good news for the Castro fans

[LetsGoDevils]

and I know there are several to be glad to hear some very good news out of Havana.
http://www.breitbart.com/news/2006/08/01/D8J7RRE00.html

 

[realitybites]

I may get to go to Cuba one day, after all.

 

[DeadLinDy]

me too! me too! i can fit inside of a suitcase like nobody's business!!!

 

[LetsGoDevils]

I may get to go to Cuba one day, after all.

Didn't Sean Penn go to Cuba and I think people from Miami area go there to visit their relatives so there has to be some way.

 

[Dave]

 

[Puddle]

Didn't Sean Penn go to Cuba and I think people from Miami area go there to visit their relatives so there has to be some way.

well you could go thorugh canada, and you used to be able to go there from the US if you were part of an educational/cultural trip...many groups were mere travel agencies that offered these programs when really it was just a back door to travel to Cuba. But Bush put a stop to that which i think is billshit. we are supposed to be a free country and yet our government tells us where we can not go. they tell us what is right and wrong. it's not like Cuba is dangerous for us. there are places we are free to travel when they are very very dangerous for us to go to. the embargo in cuba should end.

but other than that. if you are cuban, the government allows you to travel a certain amount of times over a certain period of time. like twice a year or maybe once. it's all bullshit. I should be able to travel to cuba but the US government just wants to put an economic strangle on cuba to make the country unbearable for the people and thus the government. the theory is it's bad PR for the cuban government and they get blamed for bad times even though Cuba would be able to prosper if the powerful neighbor to the north didn't strangle it. it's deliberate and I'm against such political games. no i am not a communist, but cuba is very willing to play by global capitalist rules on the economic front which would go along way in improving the quality of life for the people. the revolution itself was to kick out foreign ownership and corruption among cuba's elite. and the original miami cubans were the rich who cried because they lost their villas. now of course you have pooer people who constantly leave cuba and they blame cuba for poor quality of life...well why not blame the US embargo which purposely causes the hard times on the Cuban public. it's sick. yes castro has clamped down on political opposition, but over the years he has had the US try to remove him. so there has been times he has been paranoid and took measures that i am against. but once again, it's all indirectly the result of the US...end the embargo and the US will be embarassed at how much Cuba will thrive.

i apologize for spelling...in a hurry here. my point is cuba is far different from the USSR or a cultural opressive regime one could find int eh Middle East (and we do business with many of those countries...i could travel there if i wanted to)...all their problems are a direct or indirect result of economics (caused by the embargo...why do you think it is there in the first place).

 

[Pervomartovtsi]

when i began to study cuban modern history Fidel was the bomb for me, now is just another filthy dictator

 

[Puddle]

when i began to study cuban modern history Fidel was the bomb for me, now is just another filthy dictator

don't get me wrong...i don't like dictators either and fidel is one. my whole point is the US embargo goes a long way at impoverishing the country and it's sole purpose is to cause a riff between the people and Fidel. It's a political game between the two countries and the people are suffering because of it. It's bull, because i say the US embargo and hostile actions in the past just caused a strong riff between supporters and non-sipporters of Fidel which gave him the needed strength to be in power for 40+ years. Indeed, a large group of people in Cuba and Latin America see Fidel as a hero because of the ongoing struggle against US hostile actions (whether through words, actions, embargo)... so there really is no purpose just to attempt tp trick the people of cuba Fidel is the reason for economic troubles in Cuba...as some fall for it.

Yah f*** dictators, but f*** america's politcal games over the years. in the end they make no sense.

 

[davdavon]

when i began to study cuban modern history Fidel was the bomb for me, now is just another filthy dictator

He might be a dictator, but he still managed to give the Cuban people the best health, education and social security system in Latin America in spite of the American embargo... I'm not sure that things will be better for Cuba once he's gone.

 

[Bluebirds]

I went to Cuba 2 years ago... I travelled round staying with Cuban families for a month.
I saw Fidel give his International Worker's Day speech. I visited Che Guevara's final resting place. I went to the only gay club in the whole of Cuba.
(Same place as Che's resting place...Santa Clara)

I zigzagged all over Havana baby. I met a Cuban poet, and an ex-Olympic boxer who gave me some cigars. I saw Cuban bands playing in chicken yards.

I ate in illegal food places as everything is taxed by the govt.

I tried to converse with people about what it was like living under a Communist regime.... people were extremely reticient to talk about it. It was a very contradictory nation They have one of the best health care and education systems in the world, yet to supplement their incomes doctors were taxi drivers as they earnt more from tips than from their salary! (yes I know its Communism but to see it close-up and personal...)

The Cuban mentality certainly seemed to be one of free market economics yet they were very proud of Castro and the education/ helath system. Graiffiti of Viva Cuba libre everywhere and Hasta la victoria siempre. I met an American there too.... and lots of Canadians.

