Warsaw - Stodola (Nov. 19, 2014) post-show

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

19 pages AND a video of the whole thing and I'm still none the wiser....

neworder88 · Nov 21, 2014

Anonymous said:
I definitely hear "You're gonna die in Trafford!" (or possibly "traffic"). Which could be interpreted as a death threat, thus the reason given that Moz didn't feel safe. If not "die" then what can the word be? "You're gonna die in Trafford/Traffic"? Or "You're going down in Trafford"? Also - the man shouting sounds rather angry. Another thing is when Morrissey asks "Is that funny?" someone in the crowd answers "No, not funny" so it would seem at least one other person heard the insult.

The 'No' heard on the video is me. I was saying that in response to the fact that someone saying "we miss you in old Trafford" (this is DEFINITELY what was said!) is indeed (as I thought Morrissey was pointing out) not very funny. I'm from Manchester and I travel to see Morrissey to get away from stereotypical idiot mancunians who constantly embarrass themselves and overstate their importance, not just at Morrissey shows, but at all gigs. I believe this is one of the things Morrissey hates about Manchester and I assume we have this in common (the "bed ridden deaf mute" postcard still applies to 2014 Manchester and it's my favourite quote). It's obvious that Morrissey misheard the guy who shouted "we miss you in Old Trafford" because he most DEFINITELY said "we miss you in Old Trafford". I'm a die hard Manchester United fan (probably the only reason I still live in Manchester to be honest) so trust me, I know the words "Old Trafford" when I hear them. I was right at the front and heard nothing untoward at all. It's just crossed wires. "We miss you in old Trafford" would annoy me too but surely Morrissey would take that in his stride? He must have misheard him as the feeling in the room (and from watching back the video) is that Morrissey was responding directly to that

Morrisseys security then made it very unsafe for me and my friends (also from Manchester) as certain people (naming no names) were running around the venue quizzing anyone with a british accent. I have a thick Manchester accent and it was obvious that some people in the venue thought it was me that said "we miss you in Old Trafford". Tonight's show should be a blast and I'm getting ready to leave the hotel as I type, I just hope that there isn't another witchunt as it was very very uncomfortable.

The statement said that Morrissey was "very upset", so I can only hope that his camp have cleared this up to him and he realises that it was just a misunderstanding. There was nothing but love for Morrissey in that room.

chip shop slag · Nov 21, 2014

floodzonex said:
http://www.kelleydrye.com/publications/articles/1477/_res/id=Files/index=0/1477.pdf

This goes a long way towards answering your question. I'm someone who brought up the insurance question earlier. I can tell you that in the industry he is "grudgingly booked." He is usually good for tickets in smaller venues (and a few huge ones in America). This is nothing like first few tours though. That's fine and to be expected. You have to pay for him (40,000 or so for an 1800 seat venue) and last I heard he was asking for another 4-5k for his own catering/personal chef. You read that correctly. The bad news is the promotion of the show. As Morrissey isn't regularly played on the radio and written about on blogs constantly, you don't have built in and free advertising the way you would with a Coldplay or Arctic Monkeys. The promoter or venue has to pay for radio, tv or print ads. They had to turn away other acts that could have played (and not cancelled) on the same date. Whether their fault or not, the venue will be associated with negative press. These are just a few of the reasons Morrissey will have trouble finding a company to insure his tours.

I'm very surprised at the economics of his show. 40k-45k plus t-shirt sales makes say 50k per show. Then he pays the band and expenses, including insurance. I can't see him making more than 10k-15k per show. This is pocket change for him. He's clearly doing this because he loves it, and why would he put up with any abuse.

As someone that is a musical icon and has created some of the greatest music we'll ever hear, he deserves to be treated with respect. I'd walk too.

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

Sambantam82 said:
Yes, I agree with that but this wasn't the phrase I was referring to but the Trafford / traffic comment. If you listen again there is some laughter after this comment and the laughter sounds 'mocking' in its nature. If you give it another listen you might see what I mean.

