Break up the family

ALLIE WALLS

Junior Member
I always thought this song was harking back to his youth as were other songs on Viva Hate but i wonder if it really refers to the break up of the Smiths ? am i slow to get it ? what do others think ?
 

bhops

Last of the famous international screw ups.
I always thought this song was harking back to his youth as were other songs on Viva Hate but i wonder if it really refers to the break up of the Smiths ? am i slow to get it ? what do others think ?
It kind of can be read both ways, but the line about school sports makes me think it is more of a pre-Smiths vibe. Might be in my top 5 Moz Solo tracks. It’s a beauty.
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><>
I always thought this song was harking back to his youth as were other songs on Viva Hate but i wonder if it really refers to the break up of the Smiths ? am i slow to get it ? what do others think ?

Oh please let’s not go there again. People will think what they want =:crazy:


But the truth of the matter is ...

“In an interview published in Melody Maker in 1988, Morrissey said "The song 'Break Up The Family' is strongly linked with 'Suedehead' and 'Maudlin Street', that whole period in 1972, when I was 12, 13. 'Break Up' is about a string of friends I had who were very intense people and at that age, when your friends talk about the slim separation between life and death - and you set that against the fact that this period of your youth is supposed to be the most playful and reckless - well, if you utilised that period in a very intense way, well, that feeling never really leaves you. (...) The family in the song is the circle of friends, where it almost seemed, because we were so identical, that for anybody to make any progress in life, we'd have to split up. Because there was no strength in our unity. And that's what happened, we did all go our separate ways, and quite naturally came to no good. I saw one of them quite recently, and it was a very headscratching experience."

:hammer::hammer::hammer:


 

ALLIE WALLS

Junior Member
Why not go there again ? its better than the shit that's posted recently. Dont you think ? thanks for the references btw but i dont believe that it has nothing to do with the breakup.
 

bhops

Last of the famous international screw ups.
I always thought this song was harking back to his youth as were other songs on Viva Hate but i wonder if it really refers to the break up of the Smiths ? am i slow to get it ? what do others think ?
It kind of can be read both ways, but the line about school sports makes me think it is more of a pre-Smiths vibe. Might be in my top 5 Moz Solo tracks. It’s a beauty.
 

Ketamine Sun

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Why not go there again ? its better than the shit that's posted recently. Dont you think ? thanks for the references btw but i dont believe that it has nothing to do with the breakup.
Lol! Take it easy buddy.There will
be others that believe the same way you do, don’t worry you’re safe.
 

GirlAfraidWillNeverLearn

Nobody's Nothing
https://www.morrissey-solo.com/wiki/Category:Morrissey_Lyrics

You’ve missed some. The above link is a complete list of Moz-solo songs alphabetically.
If this is referring to the Morrissey A-Z, I posted a list in the Alma Matters thread yesterday.

I'm aware of this list, which includes unreleased songs that haven't surfaced yet. I'd be happy to discuss I Know Who I Love or I Don't Want Us To Finish on here, but someone would have to provide us with a recording of them first. 😉



As for Break Up The Family - fantastic song and I think it could be a bit of both, most songs on Viva Hate seem to be influenced both by his youth and the break up.
I always thought that a lot of the songs give the impression of timelessness because it seems like past and present melt into each other and become one big stream of emotion and in the end one can't tell anymore which memory is which - certainly a result of the special stream of consciousness type of technique he used for the lyrics here.

I know Morrissey has said otherwise in this case, but the break up was clearly (and understandably) a driving force in the development of Viva Hate. He tends to overplay certain things if he doesn't want to talk about them and personally I'd always take anything he says about the meaning of lyrics with a grain of salt.
 
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BookishBoy

Well-Known Member
If we stick to doing one song a day in the A-Z, then "Break Up the Family" will be on Feb 6. Life doesn't get much more exciting than this!!
 

Amy

from the Ice Age to the dole age
I always thought this song was harking back to his youth as were other songs on Viva Hate but i wonder if it really refers to the break up of the Smiths ? am i slow to get it ? what do others think ?
I think it's both. When you suffer losses, it's natural to look back on your life and wonder if a 'pattern' is forming - you mull over previous failures and problems and what you might have done differently, like he does in Friday Mourning. This part:

The strange logic in your clumsiest line
(It stayed, it stayed) it stayed emblazoned on my mind
You say, break up the family
And let's begin to live our lives


does sound like the death knoll of the Smiths (and remember, one of their suggested names had been The Smiths Family.). Then - blindsided by that - I think Moz starts reflecting on the childhood friends that he hasn't seen in ages because he moved away, 'made it' and had success.

