Conservatives & Morrissey Fans

It was John Maynard Keynes who said that markets can stay wrong longer than you can stay solvent.

Another economist Armen Alchien concluded that in the Western economy, host as it is to an enormous number of people and companies competing, success is more about “the result of fortuitous circumstances”, or luck, rather than any sign of skill or intelligence.

Daniel Kahneman and Vernon Smith won the Nobel Prize in 2002 for establishing that: - Traditionally, economic theory has relied on the assumption of a "homo œconomicus", whose behavior is governed by self-interest and who is capable of rational decision-making. Economics has also been regarded as a non-experimental science, where researchers – as in astronomy or meteorology – have had to rely exclusively on field data, that is, direct observations of the real world. During the last two decades, however, these views have undergone a transformation. Controlled laboratory experiments have emerged as a vital component of economic research and, in certain instances, experimental results have shown that basic postulates in economic theory should be modified [to take account of people’s common irrational behaviour]. This process has been generated by researchers in two areas: cognitive psychologists who have studied human judgment and decision-making, and experimental economists who have tested economic models in the laboratory. – see more at http://nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/economics/laureates/2002/public.html

Judge Richard Posner, in his book “Law, Pragmatism and Democracy”, claims that: “…reasoning about the most effective means to a given end – instrumental reasoning, the type involved in self-interested action – is a good deal more straightforward than reasoning about ends, the type of reasoning required for determining what is best for society as a whole”.

R.H. Tawney is often quoted from his book “Religion and the Rise of Capitalism” for writing “If, however, economic ambitions are good servants, they are bad masters”. Then he added, “The most obvious facts are the most easily forgotten. Both the existing economic order and too many of the projects advanced for reconstructing it break down through their neglect of the truism that, since even quite common men have souls, no increase in material wealth will compensate for arrangements which insult their self-respect and impair their freedom. A reasonable estimate of economic organization must allow for the fact that, unless industry is to be paralysed by recurrant revolts on the part of outraged human nature, it must satisfy criteria which are not purely economic”.

Like Jello Biafra put it, “for every prohibition you create you also create an underground”.

J.K. Galbraith, Harvard economics Professor, recently wrote that, “… reality is more obscured by social or habitual preferences and personal or group pecuniary advantage in economics and politics that in any other subject”.

That reminds me a bit of Morrissey’s reply to Jonathan Ross when asked who he would vote for; that he would not vote for anyone because like most other people, he had no faith in the social power systems on offer around him. “I've been dreaming of a time when The English are sick to death of Labour, And Tories…”

Galbraith placed much of the blame for this on what became the title of a booklet he wrote in 2004, “The Economics of Innocent Fraud”. Explaining what he meant by this he went on: “Some of this fraud derives from traditional economics and its teachings and some from the ritual views of economic life. These can strongly support individual and group interest, particularly, as might be expected, that of the more fortunate, articulate and politically prominent in the community, and can achieve the respectability and authority of everyday knowledge. “ Gosh, haven’t we just found out that this kind of deception is called ‘kumo-ing?!

Anyway, he ends the booklet by summarizing: “Civilisation has made great strides over the centuries in science, healthcare, the arts, and most, if not all, economic well-being. But also it has given a priviledged position to the development of weapons and to the threat and reality of war. Mass slaughter has become the ultimate civilized achievement.

The facts of war are inescapable – death and random cruelty, suspension of civilized values, a disordered aftermath. Thus: the human condition and prospect as now supremely evident [mass poverty and starvation…] War remains the decisive human failure”.

At least with these voices, there might not be the need to complain, like Herbert Hoover did, to “please find me a one-armed economist so we will not always hear, “ but on the other hand”’…

“An economist’s guess is as good as anyone else’s” , concluded Will Rogers, who might have elaborated if someone had asked, that a study of economics usually reveals that the best time to buy anything was last year!
 
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It was John Maynard Keynes who said that markets can stay wrong longer than you can stay solvent.

The final nail in the coffin of Keynesian economics happend during the 70s staflation. Which no Keynesian could explain. Keynes stayed wrong on just about everything...

