Do you feel tired of Morrissey's verbal attacks?
- Thread starter Kewpie
- Start date
S
Skylarker
Guest
Oh , and thanks Skylarker ! You know what - I don't care what people say ; you 're not a #@!!%*&#* ....
Ha, thanks man. I don't care what they say, either.
Bring it on, bitches.
joe frady
Vile Refusenik
Am I feeling "tired of Morrissey's verbal attacks"? Or am I bone tired of pointless polls on a forum so obviously owned and moderated by people who clearly loathe Morrissey c.2012. Why bother with the charade any longer?
Has the Moz changed or have I changed?
When we were piss poor students & dole-ites back in the glory days we couldn't enough of his awkward buggerishness. And you don't get more 'awkward' than going up against Band-Aid, Live-Aid, the Brighton Bomb, etcetera. But now we're all Guardian-reading, M&S Dine-in-for-£10 eating, plastic Jack waving, squeezed-middle breeders suddenly his awkwardness isn't quite as glorious. We don't want awkwardness now. It's too...awkward. We want a 'good bloke', who we can have a pint with. That's why we have Richard Hawley. And Billy Bragg. Etc.
Morrissey was an awkward bugger then and he's an awkward bugger now. Then, his contrariness was our contrariness. We thought he was on our side. But he was only ever on his side. Personally I came to realise this around '97; with 'Maladjusted' came a certain...adjustment in thought, and I saw him less as my voice and more of the voice of a particularly fascinating man. Frequently, over the years since, those voices have dovetailed, but more often than not the ongoing fascination lies in bearing witness to the unique and individual machinations of Morrissey the artist. As of July 2012, Manchester and Edinburgh, the fascination continues. And if such supposed 'awkwardness' in the man produces the undoubtable sublimity of those concerts, then, frankly, more power to the bugger.
Has the Moz changed or have I changed?
When we were piss poor students & dole-ites back in the glory days we couldn't enough of his awkward buggerishness. And you don't get more 'awkward' than going up against Band-Aid, Live-Aid, the Brighton Bomb, etcetera. But now we're all Guardian-reading, M&S Dine-in-for-£10 eating, plastic Jack waving, squeezed-middle breeders suddenly his awkwardness isn't quite as glorious. We don't want awkwardness now. It's too...awkward. We want a 'good bloke', who we can have a pint with. That's why we have Richard Hawley. And Billy Bragg. Etc.
Morrissey was an awkward bugger then and he's an awkward bugger now. Then, his contrariness was our contrariness. We thought he was on our side. But he was only ever on his side. Personally I came to realise this around '97; with 'Maladjusted' came a certain...adjustment in thought, and I saw him less as my voice and more of the voice of a particularly fascinating man. Frequently, over the years since, those voices have dovetailed, but more often than not the ongoing fascination lies in bearing witness to the unique and individual machinations of Morrissey the artist. As of July 2012, Manchester and Edinburgh, the fascination continues. And if such supposed 'awkwardness' in the man produces the undoubtable sublimity of those concerts, then, frankly, more power to the bugger.
joe frady
Vile Refusenik
Oh but how could he ever live up to your innate sense of beauty?
D
Deleted member 1074
Guest
Lyrics befitting a man who has been referred to as "one of the greatest lyricists of all time" and music befitting a man who was in a band with Johnny Marr for 5 years and Alain Whyte for 15 years would be a good start.
A
Anonymous
Guest
this. This. This.
Worm
Taste the diffidence
Just in case True To You is blocked by your ISP, here are a random sampling of comments. Outside of his withering attacks on royalty, animal cruelty, Assad, and other things he hates-- and has hated and railed against in public for nearly 30 years-- almost all of his other comments are in the tone of the following:
August...
"The rich experience of our recent tour of Italy, Turkey, Israel and Greece has thankfully matched the terrific responses we had received in Asia and South America earlier this year - a year that, to my amazement, has become the most successful of my touring life. How, exactly? And why? Once again, all I can offer is the sore throat of thanks to everyone who bought tickets and who supported us along the way."
I just might die with a smile on my face, after all.
undiminished, with a heart that longs for light
I just might die with a smile on my face, after all.
undiminished, with a heart that longs for light
June...