I want to see all my friends tonight
It wasn't Youth, it wasn't Life
Born Old, sadly wise
Resigned (well, we were)
To ending our lives


It's a great song. I always wondered if - "Yes, you found love but you weren't at peace with your life..." was a dig at Johnny.
 
C

carlislebaz

Guest
If this is referring to the Morrissey A-Z, I posted a list in the Alma Matters thread yesterday.

I'm aware of this list, which includes unreleased songs that haven't surfaced yet. I'd be happy to discuss I Know Who I Love or I Don't Want Us To Finish on here, but someone would have to provide us with a recording of them first. 😉



As for Break Up The Family - fantastic song and I think it could be a bit of both, most songs on Viva Hate seem to be influenced both by his youth and the break up.
I always thought that a lot of the songs give the impression of timelessness because it seems like past and present melt into each other and become one big stream of emotion and in the end one can't tell anymore which memory is which - certainly a result of the special stream of consciousness type of technique he used for the lyrics here.

I know Morrissey has said otherwise in this case, but the break up was clearly (and understandably) a driving force in the development of Viva Hate. He tends to overplay certain things if he doesn't want to talk about them and personally I'd always take anything he says about the meaning of lyrics with a grain of salt.
From what I can remember... didn’t Moz want “ a long rambling song “
That went on, and on ???
 
C

carlislebaz

Guest
It's been a nightmare. I've sometimes felt so forlorn because I've not been able to tell people how anxious I am to be around them and how guilty I feel for not fitting in. I'd love to be like everyone else. That would be my idea of heaven
Stall the bullshit dale.....
same olde post , just another day ..
Try to publish your amateur dramatics in tit-bits,
Or readers digest....
Or Jackie..... Mandy...
My little pony....
Come on Dale ...
this isn’t the Samaritans
For reparative stammers
Very needy and greedy .
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><>
If this is referring to the Morrissey A-Z, I posted a list in the Alma Matters thread yesterday.

I'm aware of this list, which includes unreleased songs that haven't surfaced yet. I'd be happy to discuss I Know Who I Love or I Don't Want Us To Finish on here, but someone would have to provide us with a recording of them first. 😉



As for Break Up The Family - fantastic song and I think it could be a bit of both, most songs on Viva Hate seem to be influenced both by his youth and the break up.
I always thought that a lot of the songs give the impression of timelessness because it seems like past and present melt into each other and become one big stream of emotion and in the end one can't tell anymore which memory is which - certainly a result of the special stream of consciousness type of technique he used for the lyrics here.

I know Morrissey has said otherwise in this case, but the break up was clearly (and understandably) a driving force in the development of Viva Hate. He tends to overplay certain things if he doesn't want to talk about them and personally I'd always take anything he says about the meaning of lyrics with a grain of salt.
:thumb:

And yet ... If Morrissey admits that ‘Angel, Angel..’ (quote below) he had Marr in mind, I can’t see him hiding the true meaning of other songs on Viva Hate. I’m not saying that the breakup didn’t have any influence on his mood or state of mind, that would be silly. Anyway.

“In an interview published in 1992 (source needed), Morrissey said: "It was written with Johnny Marr in mind and it is the only song that I have written with him in mind, post Smiths. I saw him in the music industry being used and being pushed around and being manipulated and I felt I was in a situation and I thought, 'Look at me, look at you - it's the same, it's a mess and this is as far as we will go' which wasn't quite true in the end but at that moment it felt pretty despairing for both, I felt despairing for both of us but I was wrong."

Who knows, ‘Breakup’ could have been written before and intended as a Smiths song.

For me a lot of Viva Hate is about his youth or experiences from that time that shaped him to see the world the way he did, so much so, that he would call a album ‘Viva Hate’.
 

GirlAfraidWillNeverLearn

Nobody's Nothing
:thumb:

And yet ... If Morrissey admits that ‘Angel, Angel..’ (quote below) he had Marr in mind, I can’t see him hiding the true meaning of other songs on Viva Hate. I’m not saying that the breakup didn’t have any influence on his mood or state of mind, that would be silly. Anyway.

