Should Morrissey be more civil?

PregnantForTheLastTime said:
Sarah Palin? The former Governor of Alaska, the Sarah Palin who was a candidate for Vice President? Wait, aren't those elected offices?

I specifically said in my post that the Arizona incident was most likely not caused by the rhetorical ugliness that's become the tone of the day. Oh, here:

You're suggesting that Morrissey and Sarah Palin should be held to the same standard of responsibility in their public speech. That's crap. Morrissey's not making laws, nor does he try to. He's not meddling with the economy, or health care, or human rights. He's just singing.
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You need to back off a little bit. I was just simply highlighting the similiar comments made about Sarah Palin. Also, I am not holding Palin and Morrissey to the same standard. That was not my intention and never will be. You seem to agree that Palin did not have a direct link to what happened in Arizona, but you still believe that she should adhere to some higher code of ethics because of the potential "power" she has. It's kind of unfair, noting that other more 'respectable' politicians made worse use of the influence on the public than even she does at times. Palin is much more dismissed than Morrissey is, though some liberal pundits like to think she is more influential than she actually is. And seemingly you are giving her that same power. I am not. Palin doesn't know how to play the political game because she takes issues to a level that is personal which is why she continues to be both appalling some and has arresting appeal to others. I see and partly understand her appeal, but she continues to be appalling to me.
 
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Black Cloud said:
If Theo started watching the Nick Jr. instead of Fox News, would this thread be whether Morrissey needs to have a party in his tummy?
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I watched that entire thing. :straightface: And kinda loved it. :p

Theo's call for civility is coming from Rush Limbaugh. I listen on occassion. He's been asking his listeners to proselytize "reason" in face of this tragedy and has been questioning many liberal media outlets and asking his listeners to do so. It;s a way of drawing attention away from his own campaign of hate rhetoric disguised as a "voice of reason." Even Limbaugh himself has been duped by his own agenda to be reasonable in the face of adversity for the republican party when one of his callers suggested that the little girl who was murdered should have been playing baseball with her friends instead of being brainwashed by her liberal caretakers and brought to the shopping center to begin with, that it was liberals who killed her because she shouldn't have been there. Rush told the caller he had gone too far with that thought. So anyway, not Fox News in this case, Theo's been soaking up Rush and he's attempting to convert us.
 
CrystalGeezer said:
I watched that entire thing. :straightface: And kinda loved it. :p

Theo's call for civility is coming from Rush Limbaugh. I listen on occassion. He's been asking his listeners to proselytize "reason" in face of this tragedy and has been questioning many liberal media outlets and asking his listeners to do so. It;s a way of drawing attention away from his own campaign of hate rhetoric disguised as a "voice of reason." Even Limbaugh himself has been duped by his own agenda to be reasonable in the face of adversity for the republican party when one of his callers suggested that the little girl who was murdered should have been playing baseball with her friends instead of being brainwashed by her liberal caretakers and brought to the shopping center to begin with, that it was liberals who killed her because she shouldn't have been there. Rush told the caller he had gone too far with that thought. So anyway, not Fox News in this case, Theo's been soaking up Rush and he's attempting to convert us.
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I see. So if Theo switched formats and started listening to Classic Rock Radio instead of Talk Radio, he'd be asking if Morrissey needed to put up barriers to keep himself intact.

BTW, the best Yo Gabba Gabba song = this one
 
Oh... f*** off Theo. You bloody tool.
 
Theo said:
In the wake of the Tuscon masacre last week, the Democratic Party in the USA is urging greater civility and a condemnation of the use of violent imagery and rhetoric.

Like Sarah Palin, this left me puzzled (see the thread about it in the Pigsty). But apparently it's because Democrats wanted to pin the blame for the masacre on people who disagree with the Democrat agenda and have dared to exercise their freedom of speech.

Although the Democrats' political opponents turned out to have had nothing whatsoever to do with why the shooter masacred people in Tucson, the Democrats still insist that, in theory, they could have, and they want us to be concerned. Democrats have lots theories about lots of stuff, and they're much smarter than the rest of us, so who are we to question anything they say is true?

The order has come down from above.

We need to watch what we say.

And, if Democrats are to appear sincere in this call for civility, it must apply to everyone, not just people who speak out against policies Democrats are pushing in American politics.

For example, CNN is trying to set an example for us:

[youtube]<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/lt9ulRezH34?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/lt9ulRezH34?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

Therefore, shouldn't Morrissey be asked to tone things down?

For example, here's Morrissey planting the seed in our heads that record executives should be mowed down with a machine gun:

[youtube]<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/1-lvhE-IlDQ?fs=1&start=200&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/1-lvhE-IlDQ?fs=1&start=200&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

Sarah Palin had a map that contained gun sights targeting congressional districts where she wanted her side to win elections, and this...well, it didn't actually have anything to do with why the madman murdered people, in theory it could have planted that seed in his head...you know, if he had been a Tea Partier or something like that - something unlike anything he actually was, but might have been in a parellel universe, or something. And, well...we just want those Tea Partiers to shut up.