I express my very sincere thanks to all of you who attended our shows of April and May - all of which were fantastic, and often beyond belief. My gratitude, I realize, could never be enough.
I have never in my life experienced a crowd such as that of Jakarta, who sang each song so loudly that their voices caught all of the onstage microphones and warped the sound into a mad bellow of love. Later, backstage, we were numbed by the joy that Jakarta had given us.
I fell in love anew with Japan.
Meanwhile, somewhere else, far away from tabloid Britain, the moon retains its friendly silence, and the world is all before you.
In reverent spirit, keenly alive
I have never in my life experienced a crowd such as that of Jakarta, who sang each song so loudly that their voices caught all of the onstage microphones and warped the sound into a mad bellow of love. Later, backstage, we were numbed by the joy that Jakarta had given us.
I fell in love anew with Japan.
Meanwhile, somewhere else, far away from tabloid Britain, the moon retains its friendly silence, and the world is all before you.
In reverent spirit, keenly alive
March...
Thank you for an incredible tour of South America. It has been the best tour of my life. Nothing I had previously experienced prepared me for the love shown to me by the people of Chile, Peru, Brazil, Colombia and Argentina. The excitement of the Brazilian audiences was almost heart-stopping. After all these years, to still be a part of people's hope is astounding to me. It's one thing to be valued, but to be loved is an entirely different experience.
Thanks also to the police in Peru, Brazil and Colombia who escorted me around (as custodians, I should add.) I am grateful.
My love for the band goes through the roof. All we have is yours.
Thanks also to the police in Peru, Brazil and Colombia who escorted me around (as custodians, I should add.) I am grateful.
My love for the band goes through the roof. All we have is yours.
December 2011...
(After Mexico) I am anchored, delighted, and pale with gratitude. ... The audiences were the most loving (and loud) that I have ever experienced.
I am very grateful to our new agency, William Morris Endeavor, for their astounding efforts to make this recent tour so enjoyable and triumphant. No management, no label, no promotion … all that we have are fantastic ticket sales. Which means you. And there is no greater thing worth having.
I have the most magnificent live crew on the planet. If I said my thanks forever it would not be long enough.
I am very grateful to our new agency, William Morris Endeavor, for their astounding efforts to make this recent tour so enjoyable and triumphant. No management, no label, no promotion … all that we have are fantastic ticket sales. Which means you. And there is no greater thing worth having.
I have the most magnificent live crew on the planet. If I said my thanks forever it would not be long enough.
And his professional status, as a singer without a label? This, from a June Interview...
There was a seven-year hiatus between Maladjusted (1997) and You Are the Quarry (2004). Why was that?
It happened because of what’s happening to me right now – no interest from any record label. There is nothing I can do about it, and I no longer worry about it. I don’t have management or any form of publicist, so this troubadour existence is too challenging for labels, I suppose. Whatever will be, will be.
It happened because of what’s happening to me right now – no interest from any record label. There is nothing I can do about it, and I no longer worry about it. I don’t have management or any form of publicist, so this troubadour existence is too challenging for labels, I suppose. Whatever will be, will be.
Best tours ever...reverent spirit, keenly alive...grateful to audiences...numb with joy..."I no longer worry about" not having a record label, "whatever will be, will be"...
Boy, what a f***ing grouch!
As usual, Morrissey has the clearest view of the landscape. In an October 2011 interview Morrissey summed up the matter very succinctly:
Ryan: Some of your comments in the media have been top drawer as of late. Some newspapers have taken issue with some of your comments.
Morrissey: Well, they always do... They MUST!
Ryan: We found you to be quite the gentlemen. Have you been misunderstood in any of your statements?
Morrissey: I think I am officially ‘Mad Morrissey’ now, and everything I say must be ridiculed because that’s one way of NOT dealing with the contents of the actual comment. The Guardian is now like the Sun was in the 1970s: completely intolerant and full of contradictions. With the riots recently the media are obsessed with punishment as solution, but no-one has the intelligence to ask why the people did what they did. We live in very dumbed-down times. Everything - news media, music, music magazines - are presented with the assumption that the people as a whole are utterly thick, so therefore when I say, as I have, that the so-called royals are the most dysfunctional and unpleasant family in British history, no-one asks me why I think this. They simply print ‘Bigmouth Strikes Again’. Oh, I could go on. And do, often.
