Theo: The Brazilian question.

  • Thread starter seriously not right in the head
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seriously not right in the head

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If the Police truly believed this guy was a danger to public safety, why did they not arrest him on leaving the house, which by all accounts was under surveillance. Why did they allow him to enter a public arena (railway station) where the risk to innocent civilians was far greater. As lg stated the Police were dressed in civilian clothing, and by all accounts of those that witnessed the event, he did not jump the barrier, he put one foot on the train and was dragged down from behind and shot in the head five times.

I'm sorry to say once again, you are excusing the inexcusable.

The Police are not righteous and good as you seem to think, they are a power unto themselves, who abuse it beyond belief.
 
The thread is down the list, not up here.

> If the Police truly believed this guy was a danger to public safety, why
> did they not arrest him on leaving the house, which by all accounts was
> under surveillance.

I don't know. As I said, I'm waiting for the investigation to be done and all the facts to be known.

My guess would be that the person seemed increasingly suspicious as they trailed him. When they tried to stop him at some point and he fled, that's when everything got out of control. And the reports I was going on claimed he jumped a turnstile, which obviously hasn't been confirmed as fact yet.
 
The inexcusable

The death of the Brazilian was tragic. But do not blame the police. They were under tremendous pressure and there's no question the man was acting suspiciously.

Hindsight is 20/20: what if someone had done something that seemed "excessive" at JFK the morning of 9/11 and had stopped the hijackers?

This is the nature of the world we live in now, in the West. This will happen again, not to mention the countless cases of false arrest, cops jumping the gun to prevent crimes, and other transgressions we may not hear about.

A better focus of your anger should be on the people who helped create this world. I can think of two: one's eating rice in a Pakistani cave, the other's eating steak on his ranch in Crawford, Texas.
 
> If the Police truly believed this guy was a danger to public safety, why
> did they not arrest him on leaving the house, which by all accounts was
> under surveillance. Why did they allow him to enter a public arena
> (railway station) where the risk to innocent civilians was far greater. As
> lg stated the Police were dressed in civilian clothing, and by all
> accounts of those that witnessed the event, he did not jump the barrier,
> he put one foot on the train and was dragged down from behind and shot in
> the head five times.

> I'm sorry to say once again, you are excusing the inexcusable.

> The Police are not righteous and good as you seem to think, they are a
> power unto themselves, who abuse it beyond belief.

they could have used a stun gun and would most likely be alive today (stun guns aren't fail safe, but more survivable than being shot in the head 5 times).

there is no point in shooting somebody in the head 5 times if they were already being tackled by the cops. maybe the adrenaline was running high or maybe they wanted a spectacular statement for the papers.

plus, what would you think if you were in a foreign country and suddenly a bunch of people who aren't dressed like the police start running at you with a gun? anyone who is somewhat familiar with britain knows that the cops generally don't carry guns.
 
Re: The inexcusable

> I can think of two: one's eating rice in a Pakistani cave, the
> other's eating steak on his ranch in Crawford, Texas.

The 9/11 terrorist sleeper cell was on the ground in the USA taking flight lessons and putting their plot in motion before Bush was ever President. One of the reasons cited by bin Laden to justify 9/11 was the sanctions on Iraq, which those on the UN security counsel who didn't want to topple Saddam wanted to keep in place, so Bin Laden would always have had his propaganda rationales no matter what Bush did. The Bali bombing was done because Australia intervened in East Timor. Islamic Jihad has been killing people wordwide for many years, back when Bush was a heavy drinker who didn't know he'd ever be President, and their training camps were in Afghanistan churned out over 50,000 killers to spread out into the world before Bush ran for office.

I could go on, but I suspect the Global War on Terrorism is something you'll never get, and you'll continue to try and pretend Bush is as evil as Bin Laden, and that fighting terrorism and states that sponsor it is the cause of terrorism. You just don't get it. Which is why I continue to thank the Lord (even though I don't believe in the Lord) that people who do get the enemy are in power in countries like Australia, Britain, and the USA.

Everything you said before that final bit was good though.
 