So, now that we've found Sarah Palin guilty of mass murder, we need to start policing violent imagery and rhetoric in general, to set a good example for all those crazy Tea Partiers.

Listen to all those Morrissey fans cheer when he whipped them up with that violent imagery! He should be ashamed.
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His hair looks shit hot here!
 
The first step towards tolerating something is through joking about it :p

I hope this doesn't seem moronic or anything, but the man is who he is. Obviously the man doesn't seem to be able to keep a long-term relationship; the record labels just don't want anything to do with him, and vice versa. So I'm not exactly expecting him to win the Nobel Peace Prize. And it might be because I love his music and parts of his persona, but it's not really that either. It's that I don't really care. It would be a bit like gnashing teeth that Miley Cyrus is such a poor role model. In the end, it's not really people like him that are the problem.

I seriously think that there is no big harm in cracking jokes. White power extremists are not winning ground on account of their jokes, the Islam religion was not really harmed by the caricatures but the aftermath. If being able to joke about something points to a lack of humanity, then it's called being honest. I think that is people's biggest objection, that they fear appearing inhumane. But I can't think of a single catastrophic world event caused by jokes. At best, it shows an ability to see both points of view. It might be the way he says it though, it couldn't hurt to be a bit more gentlemanly. But do you seriously think he could inspire any extreme rightists? The man has probably committed way too much sodomy to be able to do that.
 
PregnantForTheLastTime said:
There is a vast difference between an artist running his mouth off in support of his personal political views and a person running for public office....
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Like Morrissey, Sarah Palin is not running for any political office.

The rhetoric of violence doesn't belong in politics, a realm in which people are supposed to be thinking clearly and coming up with the best possible solutions to problems. Shooting your political opponent in the head is not the best possible solution.
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Sarah Palin, a private citizen who holds no public office, is an author of books like Morrissey is an author of songs. Also, like Morrissey, Palin likes to dip her toe into political activism. For example, Morrissey likes to speak out via the True To You web site, and Palin likes to speak out on her Facebook.

Also, for an example, Sarah Palin is concerned about the number of babies who are killed via abortions. But I haven't heard her praising those who bomb abortion clinics or murder doctors who perform abortions. Instead, she sets an example, by taking on the challenge of raising a Down syndrome baby, when so many leftist mothers would rather just have the babies killed to spare them the inconvenience.

Morrissey is tightly tied in with the political organization PETA, and is against eating meat and using animals in experiments to advance medical science.

Here's how Morrissey handles the issue of medical experiments on animals to find treatments for cancer, AIDS, and other horrible diseases:

MORRISSEY, the pop singer and outspoken vegan, has been branded irresponsible for publicly backing violent attacks by extremists against scientists and companies involved in medical research using animals.
The former frontman of the 1980s group the Smiths said he believed terror tactics were justified against those who conducted animal experiments because they had brought it on themselves.

Morrissey also singled out proudly carnivorous television chefs Jamie Oliver and Clarissa Dickson Wright as enemies of the animal rights movement.

***

The singer...made his remarks in an interview with an online fanzine called True to You. He said: “I support the efforts of the Animal Rights Militia (ARM) in England and I understand why fur farmers and so-called laboratory scientists are repaid with violence — it is because they deal in violence themselves and it’s the only language they understand — the same principles that apply to war.”

Morrissey said he approved of such tactics because “you reach a point where you cannot reason with people” who carry out animal experiments. “They (the ARM) are usually very intelligent people who are forced to act because the law is shameful or amoral.”
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Tactics committed by the Morrissey-endorsed Animal Rights Militia include sending mail bombs to the family residences of scientists.

Don't talk to me about the rhetoric if you're unwilling to criticize THAT. Morrissey might influence someone to commit an act of animal rights terrorism with his rhetoric far more so than Palin might with her's. All Palin did was put a target on a congressional disctrict. Morrissey is proudly cheerleading for terrorists.
 
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The language used in the arenas of punditry and politics has been allowed to get way out of hand, to the point that it's actually obstructing the process of governing. The Arizona incident, while probably not directly linked to the specific instances of gun-friendly rhetoric we're now talking about, threw a harsh light on just how ugly--and unproductive--it had all become.
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You only consider it out of hand of late. You weren't saying this for the previous decade.

It was so very productive when Morrissey did this:

MANCHESTER music legend Morrissey sparked controversy when he announced Ronald Reagan's death live on stage during a concert - and then declared he wished it was George Bush who had died instead.
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Apparently the singer was upset that Bush and an international coalition (including the UK under Tony Blair) toppled the genocidal Baath regime of Saddam Hussein.