Morrissey: Well, they always do... They MUST!
Ryan: We found you to be quite the gentlemen. Have you been misunderstood in any of your statements?
Morrissey: I think I am officially ‘Mad Morrissey’ now, and everything I say must be ridiculed because that’s one way of NOT dealing with the contents of the actual comment. The Guardian is now like the Sun was in the 1970s: completely intolerant and full of contradictions. With the riots recently the media are obsessed with punishment as solution, but no-one has the intelligence to ask why the people did what they did. We live in very dumbed-down times. Everything - news media, music, music magazines - are presented with the assumption that the people as a whole are utterly thick, so therefore when I say, as I have, that the so-called royals are the most dysfunctional and unpleasant family in British history, no-one asks me why I think this. They simply print ‘Bigmouth Strikes Again’. Oh, I could go on. And do, often.
I encourage anyone who thinks Morrissey is an angry old man to go back and review the rest of his public comments from the last year or two. Yes, there are the scathing attacks on royalty, the record industry, the Beckhams, and all the rest, but there are just as many, if not more, expressions of thanks, happiness, surprise, delight, curiosity, high spirits, and-- oh yeah-- love.
And in this time of reduced media visibility and no record label, what's the image of Morrissey we've seen most often? The one our incredibly uptight, dour, mad-as-hell curmudgeon has chosen to put out in the world? Right, this one:
Amy
from the Ice Age to the dole age
Just in case True To You is blocked by your ISP, here are a random sampling of comments. Outside of his withering attacks on royalty, animal cruelty, Assad, and other things he hates-- and has hated and railed against in public for nearly 30 years-- almost all of his other comments are in the tone of the following:
August...
"The rich experience of our recent tour of Italy, Turkey, Israel and Greece has thankfully matched the terrific responses we had received in Asia and South America earlier this year - a year that, to my amazement, has become the most successful of my touring life. How, exactly? And why? Once again, all I can offer is the sore throat of thanks to everyone who bought tickets and who supported us along the way."
I just might die with a smile on my face, after all.
undiminished, with a heart that longs for light
June...
I express my very sincere thanks to all of you who attended our shows of April and May - all of which were fantastic, and often beyond belief. My gratitude, I realize, could never be enough.
I have never in my life experienced a crowd such as that of Jakarta, who sang each song so loudly that their voices caught all of the onstage microphones and warped the sound into a mad bellow of love. Later, backstage, we were numbed by the joy that Jakarta had given us.
I fell in love anew with Japan.
Meanwhile, somewhere else, far away from tabloid Britain, the moon retains its friendly silence, and the world is all before you.
In reverent spirit, keenly alive
March...
Thank you for an incredible tour of South America. It has been the best tour of my life. Nothing I had previously experienced prepared me for the love shown to me by the people of Chile, Peru, Brazil, Colombia and Argentina. The excitement of the Brazilian audiences was almost heart-stopping. After all these years, to still be a part of people's hope is astounding to me. It's one thing to be valued, but to be loved is an entirely different experience.
Thanks also to the police in Peru, Brazil and Colombia who escorted me around (as custodians, I should add.) I am grateful.
My love for the band goes through the roof. All we have is yours.
December 2011...
(After Mexico) I am anchored, delighted, and pale with gratitude. ... The audiences were the most loving (and loud) that I have ever experienced.
I am very grateful to our new agency, William Morris Endeavor, for their astounding efforts to make this recent tour so enjoyable and triumphant. No management, no label, no promotion … all that we have are fantastic ticket sales. Which means you. And there is no greater thing worth having.
I have the most magnificent live crew on the planet. If I said my thanks forever it would not be long enough.
And his professional status, as a singer without a label? This, from a June Interview...
There was a seven-year hiatus between Maladjusted (1997) and You Are the Quarry (2004). Why was that?
It happened because of what’s happening to me right now – no interest from any record label. There is nothing I can do about it, and I no longer worry about it. I don’t have management or any form of publicist, so this troubadour existence is too challenging for labels, I suppose. Whatever will be, will be.