As for the 'suck it' phrase I'm really not sure someone shouted 'suck it'. Its hard to decipher but I don't think anyone would shout this and it doesn't sound like it. Like you say its not something a Brit would say (similar in the way a Brit would never shout mother*****).

As a northerner, that doesn't sound at all like "suck it". I'm sure he's shouting "stonking". Moz says he'd like to say something and the bloke shouts "stonking" as in great, brilliant.....

Luke Action McClure · Nov 21, 2014

Is the person not trying to predict (or request) that "staircase..." be the next song. Sounds more like a pissed up Polish 'staircase' than 'suck it'...

realitybites · Nov 21, 2014

neworder88 said:
The 'No' heard on the video is me. I was saying that in response to the fact that someone saying "we miss you in old Trafford" (this is DEFINITELY what was said!) is indeed (as I thought Morrissey was pointing out) not very funny. I'm from Manchester and I travel to see Morrissey to get away from stereotypical idiot mancunians who constantly embarrass themselves and overstate their importance, not just at Morrissey shows, but at all gigs. I believe this is one of the things Morrissey hates about Manchester and I assume we have this in common (the "bed ridden deaf mute" postcard still applies to 2014 Manchester and it's my favourite quote). It's obvious that Morrissey misheard the guy who shouted "we miss you in Old Trafford" because he most DEFINITELY said "we miss you in Old Trafford". I'm a die hard Manchester United fan (probably the only reason I still live in Manchester to be honest) so trust me, I know the words "Old Trafford" when I hear them. I was right at the front and heard nothing untoward at all. It's just crossed wires. "We miss you in old Trafford" would annoy me too but surely Morrissey would take that in his stride? He must have misheard him as the feeling in the room (and from watching back the video) is that Morrissey was responding directly to that

Morrisseys security then made it very unsafe for me and my friends (also from Manchester) as certain people (naming no names) were running around the venue quizzing anyone with a british accent. I have a thick Manchester accent and it was obvious that some people in the venue thought it was me that said "we miss you in Old Trafford". Tonight's show should be a blast and I'm getting ready to leave the hotel as I type, I just hope that there isn't another witchunt as it was very very uncomfortable.

The statement said that Morrissey was "very upset", so I can only hope that his camp have cleared this up to him and he realises that it was just a misunderstanding. There was nothing but love for Morrissey in that room.

Thank you. I stand by everything I said previously in this thread. Morrissey is a thin-skinned sissy who needs to grow a spine. Think about it though, even if something offensive had actually been said, why is he so incapable of brushing off an insult directed at him yet so masterful at dishing them out? Pathetic.

Chickpea · Nov 21, 2014

Eurydice said:
I do know, that you can see his physical reaction on that clip and, whether or not something he perceived as offensive was definitely said, it was very heartbreaking to see his face and body shut down like that. I take no joy in seeing anyone get deflated like that and I'm sure that's why his band mates reacted as they did, too. I feel bad for the audience, as well, since they missed out on a full set and may have traveled far (and they all paid to see him), but seeing Morrissey's face in that clip makes me feel very sad that any of this happened...for all parties involved.

Yes, exactly.

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

chip shop slag said:
I'm very surprised at the economics of his show. 40k-45k plus t-shirt sales makes say 50k per show. Then he pays the band and expenses, including insurance. I can't see him making more than 10k-15k per show. This is pocket change for him. He's clearly doing this because he loves it, and why would he put up with any abuse.

As someone that is a musical icon and has created some of the greatest music we'll ever hear, he deserves to be treated with respect. I'd walk too.

After taxes, he's not making bank from touring, especially with his lifestyle

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

realitybites said:
...why is he so incapable of brushing off an insult directed at him yet so masterful at dishing them out? Pathetic.

Someone throw RB a life preserver. She's drowning in irony.

"Help, help David T! Fat, poor, insane CrystalGeezer is traumatizing me!!!"

neworder88 · Nov 21, 2014

"Sissy" or not, he seems to advocate violence when it suits him as it became very eery once the witchunt began and that is the real shame

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

realitybites said:
Thank you. I stand by everything I said previously in this thread. Morrissey is a thin-skinned sissy who needs to grow a spine. Think about it though, even if something offensive had actually been said, why is he so incapable of brushing off an insult directed at him yet so masterful at dishing them out? Pathetic.