My point? I haven't got one....but the businessmen are circling Havan already waiting to turn the buildings into Starbucks and Macdonalds. And they're not too keen on the Americans either. well more pertinently the government.


Tomorrow I'll show you my holiday snaps of when i went to Belgium!

 

[kingdai]

I love the way the giant bully-boy scumbag US governments past and present have got so het up about this tiny island state. I know Castro aint the greatest of people but GO CUBA!

 

[Pervomartovtsi]

Puddle... I also hate to death the actions that the almighty USA empire has been playing on other countries...f*** kissinger....

Davdavon...I know that all, and I think it's amazing, I'd love that my country got the health system that cuban people have...but being killed for thinking different is the same that Pinochet did to us,and I can't forget that...a murder done by a comunist or by a fascist is the same for me

 

[Puddle]

but the businessmen are circling Havan already waiting to turn the buildings into Starbucks and Macdonalds.

this is the saddest part of globalization which one can not escape from if we live in capitalism. the fact is capitalism does destroy culture, but then those places that resist it become something the opposite and just as dangerous but in different ways. Perhaps one day we''l get it right and a fair, prosperous, economic system could exist without the need of globalization, exploitation, imperialism...all of which is currently needed to sustain growth...and of course 'growth' is needed to sustain capitalism. Wealth is power though, so it's impossible to change things.

I wonder what would happen once capitalism can't grow anymore? every territory has been conquered, the population tapped, technology at it's peak...perhaps technology will fill the void and we'll be living in some futuristic paradise where machines do all the work and everyone is born into luxury? (but that itself is ugly) i don't know. just saying. Capitalism has it's very ugly sides, maybe there is a way to mix different ideologies to come up with something more fair. But everyone is all into one side or the other and nothing productive ever gets accomplished...just more wars and more macdonalds. and less than 1% of population rules the world.

 

[Wild Oscar]

It's good to read that there are still a few old (ok - speaking for myself) lefties out there.

Ok, there will be as many - probably more - anti-Catro/anti-left politicos on this site, but it shows that we're not all dead + buried just yet.

Remember - Marx may have got the timing wrong on his theory about the death of capitalism, but all is not lost just yet: perhaps capitalism has not quite reached its highest level of imperialism yet - the stage necessary before the world turns once again to a more structured, caring and less chaotic political system.

In a fantasy/'what if...' scenario, I'd like to hear what Marx, Lenin + Trotsky would say about the state of world now and the apparent discrediting of their theories, if they could...

I might even start another thread - although it's probably been done already: if you could have dinner and spend an evening's discussion with, say, 6 people - living or dead - who would you choose?

Watch out for it - but tell me not to bother if it's been done recently.

 

[Puddle]

It's good to read that there are still a few old (ok - speaking for myself) lefties out there.

Ok, there will be as many - probably more - anti-Catro/anti-left politicos on this site, but it shows that we're not all dead + buried just yet.

Remember - Marx may have got the timing wrong on his theory about the death of capitalism, but all is not lost just yet: perhaps capitalism has not quite reached its highest level of imperialism yet - the stage necessary before the world turns once again to a more structured, caring and less chaotic political system.

In a fantasy/'what if...' scenario, I'd like to hear what Marx, Lenin + Trotsky would say about the state of world now and the apparent discrediting of their theories, if they could...

I might even start another thread - although it's probably been done already: if you could have dinner and spend an evening's discussion with, say, 6 people - living or dead - who would you choose?

Watch out for it - but tell me not to bother if it's been done recently.

i'm not a leftie in that sense though (in case you thought i was)...the examples we had of communism, almost all had their serious flaws. I'm not going to support them because it's either that or supporting capitalism. I'm just more of a realist. i think there are many good principles of capitalism, likewise communism, socailism, and even anarchism. I just think some kind of balance could be found but that would require a revolution in itself in order to end the current exploitation by the .000001% of the population. they control the media, the army, etc. there really is no use.

In the end it's best to give-in and not care about the suffering capitalism, and the reactionary actions against it, is causing on a global scale. It's fair to say the current global economic system has serious flaws unsafe for humanity and the environment in the long run. so lets fix it rationally instead of just reverting to state capitalism.

but i think there is no use. it all has to do with the need of 'growth' for capitaloism to exist...and the communism we've seen is too bleak and opressive to be a wanted alternative.

 

[Seasick]

Gawd living in Cuba must be great. That must be why the US is inundated with refugees fleeing that dictatorship. Lets be honest, communism is great for the dictatorship. And everthing is not the fault of the US. We could lift the embargo, but for some reason I highly doubt any prosperity would trickle down to the good people of Cuba. Dictators have a bad habit of hording all the wealth. They have no interest in pleasing the people. Sounds like a Liberal dream. You make all the rules and kill all those dare question you.