Another economist Armen Alchien concluded that in the Western economy, host as it is to an enormous number of people and companies competing, success is more about “the result of fortuitous circumstances”, or luck, rather than any sign of skill or intelligence.

Oh luck may be a factor from time to time, the West is far too luckly too often to make this a valid axim.

Hernando De Soto, actually did a lot more work on the subject and based his work on quantifiably empirical evidence... check it out...
http://www.amazon.com/Mystery-Capit...0092119?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1175368811&sr=8-1

Like Jello Biafra put it, “for every prohibition you create you also create an underground”.

As for my very good friend, yet oh so often wrong friend, Eric... see attached photos.

Photo 1 - Left to Right 1. Your Humble Kumo, 2. JB, 3. anonymous, 4. Craig Zaich. Taken in Dublin Ireland 10/28/98

Photo 2 - 1. Left of JB, Andy Dick, 2. Right of JB Your Humble Kumo, 3. Right of Kumo Kerri Rifkin. Taken in after dinner in Santa Barbara 11/6/99

“I've been dreaming of a time when The English are sick to death of Labour, And Tories…”

Considering the Conservatives have the oldest and most sucessful party in the UK, I don't see that happening anytime soon. However, if the education system in the UK continues to degrade at it's current rate, it will indeed happen eventually.

Gosh, haven’t we just found out that this kind of deception is called ‘kumo-ing?!

Yawn, Kumo is the word for Spider in Nihongo, Kewpie help me out here so we can put this bullshit to bed... goinghome = chotto baka sayoku

At least with these voices, there might not be the need to complain, like Herbert Hoover did, to “please find me a one-armed economist so we will not always hear, “ but on the other hand”’…
“An economist’s guess is as good as anyone else’s” , concluded Will Rogers, who might have elaborated if someone had asked, that a study of economics usually reveals that the best time to buy anything was last year!

again you argue points that are pre-Friedman based. It's the same fallicy as trying discredit the science of biology by quoting Aristotle's theories on Spontaneous Generation. Please get up to date, don't be like the pope waving his finger at Galileo for using that pesky telescope. Get out of Plato's cave and come and enjoy the sunlight!

Kumo
 
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Here is a photo for Morrissey's most beloved Uyoku Japanese friends...

Cheers,

Kumo

I just can't believe my eyes...it's the ugliest T-shirt Morrissey ever worn.
I hope he didn't know the meaning of the words. :(
 
I just can't believe my eyes...it's the ugliest T-shirt Morrissey ever worn.
I hope he didn't know the meaning of the words. :(

It was obviously photoshoped... I am sure his anti-royalism extends to the Imperial Family of Japan.

Kinda sad though... he should give them a break, you cannot help the family you were born into...

I would wear a T-Shirt like that in Japan as a joke...

However, I do have great respect for Emperor Meiji. If it wasn't for Meiji we would not have Nintendo today!

Kumo
 
Kumo wrote: “again you argue points that are pre-Friedman based.”

Your man Friedman may have had more leverage than he dreamed possible, advocating as he did the shrinking of government power to make way for the free market, paving the way for GATT, WTO, and so on. As a consequence, Kumo, maybe your original question of whether the political views, which are really humanistic stances, of Morrissey, irritate fans of a Conservative leaning, is null and void, since the new world of globalization has tended to homogenize the economic plans of political parties? If anything, however, the ideas of Galbraith, and Kehnemann and Smith, are more at the cutting edge now than those of your idol. And with the very definite exponential awareness of ecological issues being embraced by politicians everywhere, some previously dismissed approaches may now be exhumed for a fair trial. You and your kind’s ideas will work better for the rich because of the chosen value system which is to prioritise accumulation rather than ensuring access to at least enough for all. I work with people like you who can be impressively efficient and personable, but when tested, the heart is no more than a hydrolic pump.

Though published in 1973 and long since gone out of fashion, denounced as primitive, one of my favourite books remains “Small is Beautiful: Economics as If People Mattered” by E.F. Schumacher. Because the author seems to report with eyes wide open conditions of living as observed rather than represented in a hypothesis, and then addresses these in the context of economics but with common sense, he doesn’t baulk at the task of reconciling the governing with the individual good.

