of involvement in the recording makes me leery of the overall sound. Without him and Boz, I generally dislike the sound of the remaining band. Matt Walker has yet to show signs of restraint on the traps and Solomon Walker is no Gary Day - let alone Jonny Bridgwood. I don't want to hear a whole album of Children in Pieces-style bombast.

Jerry Finn, the gods rest him, was also a mixed bag as producer by my lights, too. Tony Visconti had his faults, but I think he was closer to the right path. Is it just me or is there any good reason why he should not work with Steve Lillywhite again? Or Danton Supple, now that he's graduated to the "big time?" For that matter, if COLDPLAY is "hallowed" enough to work with Eno, couldn't Morrissey?

Going back to Alain not playing on his songs, I just had a thought for the members who wish and hope for a songwriting reunion with Marr. I don't think the corollary has been examined before: that Marr might co-write the song but not play on it. It would almost make it a non-event in my mind, as Johnny's performance was arguably the key factor in his Smiths songs. I'm not equating Alain to Johnny, as they are vastly different writers and have their own styles, but they have a certain imprint of their own in the sound of their songs. How much of that will / would potentially get lost in the translation?

Cheers,
Jamie
 

Maurice E

Junior Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Well, this is true and yet it's false, as someone once said. ;)

When Alain and Boz were interviewed by MOJO for the November 2002 issue, Boz was quoted as saying: "These tracks...[referring to the songs that became YATQ and the B-sides]they're just...superb." But I hear what you're saying. Boz might also be enthusiastic because he has songs on the album and the lead-off single.

I see credits and debits looking ahead so far. My Dearest Love was lovely and hopefully a signpost of Alain's other material, but his lack of involvement in the recording makes me leery of the overall sound. Without him and Boz, I generally dislike the sound of the remaining band. Matt Walker has yet to show signs of restraint on the traps and Solomon Walker is no Gary Day - let alone Jonny Bridgwood. I don't want to hear a whole album of Children in Pieces-style bombast.

Jerry Finn, the gods rest him, was also a mixed bag as producer by my lights, too. Tony Visconti had his faults, but I think he was closer to the right path. Is it just me or is there any good reason why he should not work with Steve Lillywhite again? Or Danton Supple, now that he's graduated to the "big time?" For that matter, if COLDPLAY is "hallowed" enough to work with Eno, couldn't Morrissey?

Going back to Alain not playing on his songs, I just had a thought for the members who wish and hope for a songwriting reunion with Marr. I don't think the corollary has been examined before: that Marr might co-write the song but not play on it. It would almost make it a non-event in my mind, as Johnny's performance was arguably the key factor in his Smiths songs. I'm not equating Alain to Johnny, as they are vastly different writers and have their own styles, but they have a certain imprint of their own in the sound of their songs. How much of that will / would potentially get lost in the translation?

Cheers,
Jamie
"these tracks, they're just superb"?
I'd forgotten about that quote but I remember it now. there goes my theory. colloaks!

you obviously know a lot more about technical side of music than me.
however, I remain unconvinced of the importance of the producer.
Lillywhite produced Morrissey's best and worst received (by critics and fans) albums (Vauxhall, Southpaw, Maladjusted) so his influence can't be that great. I reckon it's at least 95% down to the song quality.
having said that, it would be interesting to hear him work with a more unorthodox producer like Eno...
 

nogodsnomasters85

Not Stirred
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Quarry was so-so, I thought Ringleader was the second-worst (Southpaw is the worst, in my opinion.), and I don';t have much hope for the new one. Hey, it'd be great if it was another Viva Hate, or Vauxhall, but if it was a horse, I wouldn't bet on it. As long as he still plays the older material, I'll keep shelling out for tickets.
 

LegalTender

New Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

i have no idea. i haven't heard anything from it yet.
 

Maurice E

Junior Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

i have no idea. i haven't heard anything from it yet.
If you went to any 2008 tour dates, watched Jools Holland, or looked at any recent You Tube material, you'll have heard at least one of the following; 'Something is squeezing my skull', 'One day goodbye will be farewell', Mama lay softly', and 'I'm throwing my arms around Paris'.
 

Johan de Witt

Senior Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Morrissey's 13th studio album (including Smiths) is released in September.
But judging from the songs you’ve heard and what else you know about it, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Years_of_Refusal where do you think it will rank along the other 12?
The scores below are taken from last year’s mass M Solo poll.

1. Queen is dead 9.1
2. Meat is murder 8.9
3. Smiths 8.7
4. Vauxhall and I 8.6
5. Strangeways 8.5
6. Your Arsenal 8.4
7. Viva Hate 8.0
8. Quarry 7.9
9. Southpaw 7.5
10. Ringleader 7.5
11. Kill Uncle 7.2
12. Maladjusted 7.0
With only 6 new songs 2008 can't have been a very inspirational year for Moz. I don't expect it to score any better than Ringleader, but if there are 1 or 2 really great songs on there, I'm happy anyway.
 

Theo

Active Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Haven't heard the album so how on earth could I answer this? Why not save these threads for when the album is released? Silly SoLowers., always rushing to judgment.

P.S. Off topic but just wanna point out: I can see by clicking on mods' names on the people-who-are-online list (which gives me info on their latest activity) how they track me every time I post a message. Skinny is following me around right now and it is creepy. "Wanting me to break their laws!"
 
Last edited:

Dow Jones

Blighted Fungus
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Haven't heard the album so how on earth could I answer this? Why not save these threads for when the album is released? Silly SoLowers., always rushing to judgment.

P.S. Off topic but just wanna point out: I can see by clicking on mods' names on the people-who-are-online list (which gives me info on their latest activity) how they track me every time I post a message. Skinny is following me around right now and it is creepy. "Wanting me to break their laws!"
I dunno, that doesn't seem too creepy. I'd be flattered if I wuz you.
 

jm26

Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

If you went to any 2008 tour dates, watched Jools Holland, or looked at any recent You Tube material, you'll have heard at least one of the following; 'Something is squeezing my skull', 'One day goodbye will be farewell', Mama lay softly', and 'I'm throwing my arms around Paris'.
Are all very good tracks imo. And i've only heard them a few times. I'm also a fan of THPGU and All You Need Is Me, so I personally can see it being, as Moz says, very strong. Very much looking forward to it.
 

Maurice E

Junior Member
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

well, what do we all think now?
I originally voted that I thought it would be one of his best ever solo albums.
however, we now have extra information;
-we know THPGU and AYNIM are on it,
-Paris is the lead-off single,
-the early reviews mention power chords, synth strings and Southpaw Grammar and;
-the more intriguing sounding songs have been replaced by a couple of last minute Morrissey/Tobias additions.

I'm having to lower my expectations a little!
with all the b-sides included, I'm hoping we'll have a few brilliant brand new Morrissey songs but I get the feeling that we haven't got a classic album on our hands.
time will tell!
 

Kewpie

Member
Moderator
Subscriber
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Bump for people who haven't read this.
 

Velvis

Not a beginner
Re: How d'you think 'Years Of Refusal' will rank alongside the other 12 Moz/Smith alb

Bump for people who haven't read this.
Yeah thanks I missed this one...

Eno as producer - now that would be interesting...

I'm actually feeling quite positive about YOR - I won't vote until I hear it, you can never tell how good an album is until you hear it all
 
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