Fiona Dodwell: "Misunderstanding Morrissey: Sparks and the steady drip, drip, drip of slander" (July 15, 2020)

"One wonders whether the vocal Morrissey detractors have delved much beyond the surface of NME's clickbait headlines and the lefty identity politics of formerly reputable publications like The Guardian."

Misunderstanding Morrissey: Sparks and the steady drip, drip, drip of slander

One wonders whether the vocal Morrissey detractors have delved much beyond the surface of NME’s clickbait headlines and the lefty identity politics of formerly reputable publications like The Guardian.

thepostmillennial.com

FWD.

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Related item:

• Morrissey-Solo: Classic Pop: Sparks on Morrissey - "it's saddening, very disheartening" - July 13, 2020

 

[thot]

Wearing a For Britain pin badge was the final straw, to be honest. Fouling up his earlier comeback with the Anne Marie Waters comments was also terrible.

At this stage, Morrissey has been insulated from anything approaching a normal life for four decades and is surrounded by payroll lackeys. He’s mined the topic of loneliness to death, and he’s hamstrung by the relatively obscure songwriters he chooses to work with (I suspect because he’s tight).

The List Of The Lost was, genuinely, embarrassing, and Autobiography cried out for an editor. Imagine if he’d worked with a talented author like Mark E Smith had done with Renegade?

Ive been a fan since the early 90s but going to see him at Wembley earlier this year was the first time other people - some who barely know music - expressed concern about my judgement. My taste isn’t dictated by the approval of others but it was very interesting to see that.

I predict a sad end, like Mrs Shufflewick, and I suspect he won’t get another record deal - which may be an act of mercy. It didn’t need to be like this and he’s only got himself to blame.

 

[GodEmperorMorrissey]

The Scottish National Party had accusations of fascism levelled at it for years before reinventing itself as centre left. Nicola Sturgeon has said she's uncomfortable with the name. It's officially civic nationalism but it does occasionally break into blood & soil.

I'm not keen on nationalism - but I accept there's an argument for self-determination & smaller political units.

That post wasn't aimed at you but I respect your moxy

I don't believe civic nationalism works. That's basically what Trump is, boomer Civic nationalist

 

[Vegan Cro Spirit 444]

Stop talking like you know me, and joking about alcoholism, I’ve lost mates through alcoholism, ive just lost my dad through alcoholism and suicide, I’m in my 4th month of sobriety, I’ll never touch a drop again, anyone that thinks it’s f***in funny or a subject of ridicule, come and f***in say it to me

WTF?



I said ONE swig only FFS

 

[Deleted member 29417]

That post wasn't aimed at you but I respect your moxy

I don't believe civic nationalism works. That's basically what Trump is, boomer Civic nationalist

I do believe it works - as long as there's some common ground & a fair legal system. It takes a bit of work but it's actually stronger than an ethnostate that has to worry about its demographics breaking down.

 

[GodEmperorMorrissey]

I do believe it works - as long as there's some common ground & a fair legal system. It takes a bit of work but it's actually stronger than an ethnostate that has to worry about its demographics breaking down.

No way is civic nationalism stronger than ethno nationalism. It's impossible

 

[Vegan Cro Spirit 444]

You seriously need a boyfriend, girlfriend, pet goldfish whatever. Sad.

fatgayvegan is available

 

[Verso]

Your obsession with the Queen's English can only be perceived as white privilege and micro-aggression towards those BAME brothers and sisters who don't have English as a first language. A distraction maybe from the fact that you don't have an argument?

And what are you arguing, exactly?

GodEmperorMorrissey is a flat-earther who thinks that Jews control the world by using black people and immigrants to undermine and destroy “the white race”. And the most terrifying thing of all is that English is his first language.

 

[Deleted member 29417]

No way is civic nationalism stronger than ethno nationalism. It's impossible

It's not impossible.

For a start - there's no way to have a viable territory that doesn't embrace more than one tribe. As you build your nation story you'll need to include them in ways they want to be included or you have to suppress them, sowing the seeds of discord.

