Alain Whyte reminisces about "Southpaw Grammar" on Facebook, released 20 years ago (Aug. 28, 1995)

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

such a mediocre and forgettable album to be honest

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

Now My Heart is Full is also another great song. Interesting thought...Alain and Boz together. Others know a lot better than me. Were they in the Moz camp at the same time? Did they collaborate? Actually, Boz is the guy who most here agree has been a solid songwriter for Moz. How he has managed to stay in the inner circle is truly amazing given Morrissey's temperament. If I could ask one question to anyone about anything Morrissey, it would be how did Boz navigate the maelstrom that is Morrissey all of these years?

That's an easy question to answer. Martin is quite cute on the quiet, cunning and conniving even. The only remaining member of the original solo band, he knows which side his bread is buttered on. Its a shame Julie Hammil never pressed Spencer on his thoughts about Martin when she had the chance, such a wasted opportunity. It's no secret that Martin did a turd on his original bandmates especially Alain, Martin played big part in his downfall.
In the future when Steven is dead brand Boorer will be a household name, death documentaries, Moz memorabilia shop, books, un-released sessions, keep fit with Martin DVDs, red wine/white wine/beer/cider, Camden pie and mash shop, Jackamo Boorer clothing range, etc etc. You have to give him credit really I don't know anyone who could keep their head down so long saying "yes boss".
It's fair to say that we all have Martin to thank for the very fact we're all sat on platform three at Shit Central with no trains to Musicville.

Now my heart is full is one of my favourites by the way.

Benny-the-British-Butcher

 

[saintssmileshyly]

No mention of Morrissey, as though he had little to do with the album. Missed Gaz? Yes, we've heard Sunny, which should have been included, as well as Nobody Loves Us. I also like Fantastic Bird. Some of the album tracks fail where some of the b sides are great. Dagenham sucks as much as its video...worst of the worst. I've always loved the album in general, especially Teachers, Reader, Best Friend... Heard Teachers sound checked in Philadelphia, but it was not played that night. Johnny Bridgewood was a good bass player and seemed to fit in. Drummer Spencer was excellent, as well. Solomon W and Matt W are better. The material is different in their era, so it's hard to compare. I liked Alain live, but he never possessed the confidence and ease with fans that Boz has always had.

 

[pluck]

Moz should play more 'Southpaw' songs these years, I would like to see them playing again 'The Operation' and 'Nobody Loves Us'

LONG LIVE SOUTHPAW!!!!

 

[g23]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

Better be careful...those are fightin' words around these parts. I completely agree with this. This flamenco turn is distressing. I don't think he has to go back to the past, but how about a late career rocker like Neil Young did with "Rockin' in the Free World". That song kicks *ss! Bring back the song writers!

I think he needs a Rick Rubin-esque figure to metaphorically slap him out of complacency and a completely strange set of musicians who would bring a fair amount of chaos to the sessions and yank him screaming from his comfort zone. When he's flogging a song as relentlessly dull as Kiss me a lot, there's a fair argument that he's reached a point where the laurels he's resting on are as dry and flat as a daisy pressed in a book.

I would love to be shocked again by the talent I know he still has.

 

[evennow]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

I think he needs a Rick Rubin-esque figure to metaphorically slap him out of complacency and a completely strange set of musicians who would bring a fair amount of chaos to the sessions and yank him screaming from his comfort zone. When he's flogging a song as relentlessly dull as Kiss me a lot, there's a fair argument that he's reached a point where the laurels he's resting on are as dry and flat as a daisy pressed in a book.

I would love to be shocked again by the talent I know he still has.

Sadly he would probably die before allowing this to happen. If nothing else, he has proven to be an extremely rigid individual. He needs to be in total control of everything. I really think he doesn't care much about the music underneath his lyrics just that he controls how it is created and produced. If he were less controlling and more hands off it would pay off in probably the return of greatness. I think Johnny's strong personality is the last we will see in band Morrissey. I can attest that aging brings a desire for sameness and comfort. It is the young that crave expansion and newness. Morrissey is not a young at heart kind of guy. Also much of his musical interest lies in the obscure to say the least. I am not sure if he would know a good tune if it slapped him in the ears. But when it comes together like with Nobody Loves Us it is magical.

