Help with a project detaling Smiths & Morrissey influences

[Uncleskinny]

Howdo all. In the June 2003 edition of Record Collector, the redoubtable Simon Goddard listed 20 Smiths songs and the songs that influenced them. I've been trying to get them all together, with some other Moz-solo songs that might have been included. There are some songs that are musical influences, and some that are lyrical influences. I've put a list below - can anyone else think of any that might be included on the list?

Simon Goddard's List:

The Hand That Rocks The Cradle - musically influenced by Kimberly - Patti Smith
A Matter Of Opinion - musically influenced by Mr. Soul - Buffalo Springfield
Hand In Glove - lyrically influenced by Take This Longing - Leonard Cohen
Reel Around The Fountain - musically influenced by Handy Man - James Taylor
Pretty Girls Make Graves - lyrically influenced by I've Been A Bad Bad Boy - Paul Jones
Heaven Knows I'm Miserable Now - lyrically influenced by Sandie Shaw - Heaven Knows I'm Missing Him Now
Wiliam It Was Really Nothing - lyricallly influenced by This Town Ain't Big Enough For The Both Of Us - Sparks
How Soon Is Now - musically influenced by That's All RIght - Elvis Presley
Rusholme Ruffians - musically influenced by (Marie's The Name) His Latest Flame
Bigmouth Strikes Again - musically influenced by Jumpin' Jack Flash - The Rolling Stones
There Is A Light That Never Goes Out - musically Influenced by Hitch-Hike (Marvin Gaye, and also The Rolling Stones)
The Queen Is Dead - musically influenced by I Can't Stand It - The Velvet Underground
Some Girls Are Bigger Than Others - lyrically influenced by Send Me The Pillow That You Dream On - Johnny Tillotson
Panic - musically influenced by Metal Guru - T-Rex
The Draize Train - musically influenced by Long Train Running - The Doobie Brothers
Sheila Take A Bow - lyrically influenced by Kooks - David Bowie
Girlfriend In A Coma - lyrically influenced by Tell Laura I Love Her - Rick Valance
Death Of A Disco Dancer - musically influenced by Dear Prudence - The Beatles
I Won't Share You - musically influenced by Ask - The Smiths
Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me - musically infleunced by I'll Never Quite Get Over You - Billy Fury

Others:

Girl Least Likely To - musically influenced by Only To Other People - The Cookies
A Rush And A Push And The Land Is Ours - musically influenced by Shoes - Reparata
Certain People I Know - musically influenced by Ride A White Swan - T-Rex
Such A Little Thing Makes Such A Big Difference - musically influenced by Never Turn Your Back On Mother Earth - Sparks
Sing Your Life - lyrically influenced by I Belong To The Wind - Billy Fury (this was mentioned in passing in the Goddard article)
Lucky Lisp - lyrically influenced by Lucky Lips - Cliff Richard
There Is A Light That Never Goes Out - lyrically influenced by Lonely Planet Boy - New York Dolls
Rusholme Ruffians - lyrically influenced by Fourteen Again & also Funny How Things Turn Out - Victoria Wood
Seasick Yet Still Docked - lyrically influenced by The Silky Veils Of Ardor - Joni Mitchell
Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me - lyrically influenced by Amelia - John Mitchell

There's also a Bo Diddley song that Rogan mentions as an influence to What Difference Does It Make, but I can't find the reference.

**EDIT**

I forgot the Alain Whyte penned Johnny Panic songs:

Irish Blood English Heart - musically influenced by Not Bitter But Bored - Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams
Don't Make Fun Of Daddy's Voice - musically influenced by Paranoia - Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams
First Of The Gang To Die - musicaly influenced by Stay With Me - Johnny Panic And The Bible Of Dreams

Ta in advance for your help,

Peter

[Johan de Witt]

Howdo all. In the June 2003 edition of Record Collector, the redoubtable Simon Goddard listed 20 Smiths songs and the songs that influenced them. I've been trying to get them all together, with some other Moz-solo songs that might have been included. There are some songs that are musical influences, and some that are lyrical influences. I've put a list below - can anyone else think of any that might be included on the list?

Simon Goddard's List:

The Hand That Rocks The Cradle - musically influenced by Kimberly - Patti Smith
A Matter Of Opinion - musically influenced by Mr. Soul - Buffalo Springfield
Hand In Glove - lyrically influenced by Take This Longing - Leonard Cohen
Reel Around The Fountain - musically influenced by Handy Man - James Taylor
Pretty Girls Make Graves - lyrically influenced by I've Been A Bad Bad Boy - Paul Jones
Heaven Knows I'm Miserable Now - lyrically influenced by Sandie Shaw - Heaven Knows I'm Missing Him Now
Wiliam It Was Really Nothing - lyricallly influenced by This Town Ain't Big Enough For The Both Of Us - Sparks
How Soon Is Now - musically influenced by That's All RIght - Elvis Presley
Rusholme Ruffians - musically influenced by (Marie's The Name) His Latest Flame
Bigmouth Strikes Again - musically influenced by Jumpin' Jack Flash - The Rolling Stones
There Is A Light That Never Goes Out - musically Influenced by Hitch-Hike (Marvin Gaye, and also The Rolling Stones)
The Queen Is Dead - musically influenced by I Can't Stand It - The Velvet Underground
Some Girls Are Bigger Than Others - lyrically influenced by Send Me The Pillow That You Dream On - Johnny Tillotson
Panic - musically influenced by Metal Guru - T-Rex
The Draize Train - musically influenced by Long Train Running - The Doobie Brothers
Sheila Take A Bow - lyrically influenced by Kooks - David Bowie
Girlfriend In A Coma - lyrically influenced by Tell Laura I Love Her - Rick Valance
Death Of A Disco Dancer - musically influenced by Dear Prudence - The Beatles
I Won't Share You - musically influenced by Ask - The Smiths
Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me - musically infleunced by I'll Never Quite Get Over You - Billy Fury