A monoculture has less tolerance of difference. It's built its identity on conformity. So anyone eccentric, subcultures & new ideas also become a serious threat to how it functions. Which is also true for religious or political monocultures. It also can't risk taking in new people with skills & innovations & trade can stagnate.

Civic nationalism gives people space to do their own thing & can build the common ground necessary to run infrastructure & resources. And can deal with change.

So it's stronger.

 

[Vegan Cro Spirit 444]

Yeah and that f***in disgusting, and I’d never say your parents were at fault, or you shouldn’t have put yourself in those positions. Even if I hated your guts I couldn’t say that. But Moz said it, and it’s fine? There’s absolutely no room, not 1 f***in percent of room, to blame anyone else but the dirty f***ers in question. Sometimes I think you lot don’t even agree with the points Morrissey is making, you’re simply agreeing with the man, that kind of blind agreement it’s pretty dangerous like, it has you’s justify all sorts of horrible behaviour, just cos it came out of Mozzas mouth, as if there’s a sense of betrayal in disagreeing with him. It really blows my mind.

WTF!!


didnt you post how you wanted to chop and burn peeps?

 

[Moz Fan]

Wearing a For Britain pin badge was the final straw, to be honest. Fouling up his earlier comeback with the Anne Marie Waters comments was also terrible.

At this stage, Morrissey has been insulated from anything approaching a normal life for four decades and is surrounded by payroll lackeys. He’s mined the topic of loneliness to death, and he’s hamstrung by the relatively obscure songwriters he chooses to work with (I suspect because he’s tight).

The List Of The Lost was, genuinely, embarrassing, and Autobiography cried out for an editor. Imagine if he’d worked with a talented author like Mark E Smith had done with Renegade?

Ive been a fan since the early 90s but going to see him at Wembley earlier this year was the first time other people - some who barely know music - expressed concern about my judgement. My taste isn’t dictated by the approval of others but it was very interesting to see that.

I predict a sad end, like Mrs Shufflewick, and I suspect he won’t get another record deal - which may be an act of mercy. It didn’t need to be like this and he’s only got himself to blame.

I predict a sad, sad end for you too.

And, perhaps, a burning hot afterlife in that place designed for hurtful/hateful people.

 

[Jeffrey7777]

The points Fiona bring up are true, prime example "Ganglord" (2009). Why don't journalist/interviewers bring up these points to those being interviewed that condemn Mr. M?
John Earls, the interviewer of the Sparks, should have countered the negative responses from Russell with these facts. Isn't that the job of a non-bias, responsible journalist? Would have made for a much better balanced read of the Classic Pop article.

 

[Anony]

Wearing a For Britain pin badge was the final straw, to be honest. Fouling up his earlier comeback with the Anne Marie Waters comments was also terrible.

At this stage, Morrissey has been insulated from anything approaching a normal life for four decades and is surrounded by payroll lackeys. He’s mined the topic of loneliness to death, and he’s hamstrung by the relatively obscure songwriters he chooses to work with (I suspect because he’s tight).

The List Of The Lost was, genuinely, embarrassing, and Autobiography cried out for an editor. Imagine if he’d worked with a talented author like Mark E Smith had done with Renegade?

Ive been a fan since the early 90s but going to see him at Wembley earlier this year was the first time other people - some who barely know music - expressed concern about my judgement. My taste isn’t dictated by the approval of others but it was very interesting to see that.

I predict a sad end, like Mrs Shufflewick, and I suspect he won’t get another record deal - which may be an act of mercy. It didn’t need to be like this and he’s only got himself to blame.

Wise words, dude, and well said. I've stopped seeing him live since his For Britain support despite there being concerts within 30 minutes of where I live, and me having seen him play countless times since the early 90s. I don't want to be associated with him in public anymore (and that's what happens when you go to a live concert) but I can sheepishly buy his new CDs when no-one's looking.
I disagree about the songwriters though. I (like most reviewers) think these new ones are his best songs for years and years, up there with the early solo stuff.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

Irish, queer, vegan, feminist, nostalgic for a Britain of the past. Had she been English, male, straight, macho and meat-loving he wouldn't have given the party a second thought.