Re: The inexcusable

> I could go on, but I suspect the Global War on Terrorism is something
> you'll never get, and you'll continue to try and pretend Bush is as evil
> as Bin Laden, and that fighting terrorism and states that sponsor it is
> the cause of terrorism. You just don't get it. Which is why I continue to
> thank the Lord (even though I don't believe in the Lord) that people who
> do get the enemy are in power in countries like Australia, Britain, and
> the USA.

has anyone ever wondered how successful the british were at defeating the IRA in northern ireland? that's a tiny area of a tiny, relatively impoverished country, and i don't think the women can knit Aran fishing sweaters fast enough to raise enough money for a sizable operation, yet even so, after decades of bombings, they've called an uneasy truce which could fall apart at any moment. its nowhere in the same league as several countries inhabited with millions of people and loaded with billions of dollars that flow from oil sales.

good luck to anyone who thinks you can completely rout them out. here it is, 4 years after 9/11 and they're still blowing up subways and car bombs in iraq.
 
I'm sick of these Monday Morning quarterbacks

> The thread is down the list, not up here.

> I don't know. As I said, I'm waiting for the investigation to be done and
> all the facts to be known.

> My guess would be that the person seemed increasingly suspicious as they
> trailed him. When they tried to stop him at some point and he fled, that's
> when everything got out of control. And the reports I was going on claimed
> he jumped a turnstile, which obviously hasn't been confirmed as fact yet.
It's so easy for people to make judgments behind a computer from 200 miles away in Liverpool when they are not on the streets making life and death decisions. Being a police officer is one of the hardest jobs and they had to make a split second decision. This person could have easily had a bomb and if he did the arugument would be why didn't they shoot him before he blew up the train.
 
>
>I totally agree!! what the police did is a totally unacceptable, it is a crime and they should face the disciplinary procedures accordingly. I mean even the worst criminal doesn't need to be shot 5 times in the head to be stopped. one shot in your brain would kill you instantly. So I am appalled at the violence used on this guy. I didn't realise when the press gave its account of the events that the policemen were dressed as civilians which could justify why this guy did not believe them and probably thought they were about to assault him or something. Now We all wonder why the house was under surveillance and why he came out of it of course, but again the whole event comes to prove that brits are useless when it comes to solve serious security issues.
 
Re: I'm sick of these Monday Morning quarterbacks

> It's so easy for people to make judgments behind a computer from 200 miles
> away in Liverpool when they are not on the streets making life and death
> decisions. Being a police officer is one of the hardest jobs and they had
> to make a split second decision.

i agree. it should be just as safe for anyone resembling a person for the middle east as it is for a black person to be wandering the streets in 1960's Mississippi.

>This person could have easily had a bomb
> and if he did the arugument would be why didn't they shoot him before he
> blew up the train.
 
Re: I'm sick of these Monday Morning quarterbacks

> i agree. it should be just as safe for anyone resembling a person for the
> middle east as it is for a black person to be wandering the streets in
> 1960's Mississippi.
I'm taking into consideration the extreme pressure the London police department has right now to protect the public from people throwing bombs on public transportation.
The NYC transit police have the answer, just violate every 20th person's Constitutional rights. Or detain the white 20 something female because you know she won't give you a hard time. When someone screams racial profiling they can say we stopped x amount of blonde hair blue eyed females.Bonus-Al Sharpton won't protest about their civil rights or make up fake rape stories.
 
it's called 'police intelligence' it's not just a british thing though, I'm sure that they are just as thick in every other country.

love

Grim
 
i thought this topic was going to be something a bit different

oops!!
 
Re: i thought this topic was going to be something a bit different

> oops!!
Wait about a month.
 
> it's called 'police intelligence' it's not just a british thing though,
> I'm sure that they are just as thick in every other country.

> love

> Grim
Maybe you should become an undercover police officer. You can gather intelligence in back of the gatoraide cooler at the Man City games.
 
Re: I'm sick of these Monday Morning quarterbacks

No one asked you anything. You're not English, you're not Brazilian, so leave Irene alone, ok?

> It's so easy for people to make judgments behind a computer from 200 miles
> away in Liverpool when they are not on the streets making life and death
> decisions. Being a police officer is one of the hardest jobs and they had
> to make a split second decision. This person could have easily had a bomb
> and if he did the arugument would be why didn't they shoot him before he
> blew up the train.
 
