Are fan opinions of YoR more divided than any Moz album yet?

Are fan opinions of YoR more divided than any Moz album yet?

  • Yes, Years of Refusal is dividing Moz fans more than any previous album.

    Votes: 15 36.6%
  • No, another album has been more divisive (which one?)

    Votes: 26 63.4%

  • Total voters
    41

King Leer

Leering since '97
Reading all the posts since the album leaked until now, I've come to the conclusion that this album is dividing fans more than any other Morrissey release yet. I love YoR, but I'm actually glad to see it sparking debate.

Even as far as the tracks go it seems that everyone has different ideas about which are strong and which aren't (even with front running Birthday).

Do you agree YoR is a Moz-fan deal breaker?
 
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Reading all the posts since the album leaked until now, I've come to the conclusion that this album is dividing fans more than any other Morrissey release yet. I love YoR, but I'm actually glad to see it sparking debate.

Even as far as the tracks go it seems that everyone has different ideas about which are strong and which aren't (even with front running Birthday).

Do you agree YoR is a Moz-fan deal breaker?

Yes, it seems that it is. I can't put my finger on why, but I'm not surprised. Even though I love the album I do sense it's a love-it or leave-it kind of thing. I'm not mystified that some don't like it. I just pity them. ;)
 
Yes, it seems that it is. I can't put my finger on why, but I'm not surprised. Even though I love the album I do sense it's a love-it or leave-it kind of thing. I'm not mystified that some don't like it. I just pity them. ;)

I can see that but why do you think it is? Because Alan and Gary are not playing on it? (Just thinking out loud, I have no idea.)

I'm asking because I wasn't a fan when ROTT came out, so I can't remember that. :o

Edit: Sorry, you said that you don't know why, I just noticed that.
 
I can see that but why do you think it is? Because Alan and Gary are not playing on it? (Just thinking out loud, I have no idea.)

I'm asking because I wasn't a fan when ROTT came out, so I can't remember that. :o

Like I said, I don't really know. My guess is that it's because Morrissey has decided to make a virtue out of standing still-- defying the conventional wisdom that artists have to "take chances", "experiment", "branch out", etc. I realize it's counterintuitive, but by doing this Morrissey has cut, and continues to cut, a daring and original figure in pop music.

Sometimes it's good to be the hurricane.

Sometimes it's good to stand in the eye of the hurricane.

To see what Morrissey is you also have to appreciate what he isn't. (That is, his refusals, which I think ties into the title of the album in some way.) Some people can't, won't, or don't care to look for what isn't there. Which is understandable, I guess.

It'll all make sense one day.
 
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Reading all the posts since the album leaked until now, I've come to the conclusion that this album is dividing fans more than any other Morrissey release yet. I love YoR, but I'm actually glad to see it sparking debate.

Even as far as the tracks go it seems that everyone has different ideas about which are strong and which aren't (even with front running Birthday).

Do you agree YoR is a Moz-fan deal breaker?

Not really, most people seem to agree that it's a rather good, though not one of the best Morrissey- albums, as is proven in this thread:

http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=96278

Very few people actually list it as his best or his worst, but most seem to agree it's somewhere between 4-6 in the pecking order.
 
There's a whole thread dedicated to people who don't like YoR and some of the comments are very negative.

On the main page (with all its anonymous riff-raff), there are some of the harshest comments I've read for any of the three post-2000 albums.


Not really, most people seem to agree that it's a rather good, though not one of the best Morrissey- albums, as is proven in this thread:

http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=96278

Very few people actually list it as his best or his worst, but most seem to agree it's somewhere between 4-6 in the pecking order.
 
Kill Uncle. Love it or leave it. I :love:

I'll always be a fan. What's the big whoop in thinking that YoR is okay?
 
I was wondering if opinions were divided when Your Arsenal or Vauxhall came out. It never seems like there's an album that comes out now and days that everyone loves.
 