 

[Synonymous]

I think that you and ordinaryboy86 are talking about two different things.

There is free speech and then there is hate speech.

But I don’t think ordinaryboy86 thinks about the consequences of shutting down or canceling those that express themselves through hate speech. No one in their right mind would condone such behavior, but It has to be treated in a different manner than just curtailing their right and freedom to do so.

Repressing someone from expressing their opinions no matter how ugly we think their words are can just make things worse. It may be better to hear them out and through debate hopefully they’ll see how wrong their hateful opinions are.

Of course some will say... then who decides what is and is not hate speech? but I think hate speech is pretty obvious when one hears it.

Not so black and white that hate speech is obvious when one hears it. What constitutes hate speech? How can you determine that? Yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater is one thing and so are death threats on the other. Of course, what constitutes free speech and hate speech has become blurred these days. This is the danger and hypocrisy of so-called 'hate crime' legislation. How is it justifiable? The question you should be asking borders on the definition of morality. It begins there. Such attempts to place the moral law as the law of the land is nothing new and we are seeing its effects through passed legislation today. But whose morality? This is the real issue that ought to be discussed.

 

[ZOOM FROM GLOOM]

I don't think Morrissey knew much about the Spacey or Weinstein cases & wasn't making any definitive statements on them. You're damning him forever for chatting. How many people's conversations would survive that?

I believe Morrissey thinks or hopes that the reader/listener is intelligent enough to know that he is not going to state the obvious.

Everyone knows that Spacey’s behavior is wrong, it is a thing that goes without saying.
Morrissey was just taking into consideration the larger picture when he mentioned the responsibility of parents and also gave an example of his own personal experience at the age of thirteen of knowing better.

But simply because Morrissey didn’t go on a rant about how evil Spacey is,
people then automatically conclude that he is condoning Spacey’s behavior.

Also these are the same people that totally ignore Morrissey’s other comments in the same interview about how much he hates rape and other forms of sexual abuse.

It was a joke - because Ket thinks it's strange you spend money on a band if you think the singer & lyricist is a racist.

More than strange, ordinaryboy86 is a total loon job that attacks fans and accuses fans of being delusional while at the same time he goes on believing that collecting Morrissey related memorabilia is okay, spending his time and thousands of pounds on some one that he hates and believes is a racist. I mean, talk about delusional.

If he thinks Morrissey is such a evil person, then stop collecting memorabilia related to Morrissey, wash your hands clean of it all, and move the f*** on.

 

[GodEmperorMorrissey]

It's not impossible.

For a start - there's no way to have a viable territory that doesn't embrace more than one tribe. As you build your nation story you'll need to include them in ways they want to be included or you have to suppress them, sowing the seeds of discord.

A monoculture has less tolerance of difference. It's built its identity on conformity. So anyone eccentric, subcultures & new ideas also become a serious threat to how it functions. Which is also true for religious or political monocultures. It also can't risk taking in new people with skills & innovations & trade can stagnate.

Civic nationalism gives people space to do their own thing & can build the common ground necessary to run infrastructure & resources. And can deal with change.

So it's stronger.

What can civic nationalism agree upon to make their foundation united?

 

[Respo]

What braincells?

The ones he has left are well & truly pickled

 

[GodEmperorMorrissey]

And what are you arguing, exactly?

GodEmperorMorrissey is a flat-earther who thinks that Jews control the world by using black people and immigrants to undermine and destroy “the white race”. And the most terrifying thing of all is that English is his first language.

You think Morrissey tried to f*** you and that we drove a go kart on the moon. You call yourself an anti racist and basically made up what my stance is. You're a pathetic little bitch

 

[Deleted member 29417]

What can civic nationalism agree upon to make their foundation united?

Values, the law, national holidays - even things I'm unkeen on like the flag & the Queen are actually very popular in the UK outside of raging lefties & Republican diehards.

 

[Respo]

WTF!!


didnt you post how you wanted to chop and burn peeps?

Correct