You talk good sense, suzanne.
Thanks.
How good the world would be if they weren't brainwashed into thinking all the Right government proceedings are the decent thing to do.

> they could have used a stun gun and would most likely be alive today (stun
> guns aren't fail safe, but more survivable than being shot in the head 5
> times).

> there is no point in shooting somebody in the head 5 times if they were
> already being tackled by the cops. maybe the adrenaline was running high
> or maybe they wanted a spectacular statement for the papers.

> plus, what would you think if you were in a foreign country and suddenly a
> bunch of people who aren't dressed like the police start running at you
> with a gun? anyone who is somewhat familiar with britain knows that the
> cops generally don't carry guns.
 
My 2 cnets

I don't know all of the facts- but one theory I have heard is that the Brazillian ran away from the plain-clothes Police after they identified themselves as Police because his Visa had expired and he was afraid of being deportd. Now people have quickly forgeotten that 4 Islamic Jihad extremists had just tried blowing up the Undreground and double-decker bus a few days before- and had also done so July 7th- so if people claiming to be Police ask you to stop then it MIGHT be a good idea to do just that. He didn't. He ran away. They shoot to kill because at any instant a real terrorist can blow himself up if he is only shot in the leg or arm or whatever. They are doing their JOB- to protect the innocent. I think people need to give them the benefit of the doubt here considering the circumstances. I feel terrible that an innocent man was killed but I also believe he really could have helped avoid it.

For all of these Islamic Jihad extremists who feel the need to capture innocent victims and videotape themselves severing the heads off of these defenseless tied-up hostages: Why can't they all get together and tie each-other up and hold each other down and cut their own f***ing heads off? And the last guy standing can just blow himself up for the camera. THAT is video we want to see. Also the Islamic Jihad terrorists who feel the need to blow up innocent people in subways, buses, or anywhere else: Round yourselves up all together, find an open space away from the rest of the world, and blow yourselves up for Allah.

Then the world will be a better place.
 
Re: My tuppence

STRMF,
it's a nice thought that all the terrorists line themselves up & kill each other, I agree & first up should be those murdering bastards Bush and Blair, unfortunately that's not going to happen. But we do need a solution as enough innocent lives have been lost. I suggest that we stop killing & bombing in the East & then hopefully they'll stop killing & bombing in the West, it's not rocket science is it but it just might work.

love

Grim

> I don't know all of the facts- but one theory I have heard is that the
> Brazillian ran away from the plain-clothes Police after they identified
> themselves as Police because his Visa had expired and he was afraid of
> being deportd. Now people have quickly forgeotten that 4 Islamic Jihad
> extremists had just tried blowing up the Undreground and double-decker bus
> a few days before- and had also done so July 7th- so if people claiming to
> be Police ask you to stop then it MIGHT be a good idea to do just that. He
> didn't. He ran away. They shoot to kill because at any instant a real
> terrorist can blow himself up if he is only shot in the leg or arm or
> whatever. They are doing their JOB- to protect the innocent. I think
> people need to give them the benefit of the doubt here considering the
> circumstances. I feel terrible that an innocent man was killed but I also
> believe he really could have helped avoid it.

> For all of these Islamic Jihad extremists who feel the need to capture
> innocent victims and videotape themselves severing the heads off of these
> defenseless tied-up hostages: Why can't they all get together and tie
> each-other up and hold each other down and cut their own f***ing heads
> off? And the last guy standing can just blow himself up for the camera.
> THAT is video we want to see. Also the Islamic Jihad terrorists who feel
> the need to blow up innocent people in subways, buses, or anywhere else:
> Round yourselves up all together, find an open space away from the rest of
> the world, and blow yourselves up for Allah.

> Then the world will be a better place.
 
Knowing Theo can't be very bright and clearly has a messed up view of the world for somebody so poower, I'm still amazed to hear he has a Brazilian.

I refuse to read posts concerning him anymore, as I have a life to lead and he has proven beyond doubt that he is a lost cause. Do you think he gets Moz at all? Nah! Don't even bothered answering that.

Maybe he was confused with air removal as an odour solution.




A dirty Ayr duck
 

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