Best tours ever...reverent spirit, keenly alive...grateful to audiences...numb with joy..."I no longer worry about" not having a record label, "whatever will be, will be"...
Boy, what a f***ing grouch!
As usual, Morrissey has the clearest view of the landscape. In an October 2011 interview Morrissey summed up the matter very succinctly:
Ryan: Some of your comments in the media have been top drawer as of late. Some newspapers have taken issue with some of your comments.
Morrissey: Well, they always do... They MUST!
Ryan: We found you to be quite the gentlemen. Have you been misunderstood in any of your statements?
Morrissey: I think I am officially ‘Mad Morrissey’ now, and everything I say must be ridiculed because that’s one way of NOT dealing with the contents of the actual comment. The Guardian is now like the Sun was in the 1970s: completely intolerant and full of contradictions. With the riots recently the media are obsessed with punishment as solution, but no-one has the intelligence to ask why the people did what they did. We live in very dumbed-down times. Everything - news media, music, music magazines - are presented with the assumption that the people as a whole are utterly thick, so therefore when I say, as I have, that the so-called royals are the most dysfunctional and unpleasant family in British history, no-one asks me why I think this. They simply print ‘Bigmouth Strikes Again’. Oh, I could go on. And do, often.
I encourage anyone who thinks Morrissey is an angry old man to go back and review the rest of his public comments from the last year or two. Yes, there are the scathing attacks on royalty, the record industry, the Beckhams, and all the rest, but there are just as many, if not more, expressions of thanks, happiness, surprise, delight, curiosity, high spirits, and-- oh yeah-- love.
And in this time of reduced media visibility and no record label, what's the image of Morrissey we've seen most often? The one our incredibly uptight, dour, mad-as-hell curmudgeon has chosen to put out in the world? Right, this one:
Almost everything you quoted to demonstrate his happiness relates to his touring. Their essential essence is "Thanks for loving me, everybody!". Who in their right mind would be miserable when they're playing sold-out shows in distant corners of the world, on stage every night facing nothing but love and adoration from the masses? As Skinny said earlier, fandom is a cloistered environment and so is touring. It is when the real world intrudes that Morrissey can't hack it, and that's when his morose whining makes a reappearance. He absolutely loves being "Mad Morrissey"; he plays up to it and always has done.
Worm
Taste the diffidence
Willful blindness on your part. Touring is the real world for a professional musician. Without a record deal, touring is his entire life, professionally and personally. It's not a small, sideline project. He has devoted an entire year-plus of hard work to traveling the world, playing to audiences. At every stop he has sent fans messages of thanks and reassurance that he is staging the most rewarding concerts of his life. That is "real life". That is everything he should be doing as a performer. And he is "keenly alive", "in reverent spirit", "undiminished", and absolutely overflowing with gratitude for his fans.
Yet you persist in twisting these grateful, vibrant, and joyous sentiments into utterances of selfishness?
There is nothing he could say which you would not re-interpret to suit your caricature of him.
In any case, you've admitted Morrissey isn't miserable, so in essence we agree.
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joe frady
Vile Refusenik
"I would prefer not to" ~ to do so would necessitate a re-viewing of numerous recent morrissey-solo stories in an act tantamount to wading through a sewer. Apologies though, "loathe" is over-egging it a bit; "thinks Morrissey is rubbish" is maybe closer to the mark. It would be far more pleasant and quicker if you just answered the simple question 'Do you think Morrissey in 2012 is rubbish?' (Our next thrilling poll perhaps?) And if yes, would you at least admit that that is a somewhat curious position to be in as moderator on a 'fan site'? And might you further agree that it might have an effect, even subconsciously, on that moderation?
Amy
from the Ice Age to the dole age
I'm not re-interpreting anything, I'm trying to contextualise it. My point is this: Morrissey is not onstage every minute of the day. He cannot expect to live and work 24/7 in an environment where he is solely surrounded by gushing fans, lackeys and associates, that is utterly delusional. When the tour ends, and Morrissey goes home or goes back to the recording studio or to Sainsbury's or wherever, back to his everyday life- he expects everybody to continue treating him like those fans in the front row; to hang on his every word and never to question his increasingly ludicrous outbursts. He cannot deal with criticism. He would rather just say that his detractors "don't get it" and invent conspiracy theories that everyone is out to get him and the world is a horrible, horrible place. He lives in a bubble of egotism that he created with his own hands, fed by fans like you who defend his every move to the death unquestioningly. Of course he loves you - blind adoration is an easy pill to swallow. But the world offstage is not composed of rabid, diehard Morrissey fans, and that's what he has never learned to accept.