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

Sadly he would probably die before allowing this to happen. If nothing else, he has proven to be an extremely rigid individual. He needs to be in total control of everything. I really think he doesn't care much about the music underneath his lyrics just that he controls how it is created and produced. If he were less controlling and more hands off it would pay off in probably the return of greatness. I think Johnny's strong personality is the last we will see in band Morrissey. I can attest that aging brings a desire for sameness and comfort. It is the young that crave expansion and newness. Morrissey is not a young at heart kind of guy. Also much of his musical interest lies in the obscure to say the least. I am not sure if he would know a good tune if it slapped him in the ears. But when it comes together like with Nobody Loves Us it is magical.

well from all of the covers he does i would imagine him to be interested in music and tunes but he started out out of time

 

[marred]

The first time I saw Morrissey live was in '97 at Battersea when Maladjusted came out. The set was laden with Southpaw Grammar tunes and Hearing The Teachers Are Afraid Of The Pupils Live was amazing!

I still have that image of Alain Whyte holding the guitar up to his mouth. It was a primal moment for sure.

 

[Anonymous]

Steve Lillywhite reminisces with Boz and Alain about Southpaw on Facebook.

Steve Lillywhite
22 Apr at 16:26· Jakarta, Indonesia· a

Alain Whyte Boz Boorer. I am sitting down and
listening to the whole of Southpaw Grammar for the
first time since we did it..... Bloody Hell! So Intense!!!!


Boz Boorer
Yes I remember being in a teepee AND a wigwam - too intense! Bb
22 Apr at 18:25 • Like • 7

Alain Whyte
I remember the engineer wheel spinning out back to be recorded onto The Operation. Also us playing live on Southpaw until the tape ran out. Good memories we had it good in those days. Tracking down to 2 inch tape old school style.
22 Apr at 22:40 • Like • 7

Steve Lillywhite
and the end of southpaw is the tape running off the machine. you can hear it flutter !!!
23 Apr at 16:55 • Like • 5

Steve Lillywhite
and now just listened to Moon River. it may be, for a certain mood, one of the best tracks we ever did with Moz.... completely mad..
23 Apr at 17:56 • Like • 7

Boz Boorer
hanging the mics outside the skylight at number 48 recording the fireworks, then putting them through the dsp 4000, which has just blown up after 23 years ......
23 Apr at 21:05 • Like • 4

 

[bhops]

The first time I saw Morrissey live was in '97 at Battersea when Maladjusted came out. The set was laden with Southpaw Grammar tunes and Hearing The Teachers Are Afraid Of The Pupils Live was amazing!

I still have that image of Alain Whyte holding the guitar up to his mouth. It was a primal moment for sure.

I was at that same show, it was a good 'un and I still have that awesome Robert Wagner t-shirt. Surely along with Edith Sitwell the best concert backdrop Morrissey has ever used.

 

[Anonymous]

Wasn't at the wonderful 97 show at Battersea Power Station - although there is great footage of it on Youtube. Southpaw Grammar always reminds me of the ill-fated 95 shows when Morrissey supported prima donna David Bowie on his Outside Tour at the horrible Wembley Arena and then pulled out of the tour. I have always had the impression that 1995 wasn't a good year for Morrissey emotionally - he looked very depressed to be honest. Even what he wore looked drab and miserable. And Southpaw Grammar sounds like an album written by someone who is battling with depression. It is tempting to speculate that the break-up with Jake may have been a factor - 'It's not gonna work out'. Interesting that Moz made probably his best work - Vauxhall and I - when the relationship was working for him and he was clearly in (something like) love...

 

[marred]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

Nah - there's loads. 'Oh Well I'll Never Learn', 'There Speaks a True Friend', 'I Am Two People' etc etc.

Yes but 'Oh Well I'll Never Learn', 'There Speaks a True Friend' appear on the 3 x CD Parlophone Singles compilation and 'I Am Two People' is on the Deluxe Quarry.

 

[marred]

I was at that same show, it was a good 'un and I still have that awesome Robert Wagner t-shirt. Surely along with Edith Sitwell the best concert backdrop Morrissey has ever used.

Do you mean the one with the dudes at the edge of the pool? I still have that t shirt too!

 

[bhops]

Do you mean the one with the dudes at the edge of the pool? I still have that t shirt too!