It never seems like there's an album that comes out now and days that everyone loves.

Sounds suspiciously like the reaction people might have about an artist who hasn't lost his ability to provoke, surprise, enchant...
 
Sounds suspiciously like the reaction people might have about an artist who hasn't lost his ability to provoke, surprise, enchant...

In fairness, it could also be the reaction of a divided group of fans, some of whom think he has lost what he once had and others who refuse to see Morrissey criticised. Me, I'm undecided.
 
much of the criticism seems to centre around the lyrics, whereas the praise is more focused on the music.
maybe those who are disappointed in the album are more interested in the words than the music. just a suggestion!
 
much of the criticism seems to centre around the lyrics, whereas the praise is more focused on the music.
maybe those who are disappointed in the album are more interested in the words than the music. just a suggestion!

I think it's a good suggestion.

I wish the doubters would watch the Russell Brand video on the bonus DVD and hear Morrissey talk briefly about how words are changed by the way they're sung. The words-music divide, scored into our brains from years of Smiths sleeves (Words by Morrissey, Music by P. G. Wodehouse), was always a shaky one and now, with YOR, is totally gone. I don't think it's even possible to evaluate the lyrics to YOR without accounting for Morrissey's vocal delivery.

But what do I know, I'm deluded.
 
I think it's a good suggestion.

I wish the doubters would watch the Russell Brand video on the bonus DVD and hear Morrissey talk briefly about how words are changed by the way they're sung. The words-music divide, scored into our brains from years of Smiths sleeves (Words by Morrissey, Music by P. G. Wodehouse), was always a shaky one and now, with YOR, is totally gone. I don't think it's even possible to evaluate the lyrics to YOR without accounting for Morrissey's vocal delivery.

But what do I know, I'm deluded.

This much is true. Personally I think YOR, while having its fine moments, has too many songs which are lyrically mediocre at best. Often I feel like Morrissey ultimately talks a better game than he plays; surely this man of genius could come up with something better than 'Sorry Doesn't Help' to stick on an album. On the other hand, something like 'When Last I Spoke to Carol' is beautiful, Moz back to his narrative best; I love the disjointed conversation between the two characters he creates, and the immediate and wailing lament from the narrator at the end of the song.
 
This much is true. Personally I think YOR, while having its fine moments, has too many songs which are lyrically mediocre at best. Often I feel like Morrissey ultimately talks a better game than he plays; surely this man of genius could come up with something better than 'Sorry Doesn't Help' to stick on an album. On the other hand, something like 'When Last I Spoke to Carol' is beautiful, Moz back to his narrative best; I love the disjointed conversation between the two characters he creates, and the immediate and wailing lament from the narrator at the end of the song.

Here's my random suggestion.

The story is old, I know
But it goes on

Maybe Morrissey knows, and has known since at least 1987, that there are only so many ways to describe the same emotions. Maybe Morrissey knows that endless attempts to poeticize the same emotions by dressing them up in fancy verbiage would only aestheticize into airy nothing what is, for him, deep and excruciating pain.

In short, maybe, after a certain number of years and a certain number of words, there's simply no other way to say it but "Sorry Doesn't Help".

The story is old, I know
But it goes on
 
Here's my random suggestion.

The story is old, I know
But it goes on

Maybe Morrissey knows, and has known since at least 1987, that there are only so many ways to describe the same emotions. Maybe Morrissey knows that endless attempts to poeticize the same emotions by dressing them up in fancy verbiage would only aestheticize into airy nothing what is, for him, deep and excruciating pain.

In short, maybe, after a certain number of years and a certain number of words, there's simply no other way to say it but "Sorry Doesn't Help".

The story is old, I know
But it goes on

Not sure if I agree, but I am tempted to. You should be a salesman, mate. I don't think, though, that although Morrissey has a beautiful way with poetic language, that he has ever "aestheticized into airy" any painful emotion. And 'Sorry Doesn't Help' borders lyrically on cliche.
 
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