 

[Puddle]

Gawd living in Cuba must be great. That must be why the US is inundated with refugees fleeing that dictatorship. Lets be honest, communism is great for the dictatorship. And everthing is not the fault of the US. We could lift the embargo, but for some reason I highly doubt any prosperity would trickle down to the good people of Cuba. Dictators have a bad habit of hording all the wealth. They have no interest in pleasing the people. Sounds like a Liberal dream. You make all the rules and kill all those dare question you.

then, um, what's the point of the embargo? i just think it is pathetic that we need to help fidel castro look bad to his people by having this embargo in place for decades.


I blame the US for many things in that they are the number one backers of the current economic system which is to blame for much of the world's problems...in some ways directly, and in others indirectly. and indeed their actions speak louder than words...though many people miss the point of their actions (for example the cuban embargo).

you've tried the "the US isn't to blame" arguement before.. i realize it's shocking how much they are to blame, but they just are...but to their credit, they have no choice. like i said, 'growth' is needed to sustain capitalism. so really the US is just trying to survive. it's like, humans need to drink water. the US needs to exploit...

unfortunately a lot of people suffer because of it.

but with all this said, i do like many principles of capitalism...i just think some kind of checks and balances need to be put into place. but like i said, that would need a revolution in itself since those with power are not going to restrict themselves and make the system fair for everyone.

 

[Theo]

I see some of the usual suspects of Morrissey-SoLow can't quite bring themselves to unequivocably condemn a murderous, oppressive, evil dictator. Tell it to the people stuck in prisons by Fidel for daring to think for themselves.

That was very interesting that when Fidel gets ill he signs over the dictatorship to his brother. Was that what the revolution was all about?

Needless to say I will have champagne when Fidel is dead, right along with those Cuban-Americans in Miami who have waited so long for this piece of shit to croak. All commies can rot in hell. Whereas certain SoLowers will instead mourn his death and hope that a Muslim terrorist assassinates the elected Prime Minister Tony Blair. To be a true Far Lefty you gotta hate capitalism, get on your knees to the Prophet Muhammad, and hope Fidel has a speedy revovery. *spit* Are we allowed to hate Kim Jong Mentally Ill at least? Oh, but Bush is far worse.......

Idiocy is as rampant as ever.

BTW, during the Cuban Missile Crisis, Fidel was on the phone to the USSR begging them to nuke the world. What a guy. (Source: The documentary film The Fog of War.)

 

[Puddle]

I see some of the usual suspects of Morrissey-SoLow can't quite bring themselves to unequivocably condemn a murderous, oppressive, evil dictator. Tell it to the people stuck in prisons by Fidel for daring to think for themselves.

That was very interesting that when Fidel gets ill he signs over the dictatorship to his brother. Was that what the revolution was all about?

Needless to say I will have champagne when Fidel is dead, right along with those Cuban-Americans in Miami who have waited so long for this piece of shit to croak. All commies can rot in hell. Whereas certain SoLowers will instead mourn his death and hope that a Muslim terrorist assassinates the elected Prime Minister Tony Blair. To be a true Far Lefty you gotta hate capitalism, get on your knees to the Prophet Muhammad, and hope Fidel has a speedy revovery. *spit* Are we allowed to hate Kim Jong Mentally Ill at least? Oh, but Bush is far worse.......

Idiocy is as rampant as ever.

BTW, during the Cuban Missile Crisis, Fidel was on the phone to the USSR begging them to nuke the world. What a guy. (Source: The documentary film The Fog of War.)

i can't wait for fidel to die and communism to end in cuba...My plan is to go down there and snatch up some land, someway. The miami cubans will be too busy celebrating to realize Cuba is for sale, and the Cubans in cuba will have no money naturally. we've seen similiar things occur in the former Soviet sattelites...and now those countires are whores of the west (a lot of $$$)...well hell, i'm just jealous i didn't get in on the action. But i was too young. Cuba though, i only hope communism stays around long enough for me to raise my funds and find an investment plan.

Me pointing out the flaws of US policy and the current economic system known as capitalism doesn't mean i don't participate in capitalism to my advantage. heck, it would be silly to resist it. f*** it, I'll buy a cuban shop, gut it, and rent it to starbucks...

I am being 100% serious, please realize i am not being sarcastic. Anyone who finds this plan disgusting should realize that's capitalism and that's the American way!!!!

so f*** off if you find it sad but yet wave the American flag!!! End communism in Cuba and then what? It won't be pretty either for the people but since it's going to happen, i'm going to be there if i can.

Don't forget Cuban communism is in reaction to global capitalism and Western imperialism...so any bad things done was in reaction to that economic system. it's not excusing those actions, it's just the truth. i'll repeat, the current global economic system is flawed. Theo, please realize it doesn't mean i am a far leftie or a communist.

 

[Dave]

Let's face it, the difference between the US and Cuba is not what it used to be.