A sissy? You are despicable.

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

neworder88 said:
The 'No' heard on the video is me. I was saying that in response to the fact that someone saying "we miss you in old Trafford" (this is DEFINITELY what was said!) is indeed (as I thought Morrissey was pointing out) not very funny. I'm from Manchester and I travel to see Morrissey to get away from stereotypical idiot mancunians who constantly embarrass themselves and overstate their importance, not just at Morrissey shows, but at all gigs. I believe this is one of the things Morrissey hates about Manchester and I assume we have this in common (the "bed ridden deaf mute" postcard still applies to 2014 Manchester and it's my favourite quote). It's obvious that Morrissey misheard the guy who shouted "we miss you in Old Trafford" because he most DEFINITELY said "we miss you in Old Trafford". I'm a die hard Manchester United fan (probably the only reason I still live in Manchester to be honest) so trust me, I know the words "Old Trafford" when I hear them. I was right at the front and heard nothing untoward at all. It's just crossed wires. "We miss you in old Trafford" would annoy me too but surely Morrissey would take that in his stride? He must have misheard him as the feeling in the room (and from watching back the video) is that Morrissey was responding directly to that

Morrisseys security then made it very unsafe for me and my friends (also from Manchester) as certain people (naming no names) were running around the venue quizzing anyone with a british accent. I have a thick Manchester accent and it was obvious that some people in the venue thought it was me that said "we miss you in Old Trafford". Tonight's show should be a blast and I'm getting ready to leave the hotel as I type, I just hope that there isn't another witchunt as it was very very uncomfortable.

The statement said that Morrissey was "very upset", so I can only hope that his camp have cleared this up to him and he realises that it was just a misunderstanding. There was nothing but love for Morrissey in that room.

Why did your little group laugh after the guy said "Old Trafford"? And who said Trafford loves you? She sounded cute.

Also, it seems that this whole thing is your fault then, because he misheard the other guy, and you saying "NO", only backed up what he thought the other guy said. Great job, Ace!

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

That video was just plain sad. You can literally see his body deflate.

Uncleskinny · Nov 21, 2014

Someone pointed out that the New York Dolls, Buzzcocks, Penetration and other of Morrissey's favourite bands took far worse than what was perceived, and carried on. The long and the short of it is this: if he can't fulfil or promise to fulfil dates, for whatever reason, after taking people's money, he should not be touring or doing any dates. Simple as that. Because otherwise, he, the crowd or both are going to be disappointed. If a mishearing of something, for that is what it is, causes him to walk off and let everyone down, then he shouldn't be performing live. I've heard suggestions of his fragile mental state, the perceived mishearing, ill-health.....they may all be reasons, but the top and bottom is that if he cannot promise to fulfil dates, for whatever reason, however true or personal it may be, he should not be touring.

One more thing - if there is a danger of a perception of hearing something offensive, what should be done? Give all ticket-holders, as a condition of their booking, a list of soundalike phrases, places, and other words that are not acceptable to be said? Of course not, so what's the alternative? Belt-up and carry on? Or stop touring?

P.

realitybites · Nov 21, 2014

Anonymous said:
Someone throw RB a life preserver. She's drowning in irony.

"Help, help David T! Fat, poor, insane CrystalGeezer is traumatizing me!!!"

I've taken some of the worst insults and I'm still here. Stalking is a little different from being insulted occasionally. Perhaps you should educated yourself as to the difference.

neworder88 · Nov 21, 2014

Anonymous said:
Why did your little group laugh after the guy said "Old Trafford"? And who said Trafford loves you? She sounded cute.

Also, it seems that this whole thing is your fault then, because he misheard the other guy, and you saying "NO", only backed up what he thought the other guy said. Great job, Ace!