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Worm
Taste the diffidence
A bubble of egotism? While it's clear he lives in his own mental world, and always has, I'm honestly taken aback by the way you've fabricated an entire image of Morrissey based on scant or no evidence. As Iona asked, how do you know? There is ample, clear evidence that Morrissey gets along in the "real world" just fine.
And once again I face the charge of "defend[ing] his every move to the death unquestioningly" merely for showing objectivity and fair-mindedness. I said he wasn't a miserable old man, and you respond by saying "Yes, he's not miserable, he's happy-- because he's delusional". Huh?
Everything belongs to one extreme category or another with you: Morrissey is a caricature, his fans are all cultists. It's pretty sad, but I find your attitude pervasive here these days. People are exhausted and have no more good will to show him.
Perhaps it's not such a mystery, considering the majority of his most vocal ill-wishers happen to be English.
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Amy
from the Ice Age to the dole age
It it blatantly obvious and grows moreso with each passing day. Have you seen how he deals with his detractors? The withering disdain he displays towards anybody who dares to criticise him - in the Press, onstage, in Court, in writing and in interviews, over the past 25 years? He's got a full-blown persecution complex and an ego bigger than God. Pete Paphides had him wrapped up this time last year discussing the Argentina comments - "when he opens his mouth these days, the scale of his delusions is embarrassing". It really, really is.
Amy
from the Ice Age to the dole age
I can't speak for anyone else, but I thought that was a pretty good summary, Worm. Morrissey has worn me and countless others down with his constant, never-ending ranting and sniping. What does he have left to give? From my perspective, he has hoovered up the goodwill of his most passionate fans (which was tremendous once upon a time, even from me), drained it and drained it until almost nothing is left. Morrissey has a love/hate relationship with England and with English fans - one minute we're wonderful and the next we're a bunch of sheep, blindly trailing in the footsteps of the Establishment. He's been kicking his home crowd in the nads for years. Perhaps, after years of having every aspect of our society (and I'm not talking about the Royals!) torn to shreds by an ex-pat in an ivory tower in LA, we're starting to feel the same way about him?
I don't think he's rubbish. I think he's said some daft things, but I don't think he's rubbish. All I've done (I think) is say that he's said some daft things, with intent. In my opinion. And do you really think being a moderator should colour my own opinions? I don't . I say what I think, regardless, and that's the way it should be. Moderation has no effect on my opinions, and shouldn't.
P.
What is wrong to discuss / post a poll thread about Morrissey's behaviour?
As Uncleskinny replied you earlier, I also don't think he's rubbish.
Pity you interpret the thread as such.
It is nothing to do with being a moderator, all the moderators are equal to other users, able to discuss things freely in here.
Vicarinacoma
New Member
Another side to all of this vis-a-vis what I think about what Morrissey thinks is that I don't actually agree with him on some of his major causes. I'm not a vegetarian and have in fact just had part of a dead cow minced with some potates and veg...deal with it Morrissey! In fact I hate his animal rights thing. In fact all of the big things he gets into trouble for like making statements about what being British is or w/e don't mean anything to me. I'm just not interested. Neiither am I too enamoured with lyrics like those in Paris which are bewilderingly unobjective. He's in a position to find love but if we take those lyrics litterally he thinks he's still...still...still bloody 'unloveable'!! I'm O.K by myself is a big bugbear with me too. I'm not bloody o.k by myself in fact I hate it so hate that song because it's so utterly diametric to how I think. I could got on 'cause there's hardlly any lyrics by any acts I really belive in or agree with or relate to which frustrates me but I've learnt to just not take them too seriously and I don't take his spoken pronouncement seriously either. These pop stars, their fans and perhaps most of all their 'critics' need to remember it's just pop music.
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