Others:

Girl Least Likely To - musically influenced by Only To Other People - The Cookies
A Rush And A Push And The Land Is Ours - musically influenced by Shoes - Reparata
Certain People I Know - musically influenced by Ride A White Swan - T-Rex
Such A Little Thing Makes Such A Big Difference - musically influenced by Never Turn Your Back On Mother Earth - Sparks
Sing Your Life - lyrically influenced by I Belong To The Wind - Billy Fury (this was mentioned in passing in the Goddard article)
Lucky Lisp - lyrically influenced by Lucky Lips - Cliff Richard
There Is A Light That Never Goes Out - lyrically influenced by Lonely Planet Boy - New York Dolls
Rusholme Ruffians - lyrically influenced by Fourteen Again & also Funny How Things Turn Out - Victoria Wood
Seasick Yet Still Docked - lyrically influenced by The Silky Veils Of Ardor - Joni Mitchell
Last Night I Dreamt That Somebody Loved Me - lyrically influenced by Amelia - John Mitchell

There's also a Bo Diddley song that Rogan mentions as an influence to What Difference Does It Make, but I can't find the reference.

Ta in advance for your help,

Peter

The Bo Diddley-influence is most evident on How Soon Is Now? I would say.

Other influences:

You're The One For Me Fatty, musically influenced bij Saturday's Kids-The Jam
I Know it's Gonna Happen Someday, musically influenced by Rock 'n Roll Suicide-David Bowie
November Spawned A Monster, lyrically influenced by Frankenstein-New York Dolls

[Uncleskinny]

The Bo Diddley-influence is most evident on How Soon Is Now? I would say.

Other influences:

You're The One For Me Fatty, musically influenced bij Saturday's Kids-The Jam
I Know it's Gonna Happen Someday, musically influenced by Rock 'n Roll Suicide-David Bowie
November Spawned A Monster, lyrically influenced by Frankenstein-New York Dolls

Cheers for that, I knew you'd know about this kind of thing

Best Wishes,

Peter

[lilikoi]

well, I must say that I find this list rather foolish - I'm only a hobby musician myself but I don't sit down and say: well now I'm gonna write a song that sounds like this song with lyrics inspired by this book. I mean - you simply cannot do this even if you try. music is a creative process that just sort of flows from your brain and you don't really know how. this list must have been invented by someone who doesn't have an artistic bone in his body....

[Kewpie]

well, I must say that I find this list rather foolish - I'm only a hobby musician myself but I don't sit down and say: well now I'm gonna write a song that sounds like this song with lyrics inspired by this book. I mean - you simply cannot do this even if you try. music is a creative process that just sort of flows from your brain and you don't really know how. this list must have been invented by someone who doesn't have an artistic bone in his body....

Pity you think it's foolish, but you missed the point.
The intention of this thread is to discuss subconscious creative process from the fans/listeners' point of view.
There's no right and wrong, just enjoy guessing and spotting.
It's very anoraky, but I find it very fascinating.

[lilikoi]

yes, well I missed the point indeed then. I didn't know it was from the fans point of view. well, ok then.

[nightandday]

well, I must say that I find this list rather foolish - I'm only a hobby musician myself but I don't sit down and say: well now I'm gonna write a song that sounds like this song with lyrics inspired by this book. I mean - you simply cannot do this even if you try. music is a creative process that just sort of flows from your brain and you don't really know how. this list must have been invented by someone who doesn't have an artistic bone in his body....

Hmm, I'm not sure what you mean by this. You don't just get magically inspired and create music or lyrics without any influence, do you?!?! And in this day and age especially, it's quite common to do it deliberately, to pay hommage or quote other artists(post-modern authors do it all the time).

Morrissey has said himself that "November" is his version of "Frankenstein". Johnny has said that the tune to "Girlfriend In a Coma" is basically "Young, Gifted and Black" and that he deliberately took the part in 'There is A Light' from the Stones' version of the Marvin Gaye song 'Hitch-Hike'. The Smiths even played 'Marie's The Name (his Latest Flame)' as an intro to 'Rusholme Ruffians'. so what's the problem? I think that, for instance, the link to "Rock'n'Roll Suicide" adds something to 'I Know It's Gonna Happen Someday'.

[nightandday]

and I've said it already - missing from the list is:

Girlfriend In a Coma - musically influenced by "Young, Gifted and Black", Bob & Marcia (originally performed by Nina Simone) - according to Johnny Marr, one of Morrissey's favourite records (that awful racist! ). I would have never guessed the link to GIAC, but Johnny said it - look it up on youtube, it's an outtake from a documentary about the Motown sound, Johnny talks about his and Morrissey's love for 60s girl groups and Motown soul.