Yeah, it's my fault for clearly and explicitly agreeing with Morrissey. And my "group" certainly did not laugh at the mention of old trafford, it was embarrassing for us

eugenius · Nov 21, 2014

Thank you to the person with the great vantage point that recorded the show.

It's clear that the "offender" yelled out "We miss you in old Trafford" and seconds later, he shouted, "We miss you in Trafford," all while there were other people shouting, whooping, and making enthusiastic noise in general.

Morrissey misunderstood what he heard, that's the simple, correct answer here. He f***ed up.

But it was disgusting to see Boz fall in line with what Morrissey (and I'm sure the tour manager) said to him and go out on stage and make his declarations. I expect that sort of herd mentality from Jesse, but Boz?

It was almost like a scene right out of a Nazi movie: "If we can have the house lights on, we're gonna find the person..." A f***ing Nazi-like witch hunt. And then the band just stands menacing at the lip of the stage, not really sure what they're looking for.

The world of Morrissey has become a complete embarrassment.

realitybites · Nov 21, 2014

eugenius said:
Thank you to the person with the great vantage point that recorded the show.

It's clear that the "offender" yelled out "We miss you in old Trafford" and seconds later, he shouted, "We miss you in Trafford," all while there were other people shouting, whooping, and making enthusiastic noise in general.

Morrissey misunderstood what he heard, that's the simple, correct answer here. He f***ed up.

But it was disgusting to see Boz fall in line with what Morrissey (and I'm sure the tour manager) said to him and go out on stage and make his declarations. I expect that sort of herd mentality from Jesse, but Boz?

It was almost like a scene right out of a Nazi movie: "If we can have the house lights on, we're gonna find the person..." A f***ing Nazi-like witch hunt. And then the band just stands menacing at the lip of the stage, not really sure what they're looking for.

The world of Morrissey has become a complete embarrassment.

That's it in a nutshell.

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

neworder88 said:
"Sissy" or not, he seems to advocate violence when it suits him as it became very eery once the witchunt began and that is the real shame

You don't see Kate Middleton stomping off when she's on the receiving end of Morrissey's abusive comments.

Anonymous · Nov 21, 2014

Belligerent Ghoul said:
Something is being lost here. And please, I am not an enabler of Morrissey or anyone. This appears to be a gut, visceral, passionate, reaction and Morrissey is an extraordinarily sensitive person. A button was pushed albeit by a total stranger. If what was said was "shut up and sing/play" I can absolutely, unequivocally agree with those who said he should have continued. No debate - undermining my own reasoning - and saying 'suck it up, be a man, etc.' Remove the offender and continue the concert.

However, if someone mentioned Manchester, Old Trafford, etc., I think that isn't the same. We have no idea what is going on in Morrissey's head in relation to Manchester. We have no idea what his feelings towards Manchester are. We don't know how his mother, who was ill and recovered, is doing. We do know that he is sick of being always referred to as the former lead singer of The Smiths and in that fashion, and in that way, always being pulled back to Manchester. I'm inclined to think the former would make him pissed but be able to carry on - but that the latter could bring up a tsunami of emotions whereby he simply could not continue.

If he could continue but did not, that's wrong in my mind. If he could not continue...I mean it's not like he could recline on an analyst's couch right there...and so the show ends.

The storm offs, the walk offs, are not new but given how rare they were from when the Smiths ended to say Liverpool (2009), it seems he is growing more thin-skinned. He is older, he is isn't going to change, he is without a record label, his album was pulled after 3 weeks (or he pulled it) because Harvest Records failed to market the album properly, his bass player just left, and he's really concerned about his legacy about how he will be remembered. He doesn't want to go out on this note. You say, XYZ pop star would have soldiered on. I say XYZ pop star would have just as likely gone into recluse mode after all the drama that came before this tour. Why does he tour? To pay Mike Joyce. No. Morrissey's estimated net worth is north of 30 million dollars. He tours for you.

In his own sick way, he's always been true to us. Tell all of my friends...

Some get it, most do not. You do. xx

Warsaw - Stodola (Nov. 19, 2014) post-show

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