Here’s an extract on p. 20-21: “The substance of man cannot be measured by Gross National Product. Perhaps it cannot be measured at all, except by certain symptoms of loss…crime, drug addiction, vandalism, mental breakdown, rebellion…statistics never prove anything. .. one of the most fateful errors of our age is the belief that the problems of production have been solved. This illusion… is mainly due to our inability to recognize that the modern industrial system, with all its intellectual sophistication, consumes the very basis on which it has been erected. To use the language of the economist, it lives on irreplaceable capital which it cheerfully treats as income. I specifed three categories of such capital: fossil fuels, the tolerance margin of nature and the human substance…any…suffices to make my case.

And what is my case? Simply that our most important task is to get off our current collision course. And who is there to tackle such a task? I think every one of us, whether old or young, powerful or powerless, rich or poor, influential or uninfluential. To talk about the future is useful only if it leads to action now. [how soon is now?!] And what can we do now while we are in the position of “never having had it so good”? To say the least – which is already very much – we must thoroughtly understand the problem and begin to see the possibility of evolving a new life-style, with new methods of production and new patterns of consumption; a lifestyle designed for permanence. To give only three preliminary examples: in agriculture and horticulture, we can interest ourselves in the perfection of production methods which are biologically sound, build up soil fertility [lots of worms!!] and produce health, beauty and permanence. Productivity will then look after itself. In industry, we can interest ourselves in the evolution of small-scale technology, relatively non-violent technology, “technology with a human face”, so that people have a chance to enjoy themselves while they are working, instead of working solely for their pay pocket and hoping, usually forlornly, for enjoyment solely during their leisure time [heaven knows I’m miserable now!!] In industry, again – and surely, industry is the pace-setter of modern life – we can interest ourselves in new forms of partnership between management and men, even forms of common ownership”.

I mean, how enlightened is this, and how probably more pressing now than ever before?!

How many economists does it take to change a light-bulb?
Eight – one to screw it in, and seven to hold everything else constant – which is of course a wish rather than an attainable strategy.

Before you call Schumacher for being ossified in Plato’s cave with the rest of us, you will of course know that the 2006 Nobel Prize went to an economist for promoting some of his recommendations:

- With the announcement of the Nobel Peace Prize to Muhammad Yunus and the Grameen Bank, it appears that everyone has reason to celebrate. There is wide agreement that Yunus is fully deserving of the highest recognition: he launched the idea of ‘microcredit’, or the grant of very small loans to the destitute who are incapable of offering any collateral. This is a far-reaching idea, since loans are generally given by banks against collateral or assets, and the poor have traditionally been excluded precisely because of their inability to offer any surety. The Grameen Bank that Yunus founded over three decades ago has so far given out 6.6 million loans, averaging around $130 each, and it claims from its borrowers, who are overwhelmingly women, an astounding repayment rate of 98 percent. The Nobel Prize citation states, in justification of the award to Yunus, that ‘economic growth and political democracy cannot achieve their full potential unless the female half of humanity participates on an equal footing with the male', and evidently Yunus has done much more than most others to empower women. –
- From http://www.sscnet.ucla.edu/southasia/History/Current_Affairs/Yunus.htm

Thanks for the interesting photos, kumo, and for the Japanese translation (I think!) of my user-name. Have mercy on those poor flies ending up in your web that may have expectations of you in your position of largesse! That way you will not disappoint those of your peers whose interpretation of economic theory is somewhat more grounded in ‘the things that kill me’!

Hi and thanks, to LeftOut!
 
It was obviously photoshoped... I am sure his anti-royalism extends to the Imperial Family of Japan.

Kinda sad though... he should give them a break, you cannot help the family you were born into...

I would wear a T-Shirt like that in Japan as a joke...

However, I do have great respect for Emperor Meiji. If it wasn't for Meiji we would not have Nintendo today!

Kumo


It must be photoshoped!!

It's a statement of supporting monachy and racism, totally unacceptable anywhere in the world!!!!! :mad:

You must be crazy to praise Emperor Meiji because he was just a figurehead.
Some cunning politicians exploited the monachy as always.
 