That's the one. Whenever I wear it out I always get a comment or two on it. I actually picked up a really fit bird from the Ladbroke Arms in Notting Hill Gate one lazy Sunday afternoon thanks to that shirt. She and her friend were giggling away at it and wanted to know where I got it. That shirt is always a good conversation starter, LOL. Thanks Moz!

 

[Anonymous]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

That's an easy question to answer. Martin is quite cute on the quiet, cunning and conniving even. The only remaining member of the original solo band, he knows which side his bread is buttered on. Its a shame Julie Hammil never pressed Spencer on his thoughts about Martin when she had the chance, such a wasted opportunity. It's no secret that Martin did a turd on his original bandmates especially Alain, Martin played big part in his downfall.
In the future when Steven is dead brand Boorer will be a household name, death documentaries, Moz memorabilia shop, books, un-released sessions, keep fit with Martin DVDs, red wine/white wine/beer/cider, Camden pie and mash shop, Jackamo Boorer clothing range, etc etc. You have to give him credit really I don't know anyone who could keep their head down so long saying "yes boss".
It's fair to say that we all have Martin to thank for the very fact we're all sat on platform three at Shit Central with no trains to Musicville.

Now my heart is full is one of my favourites by the way.

Benny-the-British-Butcher

Pure bennygold never a dull moment. The Martin refs had me at first and then I googled jacamo omg I've only just stopped crying and my stomach is so sore. I love how the last line just drops in from nowhere but so ordinary

 

[marred]

That's the one. Whenever I wear it out I always get a comment or two on it. I actually picked up a really fit bird from the Ladbroke Arms in Notting Hill Gate one lazy Sunday afternoon thanks to that shirt. She and her friend were giggling away at it and wanted to know where I got it. That shirt is always a good conversation starter, LOL. Thanks Moz!

I've had no such luck with my shirt

 

[whitewatersky]

f*** - this is a cool thread
shoot up a pic of the shirt !

 

[Anonymous]

Just google 'morrissey jeffrey hunter robert wagner back drop' and you will see the said t-shirt. Ironic that bhops got laid because of such a homoerotic pic.

 

[Anonymous]

I still have that image of Alain Whyte holding the guitar up to his mouth. It was a primal moment for sure.

Oh yeah - I think Alain whistles into his guitar pickups during that middle bit in 'Teachers' to get that high bit? A great moment. It just felt like the whole band was on fire during this period, and of equal importance to the singer. Now we are back to Morrissey the front man, with a bunch of faceless, uniform-wearing backing band about 7 miles behind him.

 

[bhops]

Re: Article: Alain Whyte reminisces about "Southpaw Grammar" on Facebook, released 20 years ago (Aug. 28, 1995)

f*** - this is a cool thread
shoot up a pic of the shirt !

This is a knock-off of the original I found on the net but it is pretty close to the real thing.

- - - Updated - - -

I've had no such luck with my shirt

Maybe it's my swarthy good looks that go with it

 

[TheBoyWithTheDragonTattoo]

Re: Alain Whyte reminisces about Southpaw Grammar, released 20 years ago today

I think he needs a Rick Rubin-esque figure to metaphorically slap him out of complacency and a completely strange set of musicians who would bring a fair amount of chaos to the sessions and yank him screaming from his comfort zone. When he's flogging a song as relentlessly dull as Kiss me a lot, there's a fair argument that he's reached a point where the laurels he's resting on are as dry and flat as a daisy pressed in a book.

I would love to be shocked again by the talent I know he still has.

Jack White. He'd be a great shock to the system while not gutting what makes Morrissey Morrissey. He has a history, as a producer, of taking former greats and giving us one last bit of brilliance (Loretta Lynn, Wanda Jackson.) He's good at wringing out the originality where I think Rick Rubin is more of a polisher and filler (Not that that's a bad thing- I'm thinking specifically of his reworking of the Avett Brothers sound.) And I think Jack White and Morrissey would actually have a lot in common as fans of music/vinyl. If they sat down over drinks and just talked about music they'd either walk away eager to work together or hating each other's guts. I'd love to hear a few songs co-written by White- it would be that stripped down raw rock sound Moz seems to favor. I really think JW could help Morrissey create an album that feels fresh without simply adding flamenco guitar and random sound effects.