“In an interview published in 1992 (source needed), Morrissey said: "It was written with Johnny Marr in mind and it is the only song that I have written with him in mind, post Smiths. I saw him in the music industry being used and being pushed around and being manipulated and I felt I was in a situation and I thought, 'Look at me, look at you - it's the same, it's a mess and this is as far as we will go' which wasn't quite true in the end but at that moment it felt pretty despairing for both, I felt despairing for both of us but I was wrong."

Who knows, ‘Breakup’ could have been written before and intended as a Smiths song.

For me a lot of Viva Hate is about his youth or experiences from that time that shaped him to see the world the way he did, so much so, that he would call a album ‘Viva Hate’.
I'm very aware of the supposed meaning of "Angel, Angel...", and this particular quote has always puzzled me,

BUT:

The only source I found for this was a citation in a Mojo article from 2002.
I think I've read all the interviews that article quotes from, but unfortunately I still haven't found the original source referring to "Angel, Angel", because it seems neither of the cited interviews mentions it.

(Happy to be wrong, if anyone could point me towards the actual source...)

So, in conclusion, I'm not quite sure what to make of that statement, if it's real etc.

Irrespective of the above, I stand by my point. I find it very hard to believe, that a song recorded immediately after the break-up, named after a break-up, had no connection to said break-up at all.
 
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Ketamine Sun

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Irrespective of the above, I stand by my point. I find it very hard to believe, that a song recorded immediately after the break-up, named after a break-up, had no connection to said break-up at all.

Yes it’s the easiest, obvious and most sensible position to take, which is maybe why I refuse to take it. :lbf:
It’s interesting to imagine and not too difficult to believe that the song and its title were or may have been written before the split, but didn’t fit any of the Marr instrumentals given to him at the time.

Also I prefer the subject matter to be about that teenage experience
which for me opens the song up a wider scope and of course more relatable to me, since I wasn’t in The Smiths I can’t really relate to that particular split.
 
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GirlAfraidWillNeverLearn

Nobody's Nothing
Yes it’s the easiest, obvious and most sensible position to take, which is maybe why I refuse to take it. :lbf:
It’s interesting to imagine and not to difficult to believe that the song and its title were or may have been written before the split, but didn’t fit any of the Marr instrumentals given to him at the time.

Also I prefer the subject matter to be about that teenage experience
which for me opens the song up a wider scope and of course more relatable to me, since I wasn’t in The Smiths I can’t really relate to that particular split.
Well, I'm not saying it's not about the teenage experience. As mentioned before I think this song, like most of Viva Hate, was influenced by his past - recent, distant and both.
 

Amy

from the Ice Age to the dole age
:thumb:

And yet ... If Morrissey admits that ‘Angel, Angel..’ (quote below) he had Marr in mind, I can’t see him hiding the true meaning of other songs on Viva Hate.
I can easily see M wanting to veil the meaning of certain songs, it's what he does. I think he was angry and emotional when he wrote it and time dilutes those emotions, he probably felt differently later on. The sentiment in those songs ranges from "I love you / I'll be here when everyone else has ruined you" ('Angel') to "Bye then, idiot, see if I care." (I Don't Mind...). He never lists VH among his preferred albums (despite the success) and I can't help thinking that it must be for personal reasons.
 

Ketamine Sun

<><><><><><><>
I can easily see M wanting to veil the meaning of certain songs, it's what he does. I think he was angry and emotional when he wrote it and time dilutes those emotions, he probably felt differently later on. The sentiment in those songs ranges from "I love you / I'll be here when everyone else has ruined you" ('Angel') to "Bye then, idiot, see if I care." (I Don't Mind...). He never lists VH among his preferred albums (despite the success) and I can't help thinking that it must be for personal reasons.

Definitely for personal reasons. Would be great to know how much of each song was written before the split.
 

Ketamine Sun

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From my recollection, there wasn’t much left in the smiths tank RE “ lost, unreleased tracks”

Yes, but that’s not what I’m saying.

I’m saying it would be interesting to know how much of the lyrics that ended up on Viva Hate were actually written before the Smiths split.

I’m thinking quite a lot of it was.
 
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