Okay, but like Sarah Palin noted, we settle these things at the election booths. Does Morrissey not understand democracy?

And how about you? You're suddenly gonna police every time anyone uses a metaphor that is in any way related to war or violence? Good luck.

Morrissey can say anything he wants. I hate to say this, but nobody takes him that seriously, nor should they. He's an artist, an individual citizen who has the full right to say whatever he wants. Nobody's looking to him for political leadership. You can look at him as a friend or a role model or just an artist who introduces a different viewpoint. He's not making decisions for anyone but himself, and he's allowed to be perfectly logical and impartial, completely short-sighted and irrational, or any position in between.
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So, Morrissey gets freedom of speech, but people at Tea Party protests do not? I'm confused. Morrissey is a mainstream pop star and political activist in the UK, and is a somewhat underground but nevertheless famous pop star and political activist in the USA and other countries. Why does he get freedom of speech, but if some powerless, virtually anonymous American citizen holds up a sign against socialiized health care at a Tea Party event, he or she gets called terrible names, like "teabagger" and "racist" and "TERRORIST" by the American Left? And why are those people now being blamed for a Tuscon massacre that they had absolutely nothing to do with?
(The shooter's friends do say, however, that he was into underground Leftist bands such as Anti-Flag.....)


You may say that this is unfair, that he should be held to the same standard as political figures, but you would be wrong. If he were elected to anything, or even hired to report the news, he would have an obligation to consider all sides in a measured and careful way before making the decision that offered the most good to the greatest number of his constituents (or audience), but he hasn't been elected to anything. That's simply not his job.
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Sarah Palin resigned from her public office and is a private citizen, author, reality TV star, and political activist.

The Left talks of "civility" because they are upset that a vast populist movement is rising up against them in America. They attempted to mock this populist movement by calling them obscene names, such as "teabaggers", but that didn't work, as we saw in the last election.

We heard no such calls for "civility", nor did we see anything remotely approaching "civility", from these people until Democrats took power and wanted to ram their agenda through.

Nancy Pelosi told us we'd find out what was in the health care bill only after it was rammed through:

[youtube]<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/KoE1R-xH5To?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/KoE1R-xH5To?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

And now that the American people don't much like it, we're hit with this sort of "civility":

[youtube]<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/s4IHQV4_xA0?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/s4IHQV4_xA0?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

There you see a scuzzball American Leftist calling opponents of Obamacare Nazis just DAYS after he attempted to pin the Tuscon massacre on the "uncivil rhetoric" of his political opponents. Astounding.

I obviously am not calling for Morrissey to tone anything down. I'm wondering why it is that Leftists want to tell some of us we have to tone things down, and why they engaged in this huge McCarthyist propaganda campaign with respect to the Tuscon massacre in order to shut the people up. If you're gonna tell others to be more civil, I'm gonna drag everyone into it.

And I shall enjoy the rhetorical quagmire Leftists have created for themselves after they demanded this greater civility. I don't have to be more civil. Morrissey doesn't have to be more civil. You, however, do, unless you are as big a hypocrite as Congressman Cohen.
 
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morrissey's violent rhetoric is, for the most part, humorous. sarah palin and other far-right tea party types' rhetoric on the other hand panders to racists and the uneducated.
 
this thread :rofl:
having said that :straightface: in answer to the thread's title :o
of course Morrissey should be more civil, we should all be more civil, duh :rolleyes:


ps: but it really must come from within, it cannot be because of external forces acting upon one, people who are like that are just fake :sick:
 
Oh my god said:
this thread :rofl:
having said that :straightface: in answer to the thread's title :o
of course Morrissey should be more civil, we should all be more civil, duh :rolleyes:


ps: but it really must come from within, it cannot be because of external forces acting upon one, people who are like that are just fake :sick:
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Why should Morrissey be more civil? He seems perfectly civil to me.
 
Theo said:
You only consider it out of hand of late. You weren't saying this for the previous decade.

It was so very productive when Morrissey did this:



Apparently the singer was upset that Bush and an international coalition (including the UK under Tony Blair) toppled the genocidal Baath regime of Saddam Hussein.

Okay, but like Sarah Palin noted, we settle these things at the election booths. Does Morrissey not understand democracy?

And how about you? You're suddenly gonna police every time anyone uses a metaphor that is in any way related to war or violence? Good luck.




So, Morrissey gets freedom of speech, but people at Tea Party protests do not? I'm confused. Morrissey is a mainstream pop star and political activist in the UK, and is a somewhat underground but nevertheless famous pop star and political activist in the USA and other countries. Why does he get freedom of speech, but if some powerless, virtually anonymous American citizen holds up a sign against socialiized health care at a Tea Party event, he or she gets called terrible names, like "teabagger" and "racist" and "TERRORIST" by the American Left? And why are those people now being blamed for a Tuscon massacre that they had absolutely nothing to do with?
(The shooter's friends do say, however, that he was into underground Leftist bands such as Anti-Flag.....)