It must be photoshoped!!

It's a statement of supporting monachy and racism, totally unacceptable anywhere in the world!!!!! :mad:

You must be crazy to praise Emperor Meiji because he was just a figurehead.
Some cunning politicians exploited the monachy as always.

I know what it says... Respect the Emperor - Expel the Foreign Barbarians
I wouldn't say that was racist, just trying to perserve the culture...
Correct me if I am wrong, Don't you have similar feelings about the Yamato and Americans?

Meiji was a true visionary. Besides the economic growth, rapid modernization, and all the other wonderful things he spear headed. He ended the Tokugawa ban on Hanafuda cards. Which created a business oppertunity for Fusajiro Yamauchi near the end of 1889. He started a little Hanafuda card shop called Marufuku, later renamed it to Nintendo and the rest is history. You have to love Meiji for if there were no Meiji we would have no Mario!

"because he was just a figurehead.Some cunning politicians exploited the monachy"

However, I do agree with your statement if applied to Emperor Showa.

Kumo...
 
I have no intention to argue with you about the history of Japan.
Carry on showing off whatever you like.
 
I have no intention to argue with you about the history of Japan.
Carry on showing off whatever you like.

I wasn't arguing... No intent to offend, If anything I was trying to learn something...
It's all so delicious...

Your humble Kumo...
 
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I just can't believe what Kumo wrote about goinghome!

Kumo, don't slagging off someone disagrees with your opinion.
You're really a sad show-off to use Japanese in order to offend someone who doesn't understand the language.
 
I just can't believe what Kumo wrote about goinghome!

Kumo, don't slagging off someone disagrees with your opinion.
You're really a sad show-off to use Japanese in order to offend someone who doesn't understand the language.

No re-read the post, he continued to taunt me based on some BBC website about some other Kumo that means to propagate a lie. I have already explaned what my name means several times. Yet he continued to play childish games...

You are right, I shouldn't have said Chotto Baka, he is definantly Obaka from his most recent post.

Anyway I am sorry you were offended, that was not my intent at all...
hope you are enjoying your weekend...
:)

Your humble Kumo...
 
f***ing hell that photo is like a cross between Tory Boy and Rent Boy. You don't even look old enough to have finished potty training!!! And your clothes!


Oh ha ha ha ha. Like Morrissey is going to get into a car with someone dressed like that!!!


DO YOURSELF A FAVOUR BE A LIQUOR SAVER
 
f***ing hell that photo is like a cross between Tory Boy and Rent Boy. You don't even look old enough to have finished potty training!!! And your clothes!


Oh ha ha ha ha. Like Morrissey is going to get into a car with someone dressed like that!!!


DO YOURSELF A FAVOUR BE A LIQUOR SAVER

I think I look more like a rentboy in the attached photo with Adam Ant. My heart is all tory.

Kumo
 
Here is a photo for Morrissey's most beloved Uyoku Japanese friends...

Cheers,

Kumo

I just can't believe my eyes...it's the ugliest T-shirt Morrissey ever worn.
I hope he didn't know the meaning of the words. :(

yes it's photoshopped.


here's the original picture of morrissey and the 'jon stewart for president' tshirt.

mozjon.jpg


edit: I DON'T KNOW IF YOU PHOTOSHOPED THE PICTURE YOURSELF KUMO, OR FOUND IT, BUT I SUGGEST TAKING IT DOWN BEFORE PEOPLE COPY IT AND IT SPREADS. IF IT ENDORSES RACISM, TAKE IT DOWN. KEWPIE WAS FOOLED AND THE PHOTOSHOP JOB WAS NOT ALL THAT BAD...SO IT MAY FOOL OTHERS.
 
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yes it's photoshopped.


other pictures kumo posted also looked photoshoped.

here's the original picture of morrissey and the 'jon stewart for president' tshirt.

mozjon.jpg

Get a clue, I was the first to point out it was photoshoped I found it on the net...

My celeb photos are obviously not photoshoped, why do you love to bate people, argh...

anyway... you got a high rez version?

Kumo
 
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