Fake vinyl - discussion

[everydayslikesunday]

Whilst at a record fair recently, I met a dealer who had the pre Joy Division 7" Warsaw - 'An Ideal For Living' on the Engima label. After some investigating on the web, it appears these records fetch anywhere between £400 to £1000, but interestingly, there have been various replicas made, some of which are very hard to tell from the original. This got me pondering, I would have thought that the cost involved in producing high quality fakes in very limited numbers (you can hardly hardly flood the market as people would get suspicious) wouldn't make it profitable?

It also makes me wonder how many fake Hand in Glove - negative sleeve, Reel around the Fountain and the Meat is Murder live recording ep etc there are out there?

[mick ransommich]

Whilst at a record fair recently, I met a dealer who had the pre Joy Division 7" Warsaw - 'An Ideal For Living' on the Engima label. After some investigating on the web, it appears these records fetch anywhere between £400 to £1000, but interestingly, there have been various replicas made, some of which are very hard to tell from the original. This got me pondering, I would have thought that the cost involved in producing high quality fakes in very limited numbers (you can hardly hardly flood the market as people would get suspicious) wouldn't make it profitable?

It also makes me wonder how many fake Hand in Glove - negative sleeve, Reel around the Fountain and the Meat is Murder live recording ep etc there are out there?

There is a massive fake market for old and 'vintage' items now - I have a vintage Trainer collection.. and have come across quite a few fakes recently.. they will go as far as scuffing them and making old style glue-marks on the soles, etc.. basically - they are really hard to spot. Vinyls are the same. There are loads of fake white labelled test-pressings and promos around - they just take the original labels off and stick the new ones on.
Anyone who buys a Reel Around, Mayking Meat Is Murder or Hand In Glove Negative sleeve should purchase them only with a written history included... some of these items are reputed to number around 25 only - I know 3 people who have at least one of them - how many more of them are floating around? :confused:

[girlunafraid]

There is a massive fake market for old and 'vintage' items now - I have a vintage Trainer collection.. and have come across quite a few fakes recently.. they will go as far as scuffing them and making old style glue-marks on the soles, etc.. basically - they are really hard to spot. Vinyls are the same. There are loads of fake white labelled test-pressings and promos around - they just take the original labels off and stick the new ones on.
Anyone who buys a Reel Around, Mayking Meat Is Murder or Hand In Glove Negative sleeve should purchase them only with a written history included... some of these items are reputed to number around 25 only - I know 3 people who have at least one of them - how many more of them are floating around? :confused:

I agree there's no way I'd buy anything off ebay that I couldn't varify before hand, I almost got stung with a dodgy looking greatest hits promo but was fortunately outbid at the last minute, not lucky for the poor winner though! It is difficult not to get caught up in it though! Of course if you was going to bid £700+ on a 24 year old record you'd want it to look brand new but you'd have to be certain it is a 24 year old record wouldn't you? It's about doing your homework I guess!

love

Grim

[Dave2006]

Can I point you in the direction of a thread I started earlier in Market Place?
http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=86248

A Reel Around The Fountain test pressing on eBay. The seller has just sold a load of Smiths stuff this evening - some nice collectable stuff, but this one stands out...

As I say in the other thread, I've been outbid by this person several times over the last few years so they are a legit collector...looks like they might be wanting to cash it all in.

Short of going to Dundee to look at it, how on earth would you know it was genuine?

[girlunafraid]

Can I point you in the direction of a thread I started earlier in Market Place?
http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=86248

A Reel Around The Fountain test pressing on eBay. The seller has just sold a load of Smiths stuff this evening - some nice collectable stuff, but this one stands out...

As I say in the other thread, I've been outbid by this person several times over the last few years so they are a legit collector...looks like they might be wanting to cash it all in.

Short of going to Dundee to look at it, how on earth would you know it was genuine?

well if I was bidding over £700 I'd want to check it out before paying for it, that's why I wouldn't buy it off ebay. Although seeing has I live in Scotland, yes I's go up to Dundee to look at it!

love

Grim

[mick ransommich]

Can I point you in the direction of a thread I started earlier in Market Place?
http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=86248

A Reel Around The Fountain test pressing on eBay. The seller has just sold a load of Smiths stuff this evening - some nice collectable stuff, but this one stands out...

As I say in the other thread, I've been outbid by this person several times over the last few years so they are a legit collector...looks like they might be wanting to cash it all in.

Short of going to Dundee to look at it, how on earth would you know it was genuine?

..Just to add lads - this one is genuine.....the Dundee seller is my mate Gary!! :)

(*note to Gary* - selling this item is a sign - that toddler must be costing you a fortune!! ;))

[Dave2006]

Although seeing has I live in Scotland, yes I's go up to Dundee to look at it!


Well, I'm in Manchester, so a visit is out of the question...If I were to bid and win it then I might be tempted to collect and bring it safely back to its spiritual home in Manchester.

Mind you, if I don't win it will no doubt go to someone in Japan, or California and not Stretford :(


..Just to add lads - this one is genuine.....the Dundee seller is my mate Gary!! :)


It's an unorthodox provenance, but it's good enough for me :)

I was bidder 4 but I was fairly sure I'd be outbid. I need to discuss it further with everyone who owes me money...
Currently at £970. With a week to go. Gulp :(

[vivabob]

im with grim if your parting with £700 then you want to check what your getting - although this isnt always the case but its always better to try e-bay is full of rip offs especially the signed stuff , i know i have bought some shit off ebay , passes, fan-zines etc and been ripped off but i have to be honest for a couple of quid it doesnt bother me, £700 and i would have the staney out

[nowherefast944]

is the hand in glove Neg sleeve record different from the regular Hand in Glove record?

[mick ransommich]

Well, I'm in Manchester, so a visit is out of the question...If I were to bid and win it then I might be tempted to collect and bring it safely back to its spiritual home in Manchester.

Mind you, if I don't win it will no doubt go to someone in Japan, or California and not Stretford :(



It's an unorthodox provenance, but it's good enough for me :)

I was bidder 4 but I was fairly sure I'd be outbid. I need to discuss it further with everyone who owes me money...
Currently at £970. With a week to go. Gulp :(

These big rare vinyls 'do the rounds' quite a bit. In my experience, having a large collection is a phase that we go through. I collected for many years before deciding to sell- there comes a point when you think 'what am I doing this for??' Then no sooner you sell everything, you feel hollow...and wish you hadnt done it!
The vinyl in question will probably sell for £1100 - £1300. (They have gone higher than that). On the face of it - that's good money for a piece of plastic... but the seller was proud to have such a rare item, it carries a kind of kudos having a Top 5 collectable.... and will be sad to see it go.

[Walkers Crisp]

The last "Reel Around The Fountain" TP I followed sold for 450 GBP in September 06. I should have made more of an effort then...:(.

[Kewpie]

is the hand in glove Neg sleeve record different from the regular Hand in Glove record?


Hand In Glove negative sleeve threads:

http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=47902

http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=63008

http://forums.morrissey-solo.com/showthread.php?t=70937

[Walkers Crisp]

Thanks, Kewpie, for digging up those old threads - especially the second one is highly enlightening and offers a good explanation why the "Real Around The Fountain" TP auctioned in September 06 (which i think was offered by the same guy mentioned in the thread) didn't do very well...