Sarah Palin resigned from her public office and is a private citizen, author, and political activist.

The Left talks of "civility" because they are upset that a vast populist movement is rising up against them in America. They attempted to mock this populist movement by calling them obscene names, such as "teabaggers", but that didn't work, as we saw in the last election.

We heard no such calls for "civility", nor did we see anything remotely approaching "civility", from these people until Democrats took power and wanted to ram their agenda through.

Nancy Pelosi told us we'd find out what was in the health care bill only after it was rammed through:

[youtube]<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/KoE1R-xH5To?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/KoE1R-xH5To?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

And now that the American people don't much like it, we're hit with this sort of "civility":

[youtube]<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/s4IHQV4_xA0?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/s4IHQV4_xA0?fs=1&amp;hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>[/youtube]

There you see a scuzzball American Leftist calling opponents of Obamacare Nazis just DAYS after he attempted to pin the Tuscon massacre on the "uncivil rhetoric" of his political opponents. Astounding.

I obviously am not calling for Morrissey to tone anything down. I'm wondering why it is that Leftists want to tell some of us we have to tone things down, and why they engaged in this huge McCarthyist propaganda campaign with respect to the Tuscon massacre in order to shut the people up. If you're gonna tell others to be more civil, I'm gonna drag everyone into it.

And I shall enjoy the rhetorical quagmire Leftists have created for themselves after they demanded this greater civility. I don't have to be more civil. Morrissey doesn't have to be more civil. You, however, do, unless you are as big a hypocrite as Congressman Cohen.
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Jesus, some Morrissey fans haven't got a clue.
It reminds me when Morrissey was playing a gig in London and an American shouted something like "Morrissey you are god", Morrissey said "you have got to love Americans" then turned around a pulled a funny mocking face
 
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murder and desire said:
Why should Morrissey be more civil? He seems perfectly civil to me.
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like I said, it has to come from within, and I just think that if Morrissey was more civil that it would be because he is happier, not because he was just appeasing people that do not like a lot of the things he says :cool:
see, I, sort of, identify with him and well, I know, that when I just let things not bother me and am nicer, I tend to be more happy, don't you?
thats all man, I'd like for Moz to be more civil, so that I could see him as being more happy with his life
because frankly, in my experience, people who are uncivil all the time, you know the Glenn Becks & Sarah Palins of the world :crazy:
well, I really do not imagine them being very happy, do you?


ps: also, my first comment on this thread was that the whole thing made me laugh, remember? :p
 
Here is how this thread is supposed to work.

1. it has very little to do with Morrissey.

Theo does have a history of bashing Morrissey politically so this isn't totally out of the blue but...

2. It's a trap.

You're supposed to say "NO MORRISSEY CAN SAY WHAT HE WANTS EVEN IF HE WANTS TO KILL THE PRESIDENT!"

Then Theo reveals that you've been had because you think it's okay for a popular artist to have a political opinion that is stated theatrically, but you don't think that the occasion of a shooting is a good time to encourage people to be less civil.

See, he has a similar thread in the pigsty but no one is paying attention to it, so he cobbled together this Morrissey connection and reposted the same thread really.

And you guys are falling for it. :)
 
In the spirit of the new civility, I'd like to say that Sarah Palin has an unfortunate predilection for the glorification of firearms and violent rhetoric. Gabrielle Giffords (who was on Palin's hit list) spoke out against Palin's crosshair map last year, saying "there are consequences to that action." The bullet that ripped through her brain may just be a coincidence, but she felt targeted, there's no doubt about it. When a target gets hit, it's only natural to look to the one who very publicly (and literally) targeted her.

As for Morrissey, he's a famous bigmouth who did, indeed, step over the line of civility quite a few times. I don't know how many hanged DJs we can lay at his feet, but if Margaret did find herself on the guillotine, I think we'd all have Morrissey to blame (or praise, in certain circles). I was at one gig with an angry pro-vivsection contingent that did end in scuffles outside, but it was a relatively minor kerfuffle. Morrissey has been fortunate that his fans are not nearly as heavily armed as Sarah Palin's; the streets could have run red with the blood of record executives, high court judges, celebrity chefs and former Smiths drummers.

If Sarah Palin ever becomes a pop singer, I trust that her fans would understand that she is given to hyperbole, and "don't retreat, reload" works much better as a song lyric than a political exhortation. If Morrissey ever attains any political office (or runs for Prime Minister), I trust that he would be the very model of tact and restraint.






:) ;)
 
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